1. #1
    MembersZone Subscriber
    Firefighter1219's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Concord, Havana, FL USA
    Posts
    1,356

    Question Cracked faceshields. What's causing it?

    As many of you know, I currently run with a volunteer department. We use tactical tupperware, with 4" faceshields. For some time now, I have been noticing small, minute cracks appearing on top of the face shield (upper rim).

    I carry my helmet in a gear bag in the trunk of my car. I do this because there is no room to keep gear on the engine, and I don't always respond to the station (ie if I'm close to the scene). I think the heat from being inside of the trunk of my car is causing the faceshield to crack. I have already lost one faceshield, and don't want to lose anymore.

    I don't have any other place to keep my gear, so I was wondering if anyone has had the same problem. What do you think is causing the cracks? Have you had the same problem? What can I do to keep this from happening?

    I will try to get some pictures so you can see what I am referring to.
    TO/EMT CVFD (1219)
    EMT GEMS
    CPT/EMT MVFD
    ---------------------------------------------------
    Proud Member of IACOJ
    ---------------------------------------------------
    9-11-01 Never Forget FDNY 343

  2. #2
    former FH.com member

    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    860

    Lightbulb I've seen those cracks too.

    I don't think it's necessarily the heat from your trunk Bro. Does your gear get tossed around in the trunk or is it secure? I would think the cracks are from lateral compression (ie..getting crushed against something) or torsion of the shield. -46

  3. #3
    MembersZone Subscriber
    Firefighter1219's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Concord, Havana, FL USA
    Posts
    1,356

    Default

    Does your gear get tossed around in the trunk or is it secure?
    Nope. The bag is so heavy that it never moves inside of the trunk. Vibration may be a problem though. I wonder if that has anything to do with it.
    TO/EMT CVFD (1219)
    EMT GEMS
    CPT/EMT MVFD
    ---------------------------------------------------
    Proud Member of IACOJ
    ---------------------------------------------------
    9-11-01 Never Forget FDNY 343

  4. #4
    Forum Member
    Weruj1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 1999
    Location
    NW Ohio
    Posts
    7,857

    Default

    not trying to be a samrt *** but get rid of the shield and get some goggles !
    IACOJ both divisions and PROUD OF IT !
    Pardon me sir.. .....but I believe we are all over here !
    ATTENTION ALL SHOPPERS: Will the dead horse please report to the forums.(thanks Motown)
    RAY WAS HERE 08/28/05
    LETHA' FOREVA' ! 010607
    I'm sorry, I haven't been paying much attention for the last 3 hours.....what were we discussing?
    "but I guarentee you I will FF your arse off" from>
    http://www.firehouse.com/forums/show...60#post1137060post 115

  5. #5
    former FH.com member

    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    860

    Default pardon the hijack

    Hey Weruj, I found something for ya. I figured you could put it to good use.
    Last edited by SAFD46Truck; 02-04-2007 at 01:58 AM.

  6. #6
    MembersZone Subscriber
    arhaney's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Wren, MS Until the forum gremlins pay a visit!
    Posts
    1,448

    Default

    Wereuj1, which goggles do you use? I've seen those cracks in my shield before, never seen them really progress though.
    Chief
    Wren Volunteer Fire Department
    IACOJ
    Southern Division

    http://www.wrenfiredepartment.4t.com/

    In Memory of:
    FireFighter/Pilot James Archer
    1946-2005
    "Rest in peace James, you now have the ultimate set of wings on you."

    Thanks, LeuitEFDems

  7. #7
    MembersZone Subscriber
    Firefighter1219's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Concord, Havana, FL USA
    Posts
    1,356

    Default

    Weruj, which set up would sugguest? I'm heavily leaning towards getting myself a Cairns 880 for Christmas. I'm not sure if I want to go with 4" faceshield, goggles (ESS?) and bourkes, or just plain goggles.

