Thread: FDNY & DUI's

  1. #1
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Posts
    90

    Default FDNY & DUI's

    What is the current media fascination with FDNY members being charged with DUI? And why is this website posting these negative articles? Granted, the bloom is off the rose, but a guy's business outside of the firehouse is his own business. Short of the member being involved in an on-duty incident or accident while intoxicated, I really don't care to see this published.

  2. #2
    Forum Member
    DeputyChiefGonzo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2000
    Location
    Somewhere between genius and insanity!
    Posts
    13,584

    Default

    One reason: it sell newspapers!

    The New York Post and the Daily News are tabloids that just half a rung above the National Enquirer
    ‎"The education of a firefighter and the continued education of a firefighter is what makes "real" firefighters. Continuous skill development is the core of progressive firefighting. We learn by doing and doing it again and again, both on the training ground and the fireground."
    Lt. Ray McCormack, FDNY

  3. #3
    Forum Member
    Bones42's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2001
    Location
    Pt. Beach, NJ
    Posts
    10,687

    Default

    Who needs the media...just watch Rescue Me.
    "This thread is being closed as it is off-topic and not related to the fire industry." - Isn't that what the Off Duty forum was for?

  4. #4
    MembersZone Subscriber
    Diane E's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 1998
    Location
    Maryland (but always a Long Islander first)
    Posts
    1,103

    Default

    You ask why? I ask why not? Obviously there's a problem that needs to be addressed and if these arrests and articles deter some people from drinking and driving then it's a good thing. God forbid one of these guys had hit and killed someone (as I recall has happened in the past with police officers). Remember -- the general public hold firefighters in a higher regard, so it's "shocking" when we make mistakes or use poor judgement!

    On Long Island, it's parents driving drunk with their little kids or buying drugs with them.....Shock sells. It's rare when you read or see good news!

    A "guy's business outside of the firehouse is his own business" -- I think it's everyone's business if it's illegal and they're caught! Get these guys some help -- where are their co-workers, friends, and family? Wake up folks! Next they'll be drinking on the job at the firehouse....Oh wait......

    It only takes a few bad seeds, that's the saddest part.
    "When I was young, my ambition was to be one of the people who made a difference in this world. My hope is to leave the world a little better for my having been there."
    -- Jim Henson (1936 - 1990)

  5. #5
    MembersZone Subscriber

    Join Date
    May 1999
    Location
    Here, There, Everywhere
    Posts
    4,191

    Default

    DianeC,

    Why Not? Are you kidding me? Obvious problem? You must be joking.

    Do you (and the rest of the public) just figure why not publish guys names and pics for anything? How many wall street stock brokers who are managing your retirement funds and investments were pulled over for DUI last night, how many school teachers, how many Sanitationmen? You can't tell me because it wasn't in the news! What are the odds that DianeC if she makes a mistake will be on ANY page of the paper? They are the same odds that the Red Sox will win the WS this year.

    The issue isn't that they did something wrong, it is that when they do we get front page stories. No one short of politicans and celebirites gets that kind of scrutiny. You don't see, Insurance agent Bob from East Meadow LI got a DUI last night.

    I'll have you note in the highly competive NY Press these media whores are completely reckless with how they conduct business here. Recently a FFs photo was plastered all over the paper for supposedly beating up his girl and having illegal weapons... as it turns out the womans story was mostly made up, an argument did occur, however 3 days prior to calling the police and the weapons they belived weren't his but probably hers. He was leaving her and she was despondent that he was moving out.

    Did you ever see a two page spread about how it really wasn't him who made the mistake but her who filed a false report? No you didn't. In their rush for the "scoop" they completely mischaraterized the incident.

    The POST refused to release the name of the woman who made a false claim of rape(misdemeanor) for an entire week. Then publishes a half page photo of her with her face blurred(what morals they have at the post) with the caption above "FIRST PHOTO" as if they had captured the lochness monster on film!(that is debatable) You would have you be a deaf, dumb and blind moron not to see what their motives are.

    These guys are just firemen, not angles, not some supernatural being that is above making mistakes. We are Blue collar workers period. I know many, even on here, seem to take the view this job is some high moral calling that requires all members to be priestly for what ever reason. Trust me...you don't want that image.

    The only people who held us in a higher regard was the Media and the public. Now the same people(general public, media etc.) who put us on a pedestal have this deep seated desire to tear us down from some pedestal that we didn't want to be placed on and we really don't think we are on to begin with. And for what?... a paltry salary that can barely pay the bills?

    We still think we are just firemen. We are just normal guys with normal faults and normal everyday ambitions, like to be able to pay the morgage this month, to get formula for the kid or diapers...etc.

