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  1. #1
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    Question rescue ropes built into scba

    MSA has stepped up to the plate and built into their packs a kevlar lifeline designed to allow firefighters to egress out of situations like the FDNY had 2 weeks ago. Why hasn't other manufacturers done the same and how come in all the discussion on rescue ropes no one has addressed this.

    I happen to be a MSA supporter and make no attempt to hide it, the RIT connection on all modern airpacks is a version of the one MSA designed years ago and has been using for years.( I disagree with MSA only allowing use of the valve to recieve air on other manufacturers packs, where MSA packs can give or recieve, as if i'm in trouble i want the guy in other brands to be able to help me out)

    My point is that the built in "egress" line allows for a firefighter to get out of building from heights up to 75 feet.

    I know I am going to take hits from the Scott fan club but I am looking to start some discussion and hopefully make people think and demand other companys look at building these options into there packs. It isn't about what brand pack we use it's about us all coming home at the end of the day.

    Be safe!


  2. #2
    FIGJAM lutan1's Avatar
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    I've never seen or heard of such a thing- do you have any web links or similar showing the set up?

    My concern lies with the ratings of the SCBA harness and how the set has been fitted. I've seen plenty of operators in the heat of the moment (mind the pun) don it real quick and not adjust everything correctly and then theres a chance they may use it to escape a situation....
    Luke

  3. #3
    Forum Member RyanEMVFD's Avatar
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    Awhile back there was a Scott prototype that we got to play with down in Houston for a RIT class that had a built in class 4 harness. Down by the valve is a pouch that that groin straps pulls out from. It connected into the waist strap. Also the pull handle up top had a steel cable in it.

    This is the fire service. Change takes time, usually takes a LODD or two to convince people to change. Look at how long it took 2 In/2 Out to develop. This is the dark side of progression, it takes time to get technology or even simple stuff that we've should have had all along. It's not just equipment but procedures and training that is constantly evolving but not as fast as some would like.

    Sometimes the delay is simply because no one thought of something until it was needed, usually at the cost of someone's life. Necessity is the mother of invention.
    NREMT-P\ Reserve Volunteer Firefighter\Reserve Police Officer
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    Experts built the Titanic, amateurs built the Ark.

  4. #4
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    Check out the training power point and video on Tempe's site:

    http://www.tempe.gov/fire/training/e..._services_.htm

    This is an MSA pack with an added rescue system.

    Darrel Donatto, Battalion Commander
    Palm Beach Fire Rescue
    Palm Beach, FL
    Email) ddonatto@townofpalmbeach.com

  5. #5
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    heres the paragraph right off the msa website. will post link to site after the paragraph. To bad guys will let "brand loyality" to offset the wisdom of this unit. The Scott guys will see all kinds off things wrong with this.


    “Protecting the protector” has been our calling for 90 years, therefore, MSA works hard to provide firefighters with the most safety features available on any SCBA. MSA’s patented Quick-Fill® system makes every SCBA capable of both receiving and donating air to firefighters in need. Although the NFPA standard requires all brands of SCBA to incorporate the RIC connection, only the MSA air mask can make full utilization of the fitting with our exclusive transfilling capability. An NFPA-compliant emergency egress system, integral to the SCBA waist belt, is available as an option. This rescue belt comes complete with Kevlar line (50 feet or 75 feet) and rappelling hardware.

    Its out there it can save lives, please push to have this on your scba if you work multi level structures.

  6. #6
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    Wow, I'm impressed by the power point presentation.

    I think this is a terrific idea. There's little doubt that a WORKING system like this would have given the FDNYers a better shot.

  7. #7
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    The new airframe pack MSA offer's has a rating of 750 or 1000 pounds at the center beaner hole, the side handle have a 500 lb. rating. I think these weights are correct. We just purchased ten new MSA's and am trying to remember the weights. We did not get the rope option though. You cannot give air with a 3000lb. MSA it will only recieve air. The 2216's and the 4500's will give or recieve air.

  8. #8
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    RIT Rescue systems has been offering life lines integrated into SCBA and turnouts for 3 years? maybe longer. Check 'em out at
    http://www.ritrescuesystems.com/cont...ns.asp?topic=1

  9. #9
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    yeah you can add them on, I was pointing out that MSA builds an airpack with the egress line in it from the factory.

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    I have tested the RIT systems FRED belt. (firefighter rapid extrication/exit device) It basicly is a controled fall. But it is difficult to repack the device. Very Good Device.
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  11. #11
    MembersZone Subscriber mcaldwell's Avatar
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    Remember that Modern SCBA is only about 30 years old, and this slow development process is the way the industry works. You will almost certainly see this as optional or standard on all SCBA's in the next couple of years.

    It is like any other competitive industry, you can only R&D so many new initiatives at a time, so you go with what the customer asks for. Other initiatives like increased tank volumes, improved communications, RIT connections, etc... got priority for the last decade, so now it is time to move on to this. We shouldn't just look at what is missing on our gear and slag the manufacturers. Look at how far SCBA has come in such a short time.

    You are completely right however, in saying that if we ask for it, the manufacturers will build it. So we all know what to do now.
    Never argue with an Idiot. They drag you down to their level, and then beat you with experience!

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  12. #12
    Forum Member Bones42's Avatar
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    If manufacturers really cared about FF safety over making $$$, all the equipment would be interchangeable. My mask would fit your pack, your bottle would fit my pack, etc. Don't kid yourself into thinking they do any of this for our safety, they do it to make money.

    As for the rescue ropes, I'd rather see it not linked to the SCBA and be part of the PPE. Might be a rare occurrence, but let's say you have to do a "reduced profile" to get yourself out. A setup in the PPE could help in that situation.

    However, anything is better than nothing.
    "This thread is being closed as it is off-topic and not related to the fire industry." - Isn't that what the Off Duty forum was for?

  13. #13
    tny
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    I’m with you Bones, not a big fan of it build into the SCBA. In an emergency situation should conditions allow on the fire floor and floors below. My SCBA would be off my back prior to bail out. The extra weight (balance, etc) and SCBA equipment itself could cause additional injury if you had to drop beyond the ropes length or should it fail.

    Stay Safe

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