    If I get myself a 4" faceshield, and it lets go, I would have to replcace it with the cost coming out of my pocket instead of the department paying for it. I really like the way 4" protects my face. It covers all of my face, and most of the time doesn't allow anything to come through. I'm kinda skeptacle (sp) about going to goggles because I worry about getting my face cut. I've had my face cut even with the 4" down, as I'm sure many of you have. It's no picknick. Can my second pair of eyes be worn with goggles?
    TO/EMT CVFD (1219)
    EMT GEMS
    CPT/EMT MVFD
    ---------------------------------------------------
    Proud Member of IACOJ
    ---------------------------------------------------
    9-11-01 Never Forget FDNY 343

  8. #8
    Forum Member
    Weruj1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 1999
    Location
    NW Ohio
    Posts
    7,857

    Default

    we run the ESS gogles with both the clip on and permanent mounts .....personally I liked the faceshield too but alas no more. So far so good with goggles.They are mounted on 1010's and Benny II's
    IACOJ both divisions and PROUD OF IT !
    Pardon me sir.. .....but I believe we are all over here !
    ATTENTION ALL SHOPPERS: Will the dead horse please report to the forums.(thanks Motown)
    RAY WAS HERE 08/28/05
    LETHA' FOREVA' ! 010607
    I'm sorry, I haven't been paying much attention for the last 3 hours.....what were we discussing?
    "but I guarentee you I will FF your arse off" from>
    http://www.firehouse.com/forums/show...60#post1137060post 115

  9. #9
    MembersZone Subscriber
    Firefighter1219's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Concord, Havana, FL USA
    Posts
    1,356

    Default

    we run the ESS gogles with both the clip on and permanent mounts
    Not quite sure what you mean here. Would you care to elaborate?
    TO/EMT CVFD (1219)
    EMT GEMS
    CPT/EMT MVFD
    ---------------------------------------------------
    Proud Member of IACOJ
    ---------------------------------------------------
    9-11-01 Never Forget FDNY 343

  10. #10
    former FH.com member

    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    860

    Lightbulb these are clip on's

    Easily removed before entering a structure fire if you desire to. Others mount semi-permenantly to the helmet and are meant to stay on it when not in use. -46
    Last edited by SAFD46Truck; 02-04-2007 at 01:58 AM.

  11. #11
    Forum Member
    Weruj1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 1999
    Location
    NW Ohio
    Posts
    7,857

    Default

    ya know I think i know him !
    IACOJ both divisions and PROUD OF IT !
    Pardon me sir.. .....but I believe we are all over here !
    ATTENTION ALL SHOPPERS: Will the dead horse please report to the forums.(thanks Motown)
    RAY WAS HERE 08/28/05
    LETHA' FOREVA' ! 010607
    I'm sorry, I haven't been paying much attention for the last 3 hours.....what were we discussing?
    "but I guarentee you I will FF your arse off" from>
    http://www.firehouse.com/forums/show...60#post1137060post 115

  12. #12
    Forum Member
    Co11FireGal's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2002
    Location
    Country Roads, Take Me Home...
    Posts
    721

    Default

    I was having the same problem...for me it WAS the thing getting banged around in my gear bag, and I didn't even realize that I was being that rough on it. Most of our firefighters use ESS goggles, like two use bourkes, a few of us have goggles AND shields...wear the goggles on the back in case ya need them (for extrication mostly), have the shield for other stuff. I WOULD NOT use bourkes...I mean they look great, but I'm about being safe, not looking cool.
    IACOJ

    "And let us not grow weary while doing good, for in due season we shall reap it if we do not lose heart."

  13. #13
    Forum Member
    Bones42's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2001
    Location
    Pt. Beach, NJ
    Posts
    10,687

    Default

    I use 4" shield and a set of safety glasses from Home Depot. The shield protects most of my face and the glasses protect my eyes.
    "This thread is being closed as it is off-topic and not related to the fire industry." - Isn't that what the Off Duty forum was for?

  14. #14
    Forum Member
    Weruj1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 1999
    Location
    NW Ohio
    Posts
    7,857

    Default

    Hey Rich thanks for the search guy !
    IACOJ both divisions and PROUD OF IT !
    Pardon me sir.. .....but I believe we are all over here !
    ATTENTION ALL SHOPPERS: Will the dead horse please report to the forums.(thanks Motown)
    RAY WAS HERE 08/28/05
    LETHA' FOREVA' ! 010607
    I'm sorry, I haven't been paying much attention for the last 3 hours.....what were we discussing?
    "but I guarentee you I will FF your arse off" from>
    http://www.firehouse.com/forums/show...60#post1137060post 115

  15. #15
    former FH.com member

    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    860

    Default

    No prob Bro, use him wisely....and often.

