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  1. #201
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    Thanks for pointing that out for me.

    But can you answer that question for me?

    Do you think your department or company is being ran by a bunch of morons?


  2. #202
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    NJ Motor Vehicle Commission

    Ammended Blue Light and Red Light Use

    A bill signed into law in September 2005 authorizes volunteers to use contemporary blue light bars in addition to the currently authorized flashing or revolving blue lights. Additionally, the law:

    * Allows the lights to be placed on a vehicle's dashboard
    * Requires the light elements to be shielded from the driver's view
    * Clarifies that volunteers operating these lights are required to observe all traffic signals, such as red lights
    * Increases fines for persons authorized to use these lights from $50 to $100
    * Increases fines for persons unauthorized to use these lights, but who do so in violation of the law, from $100 to $200

    The law also authorizes the current, NOT the active, chief or first assistant chief of a volunteer fire company to operate red emergency lights and a siren. It also authorizes the current officer of a first aid or rescue squad to operate red emergency lights and a siren.
    Last edited by bobbeh728; 10-15-2005 at 06:04 PM.

  3. #203
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    Default lights and sirens in personal vehicles

    Now since I have a clearer idea of what the law states here in the great state of NJ. But on a side note, what kind of vehicle does your chief drive?

    Our chief drives a 2000 Ford Expedition V8 Supercharged.

    Does anyone think that their department or company is being ran by a bunch of morons?

  4. #204
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    Quote Originally Posted by bobbeh728
    NJ Motor Vehicle Commission

    Ammended Blue Light and Red Light Use

    A bill signed into law in September 2005 authorizes volunteers to use contemporary blue light bars in addition to the currently authorized flashing or revolving blue lights. Additionally, the law:

    * Allows the lights to be placed on a vehicle's dashboard
    * Requires the light elements to be shielded from the driver's view
    * Clarifies that volunteers operating these lights are required to observe all traffic signals, such as red lights
    * Increases fines for persons authorized to use these lights from $50 to $100
    * Increases fines for persons unauthorized to use these lights, but who do so in violation of the law, from $100 to $200

    The law also authorizes the current, NOT the active, chief or first assistant chief of a volunteer fire company to operate red emergency lights and a siren. It also authorizes the current officer of a first aid or rescue squad to operate red emergency lights and a siren.
    Where did they put this in Title 39? I pasted the sections directly from the NJ website. It is simply hard for me to believe that our state government wouldn't be completely up to date on their website.

  5. #205
    MembersZone Subscriber LJ33FIRE's Avatar
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    Default Adam

    Adam wait for the light to turn green. (even though you don't respond to calls with your lights since you are at the house!) Go ahead, stop at a red light, look around then go through. I'll bet you find a cop to write you then, if you don't get hit that is.

  6. #206
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    Exclamation States Have Different Laws

    As a former chief officer from Mississippi we were told by the state highway patrol that if we ran a red light we also had to run a siren in conjuction while responding. We were then told that on our pov's that we were allowed to run red but no siren on the vehicle unless we had approval from our personnel insurance company to run our vehicle as an emergency vehicle. By the way to the paid guys like lafireeducator, you think that because you are in a paid department that you are so much better than us vol's. That is a crock of ****. We are allowed to run solid red and also red and clear combo. The department allows only 10 mph above the speed limit. No exceptions.

  7. #207
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    Default Vestal Fire

    In the Vestal Fire Dept the town provides each of our cheifs, 4 stations, with a specified police vehicle with red lights, sirens and airhorns. The rest of the volunteers in vestal are allowed, according to nys, to run blue lights on their vehicles.

  8. #208
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    sorry thats fire vehicle instead of police vehicles. the vehicles that our chiefs use are actually old police vehicles.

  9. #209
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    Also in Vestal, fire chiefs are allowed to put red lights, sirens, and airhorns on their personal vehicles

  10. #210
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    i guess the way i look at the whole situation is it takes 2 people or more to cause an accident (unless it involves a deer or tree ) ... but if the other parties on the road would pay attention and hang up the phones, turn down the radio it wouldn't be an issue because bright ***** red lights mean get the F out of my way....

    I only run hot to very serious calls where i know I will be of use. Ie, the pin in where we cant get a little kid out, the ejections, the codes, serious burns, etc...(i run ems and rescue fyi, not fire)

    **edit - oh yea, and we can only have lights here... no sirens which is a crock
    J.E. Guzman
    NC EMT-Intermediate
    NC Emergency Medical Dispatcher
    NENA Emergency Medical Dispatcher
    NENA Emergency Telecommunicator

  11. #211
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    Quote Originally Posted by Code3Jeep
    i guess the way i look at the whole situation is it takes 2 people or more to cause an accident (unless it involves a deer or tree ) ... but if the other parties on the road would pay attention and hang up the phones, turn down the radio it wouldn't be an issue because bright ***** red lights mean get the F out of my way....

