1. #1
    MembersZone Subscriber

    Join Date
    Dec 2002
    Location
    Rural Iowa
    Posts
    3,106

    Default SAFER, who is actually going to use it?

    The merits (or lack of) have been discussed. The Constitutionality (or lack thereof) have been discussed. Increasing control over (funding of), and the associated negatives, for local fire depts by the feds has been discussed. Looks like it is going to happen. House and Senate have both funded, now to conference for the details.

    So is your dept/gov't body likely to apply for/use SAFER? Perhaps 3 potential "markets" for SAFER. SAFER max $100000 payable on sliding scale over 4 years of a 5 year program.

    1. Big city/paid dept - IAFF pushing for SAFER as a way to buy more members with fed $ (increased influence/power). Cities presumable are now financing what they think they can afford or need in fire protection/service. Many of these city used COPS or were "burned" by COPS. Bush admin. to be expected to structure the program (as COPS) to allow Fed $ to fund the existing headcount as happened with COPS? Are cities going to be able come up with $ to add new headcount? Grant apparently is something like 25-30% of the cost of fireman in NY over the 5 year life of a grant. Maybe somewhat more in other cities. SAFER going work here?

    2. Midmarket city/combo dept - Are buying the ISO rating they want or can afford. Maybe a few full timers. Much of the budget goes into equipment upgrades vs. salary. New $ as likely to for equipment upgrades as anything else. Are they going to dig up $ to add paid guy 24/7. Or add a 2nd/3rd man on shift?

    3. Small city/rural/vol dept. No paid at present. New $ go to equipment upgrades. Are they going to come find $ for a paid fireman 40hr/week? Potentially BIG payoff if they do in ISO. Real world big payoff in having manned station for fire or EMS calls.

    What market are you in? Do you see your community using safer? Big variable is manpower cost per year.

    My market is at the tail end; small city/rural/vol. I would be enthusiasticlly jump at a SAFER grant if could put a man in station 40hr/week. Would do some very creative work to find grant $, fundraising to make it happen. Would ignore the constitutionality problem (as in writing a Fire Grant) in order to improve our community. A max $100000 SAFER grant would fund over 70% of my cost to hire a FF2/EMT for 5 years. But we can't do it as the program currently stands. The salary reimbursement now is set up on a sliding scale (90/80/50/30/0). Yr1 easy, local $ = 10%; Yr2 local$= 20%; BUT in Yr3 local$ = 50%; Yr4 local$ = 70% (impossible) Yr5 local$ = 100%. Someone smoking crack (and didn't watch COPS) thinks then keep guy on staff forever.

    Appears to me that restructuring SAFER more like the Fire Grant program (and please turn it over to the same administrators) in order to spread $ out to smaller cities will have a bigger payoff. Adding a 4th (or 3rd) man per engine in large cities is very very expensive when multipled by 4 shifts x __ stations. How many new men are required to bring the FD in you city up to NFPA manning? x annual cost per man. Any improvement in ISO rating? In vol. (or combo) dept immediate payback of adding men.
    Last edited by neiowa; 09-28-2004 at 01:25 PM.

  2. #2
    MembersZone Subscriber
    fallujahff's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2002
    Location
    Eastern Shore, Va.
    Posts
    337

    Default

    Is that $100k per year for all the firefighters hired or is that 100k max for 5 years--

    In my state FF's start with a range of $20 to $45k--

    That may work around here for a little while-(rural FD)-but I can see the job drying up with the funding. Probably help the municipal FD's a little better in my state.

    We'll see---

  3. #3
    Forum Member
    Bones42's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2001
    Location
    Pt. Beach, NJ
    Posts
    10,702

    Default

    In my community and those around me, I see a zero benefit from SAFER. We are volunteer, the surrounding area is volunteer. SAFER would put 1 guy on paid (actually be 3 but only 1 on at a time) and that would benefit us by 0. Besides the fact that after year 1, our budget would get reduced to cover the salaries.
    "This thread is being closed as it is off-topic and not related to the fire industry." - Isn't that what the Off Duty forum was for?

  4. #4
    MembersZone Subscriber

    Join Date
    Dec 2002
    Location
    Rural Iowa
    Posts
    3,106

    Default

    Originally posted by jatkins7011
    Is that $100k per year for all the firefighters hired or is that 100k max for 5 years--
    Max of $100000 per position spread over 4 years (must hire for 5 years min.). I have not seen anything that sets a max # of positions (total grant) for a given Fire Dept. I assume NY could hire 1000 new guys if they wanted and could fund.

  5. #5
    Forum Member
    ThNozzleman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Location
    Jefferson City, TN
    Posts
    4,339

    Default

    Although there is nothing definite from the "higher-ups", I'm almost positive we will apply. Four years seems to be an adequate time period to come up with funding to support the new positions, if the city management uses some common sense when they apply. Yeah, I know; I used the words "city management" and "common sense" in the same sentence.

  6. #6
    MembersZone Subscriber

    Join Date
    Dec 2002
    Location
    Rural Iowa
    Posts
    3,106

    Default

    No one else expecting to apply for SAFER.

  7. #7
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    May 2000
    Location
    Ga. Power Co./ Juliette Ga
    Posts
    437

    Default

    My volunteer dept is expecting to apply for SAFER grant. We are located 50 miles south of Atlanta. With the SAFER grant we will be able to have a "paid fire fighter" several years sooner than we anticipated.

  8. #8
    MembersZone Subscriber

    Join Date
    Dec 2002
    Location
    Rural Iowa
    Posts
    3,106

    Default

    Flochief

    How are you going to come up with payroll $ for year 3, 4, 5? Special tax accessment, cut current spending on ____?

  9. #9
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    May 2000
    Location
    Ga. Power Co./ Juliette Ga
    Posts
    437

    Default

    We are real close (maybe 1-3 years out to getting a full time person anyway). Our budget has been increasing for the past few years. We should be able to handle this with no problem.

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts

Log in

Click here to log in or register