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View Poll Results: What is your attack line of choice for most of your structure fires?

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  • 1 1/2"

    8 11.76%
  • 1 3/4"

    54 79.41%
  • 2"

    3 4.41%
  • 2 1/2"

    3 4.41%
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  1. #1
    MembersZone Subscriber Firefighter430's Avatar
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    Default 1.5-1.75-2-2.5 Attack Lines

    What is your departments standard attack line for structure fires? How many of you out there use 2" attck lines in place of 1 1/2" or 1 3/4" lines. What are the pros and cons of 2". What nozzle do you use on your 2" lines? Have you experimented with different types?
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  2. #2
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    We use 1 3/4" lines with a TFT fog nozzle on our preconnects. For us its just the best all around. Its not so big as a 2 1/2" that we can't move it, but big enough to put out 90% of any residential stuff we'll roll up on. For anything fully involved or industrial we'll pull a 2 1/2 with a smooth bore though. Just to cut through the BS and put the wet stuff on the red stuff. Just my .02

  3. #3
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    Both of our front line engines have (1)100' 1 3/4" 'trash line' with a fog nozzle, (2)200' 1 3/4" cross lays with TFT nozzles, and (1) 250' 1 3/4" with a smooth bore nozzle. They also have one 250' 2 1/2" preconnect with an adjustable pattern nozzle.

    Since we usually only have 2 fire fighters available per line, the 1 3/4" is a good choice for most fires. The problem is when the fire demands a 2 1/2" and a 1 3/4" is used out of habit.

    Hose size and nozzle types are tools in the toolbox. No one setup is "best" for all fires. You can use a booster line on any fire and eventually it will put out the fire. Might not be much of the structure left, but the fire will be out. The secret of good fire fighting is to use the right tools and techniques for the job at hand. Just like you can use a wrench as a hammer (just ask my wife) "always" using a 2 1/2" or 1 1/2" is not the right way handle the job.

    My department has never tried 2" line. We went from mostly booster line to 1 3/4" for the primary line in the mid-1980's. Our last two engines do not even have a booster reel on them, but thats another thread.
    Last edited by KenNFD1219; 11-12-2004 at 03:15 PM.
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  4. #4
    MembersZone Subscriber jaybird210's Avatar
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    Default Didn't vote

    We use the line appropriate for the amount of fire showing or potentially hidden. Sometimes it's an 1ĺ" and sometimes it's a 2Ĺ". Sometimes its a master stream. Sometimes it's a combination stream, sometimes it's a solid stream.

    What's your tool box look like? Only got a slotted screwdriver in it? Or do you have an assortment of different sizes and styles? To limit your self to one size line and one type of nozzle is foolish.
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  5. #5
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    We use 2" handlines with TFT tips and 1 1/2 couplings. Personally I think it is pointless, you are not gaining much more with the extra 1/4 inch of hose. You however are decreasing your mobility. Not to mention I think the TFT nozzles suck, I'm a solid bore man, my dept's choice in handlines makes me glad that I'm in the Truck.

  6. #6
    Forum Member stm4710's Avatar
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    One of our rigs had a horrible array of hose when I got on. It was a malange of 1.5 1.75 and 2.5 and 3. Iron Pipe and NS.

    I did away with all the 1.5" and IP. To me there was no justifcation to keep the 1.5. There is no real performance differance other than the fact you cant squeeze another 50-75 gpm through 1.5.

    It now carries two preconnects of 250 feet of 1.75". 6 rolls of 1.75" in a cabinet incase we need to come off discharge 3 (I personally like to roll out 1 or two sections for when we do demonstations or CERT classes rather that have to stretch out 250'..........then have to repack it ) On dischage 3 I took a 45' elbow and a 2.5 - 1.5 wye so we can run up to 4 attack lines-----highly unlikely.

    For a supply line I have 250' of 2.5 in the hose bed. 100' of 3" in the hose bed as well, but not connected to the 2.5". I also took a roll of the 3" and put it under the pump panel. My reasoning is when we are refilling or right next to the plug we dont have to pull the supply lines off the back.


    Keep in mind this a foresty/squad/mini pump........not a full class A pump so our space was limited on this. I have gotten alot of comments about the hose under the panel or the water thief/ hydrent fitting are on the back in a canvas bag........... but I dont care........they are there cause it works in the field, not looks good in a parade. I hate parade rigs.
    Last edited by stm4710; 11-12-2004 at 03:37 PM.