    Your thinking is what is wrong with this country. I don't know what it is rooted in, but perhaps it comes from some desire to see someone who was regarded by you as perfect, screw up and make a mistake. Putting someone else in a bad light which makes you feel better about yourself and your own faults.

    Diane, obviously the only "problem" that needs to be addressed isn't with us, it is with you who thinks that in an organization of 11,000 men all of them will always make the right decision or always have the right answer. It is you who desires to see blue collar guys dragged through the mud for your own self gratification and reading pleasure.

    Currently we are minor celebrities, but in time people forget. (the city has already forgot 9-11 and many citizens have forgotten as well) Our celebrity will fade and the sooner the better because none of us wants this or really want to deal with it, with our $54,000 yr jobs. We have enough headaches as it is.

    Go renew your subscription to that rag the Post and enjoy as they drag everyone, including my brothers in the mud.

    FTM-PTB

  6. #6
    MembersZone Subscriber
    Diane E's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 1998
    Location
    Maryland (but always a Long Islander first)
    Posts
    1,103

    Default

    Gee, you don't have to get so nasty. Glad to see you think you know me because of one posting. People are entitled to their opinions, open your eyes and be enlightened.

    "Diane, obviously the only "problem" that needs to be addressed isn't with us, it is with you who thinks that in an organization of 11,000 men all of them will always make the right decision or always have the right answer. It is you who desires to see blue collar guys dragged through the mud for your own self gratification and reading pleasure."
    There are women there, too. Very few, but they are there. And I have no desire to see anyone dragged through the mud, I have friends there and in the police dept. And in many other large fire departments across the East Coast.

    If you actually read my last sentence, I said a few seeds ruin it -- where are the 10,950 or so good seeds? I agree that the media is into negative press, heck Newsday (Suffolk County edition) is so Democratic it's unnerving. And they love to report on the fire districts with embezzlement problems. Write to them, find a reporter that will do good news -- they do exist believe it or not. Be proactive.

    I was just pointing out that sometimes the FDNY is regarded as "holier then thow" -- who created that image? I see it in my own neck of the woods in Suffolk County, my own FD, and where I went to college.

    And for what it's worth, I will never get caught driving drunk because I won't be driving after drinking in the first place. I know my limit and if I go over, I have friends I can count on for a ride home. Also, people get their name in the paper out here all the time for driving drunk (I referenced that in my previous post).

    And finally, the only "Post" I read is The Washington Post, which I believe is in a slighter higher regard then the media you mentioned.

    Stop ranting and do something about the negativity! Do something positive. Don't be mad at me because I happen to think that maybe if a few people driving ILLEGALLY get caught and get their name in the news it will prevent others from doing it or it will get them help.

    I'd suggest you reply to my IM or whatever it is as to not upset the webteam.
    Last edited by DianeC; 09-10-2004 at 04:06 PM.
    "When I was young, my ambition was to be one of the people who made a difference in this world. My hope is to leave the world a little better for my having been there."
    -- Jim Henson (1936 - 1990)

  7. #7
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Dec 2002
    Posts
    49

    Default

    And for what it's worth, I will never get caught driving drunk, I know my limit and if I go over, I have friends I can count on.
    Glad to hear you're better connected than the blue collar slobs on the FDNY. I'd rather you didn't drink and drive at all.

    Yes. I did twist your words..funny isn't it...

  8. #8
    MembersZone Subscriber
    Diane E's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 1998
    Location
    Maryland (but always a Long Islander first)
    Posts
    1,103

    Default

    Yeah, I laughed all the way to the edit button.

  9. #9
    MembersZone Subscriber

    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    Westlake, Ohio
    Posts
    451

    Default

    While I certainly don't condone drunk driving, I think it's disgusting how the New York Post and the Daily News are forever splashing stories about firefighters over their front pages. Members of the FDNY are not highly paid actors or sports figures who expected to be hounded by the press when they took their jobs. They're professional men and women who were placed into the limelight through a horrific event, and they should be left alone. They have been through enough, and they certainly don't deserve to have the good name of the organization to which they belong dragged through the mud.

  10. #10
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Posts
    17

    Default FDNY/DUI

    I was considering starting a thread about this topic a while back. Being a member of the FDNY is considered an honor and those who belong to such a great (high profile) department are held to the same high standards as celebrities and sports stars. I think that it is a shame that the media exposes the few members of the FDNY that are caught misbehaving. Think about it... tens of thousands of firefighter's belong to one fire department. Of course there are going to be a few members that are going to have moments of bad judgement. But why must the media continue to display the negative when there are so many positive/heroic things the firefighters of NYC are doing on a daily basic. Yes, it sells a few papers... but why not start exposing the elite politicians, lawyers, and doctors that also misbehave. Yes, firefighters are human... and we make mistakes. Unfortuately, the press wants to make an easy buck at the expense of a few bad apples in the big apple.