  16. #16
    Early Adopter
    cozmosis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 1999
    Location
    Arkansas
    Posts
    1,925

    Question Goggle cover?

    All new eye protection in my department is ESS goggles. As shields break, they are being replaced with goggles. I'm content with mine, I guess.

    I keep them flipped to the back of my helmet when not in use. What I need now is a way to protect them from getting scratched up. I've seen photos of a wrap-around cover with a piece of reflective material sewn to it. Does anyone have any ideas where I could find something like that? What is it called, specifically?

  17. #17
    Forum Member
    Weruj1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 1999
    Location
    NW Ohio
    Posts
    7,857

    Default

    I believe it is called a "goggle garage"........and I think you can get them at Galls or www.thefirestore.com ........brb

    http://cms.firehouse.com/forums2/sho...=goggle+garage
    IACOJ both divisions and PROUD OF IT !
    Pardon me sir.. .....but I believe we are all over here !
    ATTENTION ALL SHOPPERS: Will the dead horse please report to the forums.(thanks Motown)
    RAY WAS HERE 08/28/05
    LETHA' FOREVA' ! 010607
    I'm sorry, I haven't been paying much attention for the last 3 hours.....what were we discussing?
    "but I guarentee you I will FF your arse off" from>
    http://www.firehouse.com/forums/show...60#post1137060post 115

  18. #18
    Early Adopter
    cozmosis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 1999
    Location
    Arkansas
    Posts
    1,925

    Default

    Goggle garage! Thanks for the help. I knew it had a catchy name, I just couldn't think of it.

  19. #19
    District Chief
    distchief60b's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2001
    Location
    Florida
    Posts
    6,413

    Default

    ESS makes a cover for the goggles....It even has reflective trim on it. I bought one at FDIC.
    09-11 .. 343 "All Gave Some..Some Gave ALL" God Bless..R.I.P.
    ------------------------------
    IACOJ Minister of Southern Comfort
    "Purple Hydrant" Recipient (3 Times)
    BMI Investigator
    ------------------------------
    The comments, opinions, and positions expressed here are mine. They are expressed respectfully, in the spirit of safety and progress. They do not reflect the opinions or positions of my employer or my department.

  20. #20
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Posts
    236

    Default

    I usually end up buying one or two every year, I've dropped the helmet and broke them; hit my head and broke them; been hit by flying/falling debris.

    But I always get this wide spread cracking around the top of the shield in the center, about an inch wide, and extending down a few centimeters.. I always wondered what caused that, I figure that's why they break so easily if I hit the shield on something.

    I keep a pair of those goggle on my helmet for wildfires; and general eye protection in case my shield fails. Of course you should never depend on just your shield for eye protection. I consider the shield useful to keep sparks and flying debris away from my face, and deflect water; other than that it's just there b/c we can't take it off.
    Last edited by blueeighty88; 12-17-2004 at 12:33 AM.

  21. #21
    Protective Economist
    Jonathan Bastian's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2002
    Posts
    966

    Default

    There are four reasons the faceshield could be cracking:
    1. Repeated exposure to heat. Since the shield gets heat on both sides and is normally in the up position, it will degrade faster than the helmet material.
    2. Exposure to ultraviolet. UV rays degrade all materials over time, including turnout gear and plastics (the shield). Obviously not an issue in a trunk, but it could play a role for places where the sun hits the gear rack regularly.
    3. Age. Just as turnout gear and boots are not built to last forever, neither are helmet components. As a general rule, replace your helmet when you replace your turnout gear...they have seen the same heat and abuse.
    4. Trauma. Vibrations, impacts and regular load-bearing can all cause plastic to crack. When I wore a shield, I always grabbed my helmet by the brim to avoid extra strain on the shield.

    Keep in mind that when you replace a faceshield, you want to buy the faceshield from the same manufacturer as the helmet (eg, don't put a Cairns shield on a Bullard helmet). Failure to do so voids the NFPA approval, especially since one manufacturer makes its own visors (rather than buying from an outside provider).

