A few months back, my crew was dispatched to a man caught in a Cheese Grater. Upon arriving on scene, found pt with left arm entangled in a 12ft long Stainless Steel Auger, which was in a Stainless Steel trough, rising to 15ft from ground.
We were faced with a lack of knowledge for Extricating from Machinery, not being sure what was about to become, we hit out immediately for mutual aid. In the end we completed the job in house.
Now my point (sorry), are there any courses to be taken on other than Vehicles, we have a large industrial park, and incidents are increasing. Specifically in the Northeast, nothing against anywhere else, it just closer.
Any information would be helpful,
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Thread: Industrial Extrication
09-21-2004, 11:12 PM #1
Industrial ExtricationA positive attitude may not solve all your problems, but it will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort.
09-21-2004, 11:28 PM #2
- Join Date
- Jul 2001
- Not the end of the earth but I can see it from here...
Check out this website. The Farmedic program deals more with farm machinery, but I'd bet that most of the concepts would carry over to industrial machinery. Or maybe they have a similar course for industry. Anyway, it might be a place to start.
My former chief took the course and said it was excellent. He pointed out that whereas most vehicles are built pretty light and tend to come apart and crumple in an accident, heavy equipment generally doesn't give much. Extrication with this type of equipment often involves disassembly of the machine versus the cutting and prying of "traditional" extrication.
Last edited by dmleblanc; 09-21-2004 at 11:45 PM.
09-22-2004, 09:31 AM #3
I think that dmleblanc gave you about the best answer. Farm & Industrial are very similar. They will both usually involve disassembly of the involved equipment.
Sometimes you have to manually operate the equipment in the reverse direction (which kinda goes against what we are normally taught)
Also a good OSHA Lockout - Tagout class will be very useful.
A few major points to remember that cover both of these (and many other) situations.
1) Isolate & remove the power source from the device.
2) Isolate & lockout the controls to the device.
If you cannot physically lock these (with padlocks from YOUR kit that YOU hold the keys to) then you need to station as many of YOUR people at these points to control them.
3) Don't be "proud" - call in the experts. Almost any industrial plant has a maintenance person (or persons) they know the equipment better than you. Call them and get their input on how & where to start disassembly. In a Farm environment - contact one of the local Tractor Sales/Repair facilities. They have the knowledge AND the tools for this. Note - the farmer(s) on scene may be knowledgeable about the equipment and you shouldn't discount their input, however they are sometimes too emotionally involved to give sound rational advice.
4) If it looks like a long event don't be afraid to call for a Doc / Surgeon to be brought to the scene (contact your local Level I trauma center ahead of time & find out what resources like this they have)
Hmm - that's all I can come with off the top of my (sleepy) head right now, but I know there are tons more.
Start with a Farm machinery class & a Lockout / Tagout class and you'll have a good foundation to build on.
Last edited by N2DFire; 09-22-2004 at 09:35 AM.Take Care - Stay Safe - God Bless
09-22-2004, 04:03 PM #4
- Join Date
- Jul 2004
- KS, USA
You might also want to use your pre-incident planning as a chance to check out any probable pieces of equiptment that will be a major danger and contact the manufacturer and see if they have any manuals or emergency disassembly instructions they can provide. This may even be something that the companies in your area have on file from when they purchased these pieces of equiptment.
09-22-2004, 06:27 PM #5
- Join Date
- Jan 2003
- Houston, TX
Speaking from the industry side of the fence, most manufacturers (sp?) don't plan for or engineer any "emergency disassembly" items. Right or wrong, they expect (and reasonably so) the end users to follow proper safety proceedures. Some would say to follow OSHA, but keep in mind that they write "minimum" guidelines.
I am a safety and fire protection engineer. I also Volunteer for my local department. Someone mentioned using a "guard" at the power supplies. I really doubt (but I am sure SOMEONE will prove me wrong) OSHA would give much credit for this.
In my opinion, we (the fire service) will HAVE to rely on the staff maintenance personel, management, and any local vendors. They will know how to move parts of the machinery without introducing new hazards.
I think this is a great topic and one that I would like to see more information on. I plan on looking at the aforementioned website for farm extrication and seeing what applies.
09-22-2004, 09:37 PM #6
- Join Date
- Feb 2003
Remember to look for all sources of power.
Electric, pneumatic, hydraulic, mechanical stored energy, etc.
Just a thought or two.
09-23-2004, 06:00 PM #7
Very good suggestions so far. Definitely consult with the maintenance personnel on scene...... That is, unless they are your patient....... (Don't laugh, it happens) Definitely make sure you have your own lock-out/tag-out kit to use.
Also check to verify that there are no "back-up" power sources such as generators........ If there are make sure you secure them also.....
09-23-2004, 10:28 PM #8
- Join Date
- Dec 2003
Reiterating the suggestion to investigate FARMEDIC training. There is collateral info. that would help during an industrial rescue. In fact, there is likely a presenter near you. The website is FARMEDIC.comDeveloper and Sr. Presenter, Team Xtreme
BIG RIG RESCUE
09-24-2004, 12:23 PM #9Someone mentioned using a "guard" at the power supplies. I really doubt (but I am sure SOMEONE will prove me wrong) OSHA would give much credit for this.
OSHA allows for a simple "Do Not Operate" style tag to be placed in the event that the power system(s) can not be physicaly locked out (aka a Tagout system). It also allows for a tagout even when the device can be locked out provided ". . . the employer can demonstrate that the utilization of a tagout system will provide full employee protection as set forth in paragraph (c)(3) of this section."
Based on the above I don't think OSHA would really care if you posted a guard or not so long as you hung the little paper tag (and for the record I could not find any OSHA reference to posting a guard in lieu of or in addition to lockout/tagout methods - so in essence I guess SOMEONE proved you right).
What it all boils down to is which do you trust more to keep someone from inadvertantly turning something back on (when it can't be physicaly locked) your buddy or a paper "Do Not Operate" tag ?
Every class I have ever taken that dealth with Lockout / Tagout in a Rescue Situation always taught that you physicaly lock it (with your own locks & you hold the key) or you post a guard (a human "Do Not Operate" tag) at the control(s). To me this is just good practice & common sense.
As always every group & agency is free to do what they think is best. I simply offered what I have been taught & what I belive to be a good practice - YMMV.
Also while researching this I came across some more interesting links.
Also take a look at NFPA 1006: Standard for Rescue Technician Professional Qualifications, 2003 Edition
** Edit ** I left this post as is - but I wanted to come back and apologize for coming across as an @$$ - Rough day at the office & I took it out with the keyboard. Firegod32 - wasn't directed at you on purpose, just happened that way. My apologies.
Last edited by N2DFire; 09-24-2004 at 11:38 PM.Take Care - Stay Safe - God Bless
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