  11. #11
    MembersZone Subscriber

    Join Date
    Jul 1999
    Location
    Flanders, NJ
    Posts
    13,537

    Default

    Being a member of the FDNY is considered an honor and those who belong to such a great (high profile) department are held to the same high standards as celebrities and sports stars.
    I thnk that is the point. Why should they be? They are no better than a NYPD member, a Boston FD member or a Podunk Volunteer FD member. They are not special. They are not celebrities and they are not superstars. They are everyday human beings just like you and me.

    Yet, if a member of Anytown FD gets locked up for DUI, nary a word is in the papers. In NYC, you will not see a single column inch devoted to a cop or EMT, or teacher, or nurse, or whatever other blue collar job you want to name who happens to get caught driving drunk. And believe me, it happens every day.

    I am not for censoring info. I am for trating FDNY people like the everyday people they are.

  12. #12
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Posts
    17

    Default FDNY DUI

    Members of the FDNY don't ask to be placed in the spotlight or to be hailed as heroes. They were unwillingly thrown there after the tragic events of 9-11. Just like every firefighter (regardless of which dept.), they are proud of their profession and to be a part of a tradition that comes with being a member of the fire service.

    I personally have a high amount of respect for the FDNY, being one of the busiest and largest fire departments in the world... and doing it for ridiculous salary. But, as a career firefighter, I also look up to every other firefighter that has dedicated himself to the fire service and to his brother's/sister's, and to their families both on the job and retired.

    To the Media: Let's stop exposing firefighter's flaws and start highlighting their acts of heroism and sacrifices.

    Be safe all...

    "Still the Greatest Job in the World!"

  13. #13
    Forum Member
    RspctFrmCalgary's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Location
    Now in Victoria, BC. I'm from beautiful Jasper Alberta in the heart of the Can. Rockies - will always be an Albertan at heart!
    Posts
    6,329

    Default Ask and ye shall receive

    September 11th - Never Forget

    I respect firefighters and emergency workers worldwide. Thank you for what you do.

    Sheri
    IACOJ CRUSTY CONVENTION CHAIR
    Honorary Flatlander

    RAY WAS HERE FIRST

  14. #14
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Jan 1999
    Location
    MA
    Posts
    1,744

    Default Un-believable Bias

    Did anyone read the NY Post article about the so-called sex caper?

    Did anyone?

    Did you notice the last line of the article?

    "Since Jan. 1, 2004" XX "members of the FDNY have been arrested for DWI" (I left out the number, so as not to fuel the freakin fire)

    What does that have to do with the story? The story wasn't about alcohol abuse, it was about something else entirely. (mostly BS, but thats a different matter). Secondly, arrested does not equal convicted. Do these papers publish a second article if the guy is found innocent?

    Leave 'em alone, let them do their jobs. Just like everyone else.

  15. #15
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    May 2004
    Location
    Eastern Central Kansas
    Posts
    845

    Default

    What someone does on his personal time that is criminal, is not just his business, it is public record in the state that I live in, if you get a dui off duty, dont be surprised when you get ripped for it. I dont care how it happens, if you drive drunk, you dont belong in the fd. period. Also if they dont want all the negativity, dont drink and drive.
    FF I
    FF II
    Hazmat Operations
    EMT-B
    ---------------------------------------------------

    The light at the end of the tunnel has been temporarly shut off due to the current work load. The Mangement

    When all else fails USE DUCT-TAPE!!!

    My views posted in this fourm are my personal views only and do not reflect on any agencies that I am afiliated with.

  16. #16
    MembersZone Subscriber
    bolivas203's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Brighton, CO USA
    Posts
    96

    Default

    In some cases it does involve the FD directly. If the Joe FF happens to drive Department vehicles as part of his duties, then it will definitely impact the Department since getting a DUI is grounds for losing ones license (at least here in CO). If Joe FF loses his license, then he can no longer engineer/chauffer. This poses a logistical problem for the Department only though. It is not of concern to the media. I do not believe that the local papers should be blasting FF's on the front page.

    On a side note. Our local paper posts names/dates/time/location of people that get arrested for DUI's, but never have I seen anyone's profession included in the articles.
    Stay alert and be safe.

  17. #17
    MembersZone Subscriber

    Join Date
    Jul 1999
    Location
    Flanders, NJ
    Posts
    13,537

    Default

    Originally posted by CaptainMikey
    What someone does on his personal time that is criminal, is not just his business, it is public record in the state that I live in, if you get a dui off duty, dont be surprised when you get ripped for it. I dont care how it happens, if you drive drunk, you dont belong in the fd. period. Also if they dont want all the negativity, dont drink and drive.
    What do you do for a living? How about you lost your job for a mistake that you made while you were not working at that job? I have long said that if you are convicted of a felony, you should forfeit your job. But DUI? Get real.