  7. #7
    Forum Member Dave1983's Avatar
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    Each has 1) 100' 1 3/4" trash line with a fog tip, 1) 150' 1 3/4" with a solid bore tip 1) 200' 1 3/4" foam line with fog tip and 1) 150' 2 1/2" with solid bore tip. Also have a standpipe pack with 200' 2" with low pressure fog tip. There has been talk of changing the 1 3/4" over to 2" next time we buy hose.

    Dave

  8. #8
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    Default

    front bumper line - 100 ft of 1 1/2 with 50 psi Fog

    front crosslay - 150 ft of 1 3/4 with 50 psi fog

    rear crosslay - 200 ft of 1 3/4 50 psi fog

    rear dead load - 300 ft of 1 3/4 with 7/8 tip smoothbore

    big line - 200 ft 2 1/2 with 1 1/8 smoothbore

    high rise commercial packs - 3 50 ft bundles of 2 1/2 with 1 1/8 smoothbore

    high rise residential/standpipe packs - 100 ft 1 3/4 with 7/8 smoothbore (used with 50 ft of 2 1/2 from the standpipe)

    ofd226
    Oakland Fire Dept, CA
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  9. #9
    Forum Member Bones42's Avatar
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    Default

    25' 3/4" line on front bumper with low pressure TFT used mainly for washing tools off and kids fire prevention activities.

    100' 1 3/4" line on front bumper with Akron low pressure break apart nozzle. Smoothbore guys can take of the adjustable nozzle, adjustable guys can leave it on. Same low pressure and the gpm (180) we want.

    2 200' 1 3/4" line crosslays with Akron low pressure break apart nozzle.

    1 200' 2 1/2" line crosslay with smoothbore. Have yet to want a 2 1/2" fog, but we have a 2 1/2" adjustable nozzle in a compartment case anyone wants.

    1 200' 2 1/2" line preconnected on the back hosebed with smoothbore.
    600' 2 1/2" line not preconnected on the back hosebed with gated wye that we use for our areas we need an extended hose stretch. We have 2 100' 1 3/4" "packs" of hose that go on the end of that as needed.

    5" for supply lines but will on a rare occaision use some 2 1/2".
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  10. #10
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    Two crosslays of 200' 1 3/4. plus one 100' 1 3/4. TFT combo tip
    200' of 1 3/4 in the rear combo nozzle
    200' of 2 1/2 in the rear combo nozzle
    booster line
    Theres a 75' length of single jacketed 1 1/2, nozzle, a thief, and a short length of 2 1/2, in a shoulder bag for connecting to standpipes in the high riszes.

    There's smooth bore and navy nozzles in the compartment for what
    ever

    There's 1500 of 3" in the bed split into two loads.

  11. #11
    Forum Member ThNozzleman's Avatar
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    Default

    Personally I think it is pointless, you are not gaining much more with the extra 1/4 inch of hose.
    You'd be surprised how much that .25" adds up. You can just about cut your friction loss in half across the board compared to 1.75".

  12. #12
    Forum Member Weruj1's Avatar
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    we carry both inch and three-quarter and two and a half .,........most have combo nozzles and the 2.5 has a smoothbore on it that really moves water.
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  13. #13
    Forum Member SpartanGuy's Avatar
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    Our two primary attack engines are equipped mostly the same:

    Bumper: 100' of 1.75" line with a fog nozzle

    Crosslays:
    1- 150' of 1.75" line with a combo nozzle
    2- 150' of 1.75" line with a combo nozzle
    3- 200' of 1.75" line with a combo nozzle
    4- 150' of 2.5" line with a combo nozzle

    Here's where they get different:

    Back(Engine 1):
    400' 2.5" line with a gated wye to run two 1.75" lines for a quick attack line inside of a mall/commercial structure to try and knock down a fire before it grows in intensity.

    200' 2.5" line with a fog nozzle.(Reminded me of Emergency! the one time I saw it get pulled)

    100' foot of 2.5" reduced down to another 200' of 1.75" with a combo nozzle on the end to be stretched over a big setback/long driveway to make it into a house with sufficient attack hose while sidestepping friction loss (in a way).

    Back(Engine 2):
    200' 2.5" line with a combo nozzle.