    I only run hot to very serious calls where i know I will be of use. Ie, the pin in where we cant get a little kid out, the ejections, the codes, serious burns, etc...(i run ems and rescue fyi, not fire)

    **edit - oh yea, and we can only have lights here... no sirens which is a crock
    What?

    It takes ONE person to cause an accident, whether it involves an emergency vehicle or not. If a fire fighter blows a stop sign at 40 MPH and T-bones a civilian vehicle, the fire fighter was at fault. If a fire fighter slides on a wet road because he was going too fast and hits a car head-on, the fire fighter was at fault.

    Driving like an idiot does not relate to a faster rescue.

    I would also seriously doubt with your attitude (bright ***** red lights mean get the F out of my way....) that you are of any use ever at a scene.

  12. #212
    Forum Member fireguy919's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Code3Jeep
    i guess the way i look at the whole situation is it takes 2 people or more to cause an accident (unless it involves a deer or tree ) ... but if the other parties on the road would pay attention and hang up the phones, turn down the radio it wouldn't be an issue because bright ***** red lights mean get the F out of my way....

    I only run hot to very serious calls where i know I will be of use. Ie, the pin in where we cant get a little kid out, the ejections, the codes, serious burns, etc...(i run ems and rescue fyi, not fire)

    **edit - oh yea, and we can only have lights here... no sirens which is a crock
    No it only takes one person to cause an accident. You are asking for the right of way. If joe public is going to the store and has the green light joe public has the right of way. You have to get to the call to make a difference. Due re guard to public safety. Be glad your not on my F.D. with that attitude. I just bet your one of those guys that brag about I was doing 90 to this call. Think about the public you serving as you pass them. If not Iíll give you a little advise now. If that is how you look at things, get a good lawyer on retainer.
    Training does not make perfect. Training makes permanent!

    IACOJ probie

  13. #213
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    [QUOTE=Code3Jeep]i guess the way i look at the whole situation is it takes 2 people or more to cause an accidentNo, it takes one person in a vehicle either not paying attention, driving recklessy or with the attitude that
    bright ***** red lights mean get the F out of my way...


    Your attitude is why we have banned red lights and sirens in personal cars here for wll over a decade.

    FyredUp

  14. #214
    MembersZone Subscriber dmleblanc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chief842351
    By the way to the paid guys like lafireeducator, you think that because you are in a paid department that you are so much better than us vol's. That is a crock of ****. .
    Settle down there, guy.....lafireeducator is a volunteer with a combo department......
    Chief Dwayne LeBlanc
    Paincourtville Volunteer Fire Department
    Paincourtville, LA

    "I have a dream. It's not a big dream, it's just a little dream. My dream ó and I hope you don't find this too crazy ó is that I would like the people of this community to feel that if, God forbid, there were a fire, calling the fire department would actually be a wise thing to do. You can't have people, if their houses are burning down, saying, 'Whatever you do, don't call the fire department!' That would be bad."
    ó C.D. Bales, "Roxanne"

  15. #215
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    Quote Originally Posted by chief842351
    As a former chief officer from Mississippi we were told by the state highway patrol that if we ran a red light we also had to run a siren in conjuction while responding. We were then told that on our pov's that we were allowed to run red but no siren on the vehicle unless we had approval from our personnel insurance company to run our vehicle as an emergency vehicle. By the way to the paid guys like lafireeducator, you think that because you are in a paid department that you are so much better than us vol's. That is a crock of ****. We are allowed to run solid red and also red and clear combo. The department allows only 10 mph above the speed limit. No exceptions.

    You my freiend are totally wrong !!! Nobody should be running red lights especially vollies like yourself who live for the moment to "slap it" when you put the lights on !!! And yes your right " paid guys " are professionals

  16. #216
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    Quote Originally Posted by LaFireEducator
    To me it will be a wonderful day when every state in our nation comes to thier senses and realizes that volunteer firefighers having any sort of emergency light or siren on, in, around or in close proximity to thier vehicles in inherantly dangerous to both them and the general public. There is no need and never will be a need for volunteer personnel to go screaming to thier stations with disco lights rotating from thier vehicles to save that precious 30 seconds of time. This comes from a man with 25 years of VOLUNTEER firefighting experience that wants to see the culture of firefighting changed ... and this, my friends is easily the MOST danagerous part of the volunteer culture, especailly given the youth of our membership and the irresponsibility that comes as part of that youth. Please stop the madness ... burn, smash and pulverize all the lights.

    Just my thoughts.