  18. #18
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Jan 1999
    Location
    MA
    Posts
    1,744

    Default

    What someone does on his personal time that is criminal, is not just his business, it is public record in the state that I live in, if you get a dui off duty, dont be surprised when you get ripped for it.
    Then every stockbroker, Police Officer, sanitation worker, Bus Driver, School Teacher, etc etc etc better expect to receive the same treatment. This clearly isn't the case here. Furthermore, there used to be a difference between ARRESTED and CONVICTED. In this case these people are being CONVICTED in the court of public opinion, regardless of the outcome of their court case.

  19. #19
    MembersZone Subscriber
    bolivas203's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Brighton, CO USA
    Posts
    96

    Default

    Originally posted by GeorgeWendtCFI


    What do you do for a living? How about you lost your job for a mistake that you made while you were not working at that job? I have long said that if you are convicted of a felony, you should forfeit your job. But DUI? Get real.

    If your job involves driving a company/department vehicle, I can see an arguement for termination.

    If you can no longer drive, you can't do your job.
    You can't do your job, you get fired.

    Although I would like to see an alternative such as demotion from engineer back to firefighter and have the offender partake in alchohol classes to remind him/her of his/her Stupid actions.

    One's profession should not factor into the deciplinary actions unless it negatively affects one's ability to perform one's job related duties. For example. If this guy had a job driving a bread truck, I could see him losing his job since he can no longer drive the bread truck.

    But as I stated earlier, this should not be blasted across the front pages just because he is FDNY.
    Stay alert and be safe.

  20. #20
    MembersZone Subscriber

    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Posts
    4

    Default irony

    I think part of the reason people are shocked by FFs getting DUIs is because of the carnage FFs see as a result of drunk driving. Isn't is surprisig to us when we see the hospital employees smoking near the ambulance entrance? Especially respiratory techs who spend much of their day working with COPD patients? It is a shock to see people engaging in "risky" activities like driving drunk or smoking when they are constanyl confronted with the negative consequences of those activities.

    That said, I don't think it's fair that the press exploits FDNY. It is clear that they think tarnishing their angelic image is a great way to sell papers.

  21. #21
    Forum Member
    len1582's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2002
    Location
    N.J.
    Posts
    1,392

    Default

    I find it strange that there are so many FF's arrested and in the press for DUI but nothing about police officers being grabbed for the same thing,with one exception where there was a death involved.I guess that couldn't be covered up. There are 3 or 4 times more cops than FF's there, and none of them drink?

  22. #22
    Forum Member
    Bones42's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2001
    Location
    Pt. Beach, NJ
    Posts
    10,687

    Default

    FFs see as a result of drunk driving
    maybe if it's publicised enough (for all departments, not just FDNY), we'll stop doing it?
    "This thread is being closed as it is off-topic and not related to the fire industry." - Isn't that what the Off Duty forum was for?

  23. #23
    MembersZone Subscriber
    E229Lt's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2000
    Posts
    2,987

    Default

    There are 3 or 4 times more cops than FF's there, and none of them drink?
    They are the same as us, some drink. And, like us, when duty calls, some make the ultimate sacrifice!

    The politics of it all mean nothing, it is the duty and dedication of the vast majority which sets them apart from the rest:

    The man accused of killing two police detectives in Brooklyn has been charged with murder after reportedly confessing to the crime.

    Marlon Legere, 29, faces two counts of first degree murder in the shooting deaths of detectives Robert Parker and Patrick Rafferty.

    Rafferty and Parker were shot and killed Friday night while responding to a domestic disturbance call at the home of Legere's mother in East Flatbush. The woman said she was in fear for her life.

  24. #24
    MembersZone Subscriber

    Join Date
    Jul 1999
    Location
    Flanders, NJ
    Posts
    13,537

    Default

    And Lou, the Daily News will treat hm with more respect than cops and FF charged with DUI.

  25. #25
    Forum Member
    HeavyRescueTech's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Location
    New Jersey
    Posts
    2,460

    Default

    DUI while on duty? yeah, that's a huge deal, and firefighters should be fire for it. same with any public safety officer (police, dispatcher, EMT, etc).

    DUI off duty? none of the FD's bussiness. it's not different than any civilian being pulled over for DUI, unless the FF is in uniform or representing the department in any way (ie, a chief officer pulled over for DUI in a chief's car but not on a call).

    now, if you are convicted of a felony, then I can see the argument to lose your job, especially in the public safety arena. after all, it's hard to maintain the public's trust. however, DUI isn't a felony.
    If my basic HazMat training has taught me nothing else, it's that if you see a glowing green monkey running away from something, follow that monkey!

    FF/EMT/DBP

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts

Log in

Click here to log in or register