Thread: Tic

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    Default Tic

    Hi!

    We're in the process of purchasing a TIC that will be used for structure fires and hazmat ops. Any comment on the TIC you are using? Any tried more than one brand and cans compare units? How does the MSA TIC perform (the price is good, but what about quality?)?

    Regards,

    S.A.

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    My dept uses The ISG k1000 elite. This has been a great camera for us. We've used it many times with no problems. It has one of the best pictures and is easy to handle. When we started to look into buying one we looked at many different TIC and talked to area depts on what was the best and ISG was what we came up with. But there are a lot of good TIC on the market so I would try as many TIC as you can and find out what camera fits you the best. Many dealers will come out and give demo's to your dept. I hope this help's out.

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    We will soon be getting a MSA Evolution 4100 TIC. This will be our third MSA unit. Tried others in training and drills, liked the MSA's the best. First one was bought in 1997 and still in service.
    "This thread is being closed as it is off-topic and not related to the fire industry." - Isn't that what the Off Duty forum was for?

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    Bones,you get a chance,look at the 5000 also.A real neat package with a good picture.I've used the K1000 and I wouldn't rate it as "best"picture quality but we all have our preferences.I've noticed more quality control issues with the last round of cameras that were put out.Remember when purchasing a camera to get a spare battery also.I like truck mounts,we use them in our units with cameras.Proper training in use and maintainence is essential.T.C.

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    Hey JF,crawled out from under your rock I see.How's your new assignment working out?T.C.

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    I'm still dusting myself off from that last assignment under the rock. I see things have pretty much stayed the course with TIC questions. I understand we may be under the scrutiny of the training POLICE for real now. I'm just glad to be back at a truck on a normal work schedule. I also plan to continue to lay low on the forums also. Stay Safe JF
    Last edited by JForristall; 10-29-2004 at 06:36 PM.

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    Originally posted by Rescue101
    Bones,you get a chance,look at the 5000 also.A real neat package with a good picture.I've used the K1000 and I wouldn't rate it as "best"picture quality but we all have our preferences.I've noticed more quality control issues with the last round of cameras that were put out.Remember when purchasing a camera to get a spare battery also.I like truck mounts,we use them in our units with cameras.Proper training in use and maintainence is essential.T.C.
    The MSA 4100 Bones got uses the exact same engine as the MSA 5000. MSA has consolidated all of their engine purchases with one supplier. The image quality should be simliar, despite the much larger display on the 4100. Size and weight should be the primary difference.
    My comments are sometimes educated, sometimes informed and sometimes just blowing smoke...but they are always mine and mine alone and do not reflect upon anyone else (especially my employer).

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    You should definatly try the Fire warrior by Morning Pride. It's helmet mounted & hands free. Probably one of the best for a first in attack or search. It only uses 2 double"A" bateries and has a quick release so it can be changed from one helmet to the other. Being hands free the member using the camera is stil a functioning member of the team.

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    Personally,I would be leary of a camera that only had two AA bateries for power particularly here in the Northeast in the winter.I also don't care for a monical viewfinder but that's a "me" thing.So far out of all the cameras I've used the K-90 has the best battery life with the big Bullard right behind it.But as I've said before,any camera beats no camera.T.C.

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    Stay alert and be safe.

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    In regards to using a thermal imager in Haz Mat applications you may want to check out this post under the Haz Mat topics:

    http://cms.firehouse.com/forums2/sho...756#post464756

    Haz Mat use seems to be picking up, but I still don't believe the TIs are be using as much as they should, and I am not real sure that there is a lot of real good training going on when it comes to thermal imagers and Haz Mat (I know I am starting to sound like a broken record on the training issue).

    Any questions or comments on thermal imagers and Haz Mat please fire away here or under the Haz Mat topics, I am sure we can all learn a lot from each other.

    Good Luck, Stay Safe,
    Mike Richardson
    Captain, Training Officer
    St Matthews FD, Louisville KY
    "aka TIman"
    richardson@stmatthewsfd.com

    TI Training = www.safe-ir.com

    The information and views above are in no way associated with my employer, and are strictly my own.

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    Captain Richardson ,
    Tried to e-mail you with no luck... sorry had to post instead.

    In the process of evaluating TIC’s and would very much appreciate any advice you could pass along. Have read a number of your informative posts.
    My exposure with TIC is limited to “playing” with two models (unknown) during training ops, 3 years ago and 6 years ago. This “experience” supersedes any other fire officers’ experience in my area… so, I really need help.
    I work ARFF, so I require something with a temperature gage / indicator for unusually hot engines or breaks. Of course Hazmat is high on the list as well. A smaller device would be preferable, with colour. Also, something we could mount in the truck to trickle charge…
    You mentioned how important a course is… and I plan on heeding your advice. But in the mean time, any recommendations you can offer would be greatly appreciated.
    WILD MAN
    www.whitehorsecombat.com
    "Toughest two minutes in sports!"
    If you want to be hard - you have to train hard!

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    Wildman,

    Sorry about the snafu with the email, I lost access to that Hotmail account about 2 months ago, you can now reach me at richardson@stmatthewsfd.com.

    My initial recommendations would be to do all of the "Homework" you can, this would include:
    1. Hit the major manufacturer’s websites to see what units are out there and take advantage of the info that you can find there
    2. Talk to all of the current TI users you can find, this includes local face-to-face and those outside your area like the people on these forums

    Once you have done this put down a list of features you think you need, see what Thermal Imagers out there that have those features, and set up some demos.

    Some things to avoid:
    1. letting a salesperson tell you what you want and don’t want, you decide yourself well before they start the sales pitch or demos, avoids getting sold on a “bell or whistle” you really don’t need or that does not really work as “advertised”
    2. listening to people about thermal imagers who have an “opinion” but don’t really have any real experiences or facts to back up their “opinion”, avoids “blind brand loyalty”
    3. evaluate a unit in an air conditioned office in street clothes, avoids buying a unit that looks great but won’t get the job done in the burning building at 3:00 am

    In regards to your ARFF questions I do have some limited experience, I was fortunate to have worked with a couple of airports during my Bullard days. I would recommend that you try both the large and small format TIs, but I would bet your best luck will be with a large format unit that has a 320 x 240 detector, those units will give you the best detail when you are looking for details like overheated brakes or engines. As far as the temperature measurement and color goes, that is something that you will have play around with and get used to. I would really recommend against these features for an average firefighter because they can be very complicated and very easy to misread, however with the proper training they can be a benefit. With all of the units you are going to have to get pretty close, under 30 feet or even closer, to get any good readings with those features.

    If you have some specific questions about the evaluation or applications please post them here or drop me an email.

    Good Luck, Stay Safe,
    Mike Richardson
    Captain, Training Officer
    St Matthews FD, Louisville KY
    "aka TIman"
    richardson@stmatthewsfd.com

    TI Training = www.safe-ir.com

    The information and views above are in no way associated with my employer, and are strictly my own.

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