    100' 2.5" with a Mercury Attack Monitor on the end.
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  14. #14
    MembersZone Subscriber Firefighter1219's Avatar
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    We used to have 1.5" for as long as I can remember. That is what was given to us in the beginning and was all that we could afford. A few months ago we got a Forestry grant to buy some hose with.

    On Engine 6 we now carry 1.75" with pistol-grip flow-adjustable fog nozzles. In the front bumper we have 100' of preconnected 1.75", with an extra 50' rolled up and ready to go if need be. The front preconnect is used primarily for trash/brush/car/woods fires. In the right and left preconnect hoselays we carry 150' of 1.75" lines.

    Most of the fires we come across can be handled with a 1.75", but if need be, we will pull the ol' 2.5".

    Our rescue carries 150' of the old 1.5" that can be used for structural attack if need be.

    I like the 1.75" much better than the 1.5" because it can flow a lot more water, which can make a big difference. Especially when you have multiple lines deployed.
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  15. #15
    MembersZone Subscriber CrossBro1's Avatar
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    The typical line of choice is the 1 3/4" with TFT. We carry a 100' 1 3/4" car fire line, 200' and 250' 1 3/4" minuteman preconnect, and 200' 2 1/2" preconnect with smoothbore nozzle. Most of our fires usually only require a 1 3/4" line, but the decision should be made based on the volume of fire and conditions on arrival.

  16. #16
    Permanently Removed CALFFBOU's Avatar
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    Default Me...

    I like the 1.5 line. Remember the famous line- "You can fight
    a lot of fire with little water."

    I can handle most situations with a 1.5 and still move around
    the structure pretty well.

    You know the story behind the 1 3/4 line, right? It was
    invented by the fire hose industry because they were
    stagnant and needed to make some more money.

    -Bou

  17. #17
    MembersZone Subscriber SamsonFCDES's Avatar
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    The only types of hose we have for the entire department are 1' booster, some 1' cloath for wildland, 1.5 inch attack for exerything else, and some 2.5 inch.

    That will likely be that way for ever since the district board is not about to start buying new hose, to expensive. They just replace it a piece at a time as we destroy it.
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  18. #18
    55 Years & Still Rolling hwoods's Avatar
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    Cool The View From Here..................

    What we do, and what I'd like to do, are different by a wide margin.

    Our new Engine has a 150' 1.5 line in the front bumper, a 100 1.5 line in a well in the right running board under the right side discharges, 200 1.5", 400' 1.5 lines on the rear, along with a 250' 2" Nozzles are a mix, but the 2" line always has a 1" smoothbore. The 95 Rescue Engine has the same, except there is no right side line. Supply line is 1,600' of 3", 800' each side in a split bed on both rigs. On both, the 400' line is really 200' of 2" topped with 200' of 1.5" This is a "custom made" approach that we've worked with for quite some time. We have a mix of Multi-family and light industrial/commercial uses in our area, and a longer line is needed quite often.

    Where I'd like to go: 100' and 200' 1" lines for trash and brush. 1 each 150', 200', 250', and 400' 2" lines for structural/vehicle Fires, with 1200' 3" and 1200' 5" for supply line. The 3" can be used for heavy hand lines (no pun intended) as well as supply. As you can see, I don't care for fractions. 1", 2", 3", and 5" cover every use in the book, often with a comfortable margin.
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  19. #19
    Forum Member Rescue101's Avatar
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    We've pretty much phased out 1.5.Everything now is 1.75 & 2".I don't find the 2" significantly harder to move around the structure but the knockdown is considerably greater.2.5 for the truly stubborn.I HATE making two trips and out here in the country fire can have a pretty good lead time before reported.I disagree with Bou(what's new)but we work in decidedly different settings.We have had many fires that easily overpower 1.5 hose.But the addition of foam cells along with the use of "big"hose and nozzles will dampen the spirits of the most persistant barn fire.4" feeders 'cause the "pups"don't like packing 5',so I leave the 5"on the reel truck.Packing hydraulically,perfect.And that .25" equals another 100gpm or so on delivery for those who questioned why.T.C.

  20. #20
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    We run two crosslays, 150' and 200', 1 3/4" with the new TFT fixed gallonage nozzles. They're set up for 185 g.p.m. I like the mobility and the low nozzle reaction at only 50 p.s.i. We got rid of our old "automatic" TFTs that operated at 100 p.s.i. nozzle pressure when we found out that the flows weren't nearly what they were supposed to be.
    We also have a 150' 2 1/2" blitz line with stack tips.

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