    Nice Job !!! And then they complain about not being called a professional !! Lets start with getting rid of the "wacker lights" and maybe you'll get some respect from the public instead of running them off the road to save yourself 2 seconds of time !!! It dosn't matter anyway a 12 to 18 minute response time from home to the FH to the fire call is only overhaul operations by the time you get there and the "wacker lights" should only be used on the disco dance floor .

  17. #217
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    So, is this a safety issue?
    Or an argument about lense colors?
    Because no light on your dash is going to make the person behind the wheel a better driver or a better firefighter.
    At most, you are putting the community at risk, because you might get the idea that the light affords you certain discretions when the other motorists aren't inclined to give you any.
    Keep the lights on the apparatus. That's where they belong.
    CR
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    Remember Bradley Golden (9/25/01)
    RIP HOF Robert J. Compton(ENG6511)

  18. #218
    Forum Member Adam07003's Avatar
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    Im a young guy, i love lights. I worked for a company that made lights before I got into EMS. Im just a whacker you can say it, i dont care. I love showing what I do and being of importance on scene.

    I respond sometimes to a scene/EMS house with a blue light. I have an LED bar and an electronic air horn as my main horn.

    I don't speed around with I drive, I do the limit. I obey traffic laws (stop at stop signs and all that stuff).

    I know that because I have a light, doesnt mean im a tank. I know that i don't have lights/sirens/big ambulance around me. People will see my blue truck, and not think much of it at first.

    Some of us know how to respond in our POV's, then again, some of us don't

    I learned how to respond, because I drove an SUV/Van in NYC for the NY organ donor nework. I drove human organs around and SURGICAL teams. One of the best ways to learn to drive in an emergency situation I think, is to have a team of scared doctors or a patient, you will learn NOT to take chances and speed around and be foolish.

    I also know that people are idiots. Everybody on the road is an idiot in my opinion. If im on the road driving, everybodys out to hit me with their car, so i learn to watch others and thats how people need to drive.

    Sure use the light, but don't go screaming down the road. Drive te limit. The light will help you when you need to turn and you have oncoming traffic, they will see it and let you go first, so you don't sit there waiting forever.

    I don't use the light though,since im at our squad house. Ive used it a handfull of times, and ive done the speed limit and driven carefully, as should anybody responding.
    Last edited by Adam07003; 11-07-2005 at 09:48 PM.
    Adam, EMT-B

  19. #219
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    [QUOTE=Adam07003] i love lights. I worked for a company that made lights before I got into EMS. Im just a whacker you can say it, i dont care. I love showing what I do and being of importance on scene.


    Need I say more ?

  20. #220
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    British Columbia has recently taken an interesting approach to this topic.

    A little over a year ago, the light issue was rather vague up here, and most Chief's could get a permit to operate any type of red light with or without siren on their POV.

    Last year, the gov't decided to revoke that process, and ordered all lights off POV's period. There was some resistance by the Fire Chief's Association, so this year they introduced new regulations. The basics are outlined in the July Fire Chief's Association newsletter.

    FCABC Chieftan: July 2005

    Basically it requires the following before a light & siren permit can be issued to a Chief Officer:

    1. Must be for a Chief Officer of a recognized municipal or regional dept.
    2. Applications must be for BOTH lights and a siren.
    3. Vehicle must be registered, licensed, and insured as an emergency vehicle.
    4. Vehicle must have passed a provincial safety inspection within last 6 months.
    5. Vehicle must have a roof mounted "LIGHT BAR" with at least 2 forward, and 2 rearward facing lights.
    6. Vehicle must be clearly marked as an emergency vehicle with the dept or regional authority clearly displayed.
    7. Lights and sirens must be used together (unless vehicle is standing still).
    8. Vehicle must be operated subject to Provincial Motor Vehicle Regulations
    9. Vehicle must not be driven by anyone other than the Chief Officer (or his or her official designate in the Chief's Absence) unless the siren and lights can be locked out.

    This is a pretty dramatic change, but not unreasonable to comply with. There is certainly some more cost associated with this than the old single red rotator, but most of the local Chief's don't have a problem with it. I think it is a good regulation that allows the Chief's the opportunity to equip their POV if justified, but maintains a similar safety standard to the rest of the dept apparatus.

    I am a Chief, but I personally don't run this system because I live and work within 1km of the hall, so I can respond to the hall, and ride in one of my engines or on the F-350 rescue if I want to be on-scene with the first-due apparatus. We have 3 5-man front-line apparatus, plus a wildland unit, so the chance of missing all the trucks is non-existent. Also, the lights just won't save me any time on my 1km drive.

    This kind of regulation may not work everywhere, but I think it is a reasonable start.
    Never argue with an Idiot. They drag you down to their level, and then beat you with experience!

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