    For goggles, my choice has always been the InnerZone2 by ESS. It is the clip on version mentioned earlier in this thread. Again, if this is your primary eye protection and you remove the faceshield, buy the IZ2 goggles from your helmet manufacturer (I know Cairns and Bullard both offer versions). NFPA approval requires you buy from the helmet manufacturer.

    While removing the goggles prior to a training burn or actually entering a structure fire protects them and keeps them useful for things like venting a roof or cutting a car, technically it makes the helmet non-NFPA compliant. I took them off to save them, but I can't suggest that since it does void the approvals. After all, rules are rules, right?
    My comments are sometimes educated, sometimes informed and sometimes just blowing smoke...but they are always mine and mine alone and do not reflect upon anyone else (especially my employer).

  22. #22
    Forum Member
    RspctFrmCalgary's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Location
    Now in Victoria, BC. I'm from beautiful Jasper Alberta in the heart of the Can. Rockies - will always be an Albertan at heart!
    Posts
    6,329

    Default Re: Cracked faceshields. What's causing it?

    Originally posted by Firefighter1219
    As many of you know, I currently run with a volunteer department. We use tactical tupperware, with 4" faceshields. For some time now, I have been noticing small, minute cracks appearing on top of the face shield (upper rim).

    I carry my helmet in a gear bag in the trunk of my car. I do this because there is no room to keep gear on the engine, and I don't always respond to the station (ie if I'm close to the scene). I think the heat from being inside of the trunk of my car is causing the faceshield to crack. I have already lost one faceshield, and don't want to lose anymore.

    I don't have any other place to keep my gear, so I was wondering if anyone has had the same problem. What do you think is causing the cracks? Have you had the same problem? What can I do to keep this from happening?

    I will try to get some pictures so you can see what I am referring to.
    Is it a Scott? Don't know if this is the same thing, but I noticed the blurb while looking at the drywall thread link to FF Close Calls and wondered if it might be what you are experiencing .... probably not the same thing or someone else would have brought it up but oh well ... here ya go anyway:

    FIREFIGHTER WARNING-SCBA MASK CRACKING PROBLEMS NOTED AS SHOWN BELOW:

    Dear FirefighterCloseCalls.com

    We have been having problems at work with cracked Scott facepieces. I found a site that the Navy uses where a person can go to to see what the cracks looks like. Some are very subtle.
    September 11th - Never Forget

    I respect firefighters and emergency workers worldwide. Thank you for what you do.

    Sheri
    IACOJ CRUSTY CONVENTION CHAIR
    Honorary Flatlander

    RAY WAS HERE FIRST

  23. #23
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Posts
    236

    Default

    The face shields of a helmet, I assume, not the face piece of a self contained breathing apparatus.

    I do know, speaking on the SCBA issue, I've had a mask that leaked around the mfg seal of the actual rubber mask and transparent (plastic, safety glass?) "window" piece. Fortunatly the air only went out, and not back in.

  24. #24
    Forum Member
    RspctFrmCalgary's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Location
    Now in Victoria, BC. I'm from beautiful Jasper Alberta in the heart of the Can. Rockies - will always be an Albertan at heart!
    Posts
    6,329

    Default

    Ahhh ok ... thanks for explaining it to me
    September 11th - Never Forget

    I respect firefighters and emergency workers worldwide. Thank you for what you do.

    Sheri
    IACOJ CRUSTY CONVENTION CHAIR
    Honorary Flatlander

    RAY WAS HERE FIRST

  25. #25
    MembersZone Subscriber
    Firefighter1219's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Concord, Havana, FL USA
    Posts
    1,356

    Default

    I'm talking about the faceshield on my helmet, not on my mask. The helmet in in my avatar. We use Draeger airpacks, and the face pieces are just fine on them.

    My helmet is just over a year old now, and the faceshield let go in about 10 months. I can't think of what kind of helmet I have off of the top of my head.
    TO/EMT CVFD (1219)
    EMT GEMS
    CPT/EMT MVFD
    ---------------------------------------------------
    Proud Member of IACOJ
    ---------------------------------------------------
    9-11-01 Never Forget FDNY 343

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts

Log in

Click here to log in or register