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  1. #1
    MembersZone Subscriber SmokeEater1's Avatar
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    Default IFSAC, ProBoard, NFPA Certifications

    Strictly based on opinions which is best and what is the difference in training and the delivery of classes/courses between these and other certification entities?
    I have no ambition in this world but one.. That is to be a Firefighter! The position in the eyes of some may appear to be a lowly one... It is a nobel calling


  2. #2
    District Chief distchief60b's Avatar
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    Default

    I know that Pro Board Certs are based on NFPA Standards and that is what most jurisdictions use for their training guidelines..... Not familiar with the other certification you mention.
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  3. #3
    Forum Member Res343cue's Avatar
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    Default

    None of them mean anything here...

    Just like the NREMT stuff, Vermont tweaks everything just a little bit, just so we can be different. Getting reciprocity here in VT can be a pain in the ***.
    Quote Originally Posted by ThNozzleMan
    Why? Because we are firemen. We are decent human beings. We would be compelled by the overwhelming impulse to save an innocent child from a tragic, painful death because in the end, we are MEN.

    I A C O J
    FTM-PTB


    Honorary Disclaimer: While I am a manufacturer representative, I am not here to sell my product. Any advice or knowledge shared is for informational purposes only. I do not use Firehouse.Com for promotional purposes.

  4. #4
    MembersZone Subscriber SmokeEater1's Avatar
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    Arrow Classes and Certification

    For all of those that are viewing this thread I am hoping to gain and share information with FF of different states, and to get into some elaborate training discussions.

    As for me I am familiar with the State of TN(NFPA) and NC (IFSAC). So here is the lowdown for me. I began my service in 1997 in North West NC w/a volley dept. They hosted a whopping 2 classes in 3 years. Hell until I was 20 yrs old I did not know what all classes with the required hours in each course composed FF I & II certification (granted it is different in about each state) It really disturbed me about the lack of classes being delivered to my volley dept. so I went to Tn. and was accepted to the NorthEast Tennessee Regional Fire Training Academy, where I obtained my Tn Level I and II certification in 3 months (400hrs). Then in turn I returned to NC which my hometown was only about 35 miles away, and jumped through loops and hoops trying to gain reciprocity. It did not happen due to the fact NC was IFSAC accredited and Tn was NFPA. So I began the FF I and II process over again. Upon completion of the 24 NC classes I concluded that the classes were identical. Tn was much more difficult with testing in each subject ranging from 75-150 questions in multiple choice, fill in the blank, matching, ect.. However in NC the tests are 10-30 questions multiple choice. Also in Tn there was much more practicals and JPR's vs. NC Program

    I was much more confident in my training and abilities from the TN academy as well as satisfied with the professional level of training/instruction I received. Granted I am comparing a professional academy to a different delivery agency.

    Here is my question having said all this: NFPA 1001 current edition dictates the standard of training, and by what I know IFSTA Essentials of FF 4th Edition is used as the basis for each class. Why is it then there are so many differnces from state to state and between certification entities?
    I have no ambition in this world but one.. That is to be a Firefighter! The position in the eyes of some may appear to be a lowly one... It is a nobel calling

  5. #5
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    Default Re: Classes and Certification

    Originally posted by SmokeEater1
    Here is my question having said all this: NFPA 1001 current edition dictates the standard of training, and by what I know IFSTA Essentials of FF 4th Edition is used as the basis for each class. Why is it then there are so many differnces from state to state and between certification entities?
    Basically, IFSAC and NBFSPQ (the "ProBoard") are accrediting bodies responsible for ensuring uniformity in the content and delivery of professional certification tests administered by agencies they accredit (just like there are such bodies in any other professional credentialization situation, governing the tests given to everyone from beauticians to electricians, accountants to doctors). IFSAC and NBFSPQ certification levels and tests are both based on NFPA standards, but there is room for interpretation in those standards on some points, so there are some differences between the two agencies with respect to how they go about the process.

    Any state can choose to accept as "valid certification" either IFSAC or NBFSPQ certs, both of them, neither of them (in which case, they probably set up their own certification program), or none at all. It's entirely up to the state government. This, of course, causes problems with reciprocity. In some cases, it can be worked out, and in others there is no effort to do so. For example, the PA State Fire Academy and its satellites are NBFSPQ accredited (and two satellietes hold dual accreditation with IFSAC on their own), but there is a process by which one can get an IFSAC certificate recognized in PA. In some other states, it's "take our test or else."

    As for why we have multiple systems instead of one...it's just because we can. There will always be state governments who think they can do a better job of almost anything than any outsiders could do, while others will welcome outsiders who can effectively do the work for them. It's just human nature, and it's not likely to change anytime soon.

  6. #6
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    Smile

    None of them mean anything here...

    Just like the NREMT stuff, Vermont tweaks everything just a little bit, just so we can be different. Getting reciprocity here in VT can be a pain in the ***.
    Actually, R343, Vermont is a Pro-Board state, since about a year ago.
    TW
    Essex Junction Fire Dept.
    Vermont

  7. #7
    Forum Member Res343cue's Avatar
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    Default

    Originally posted by TWEJFD


    Actually, R343, Vermont is a Pro-Board state, since about a year ago.
    I just barely found out about it Tuesday night when we were discussing how backwards Vermont still is. It's nice to atleast see some "national" credibility here in VT.

    Was one of the last things Ray helped push through, wasn't it?
    Quote Originally Posted by ThNozzleMan
    Why? Because we are firemen. We are decent human beings. We would be compelled by the overwhelming impulse to save an innocent child from a tragic, painful death because in the end, we are MEN.

    I A C O J
    FTM-PTB


    Honorary Disclaimer: While I am a manufacturer representative, I am not here to sell my product. Any advice or knowledge shared is for informational purposes only. I do not use Firehouse.Com for promotional purposes.

  8. #8
    MembersZone Subscriber SmokeEater1's Avatar
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    Post Driver/Operator: Engineer Cert.

    What kind of credentialing does other states have in place for D/O, Engineer, Chauffer Certification Programs? In NC its similar to the FF I & II program but not as long. Engine Cert. is about 120-140 hrs and Aerial Cert. is aobut 70-90 hrs. and each program comes in block classes. Each class being a part of the overall certification program..
    I have no ambition in this world but one.. That is to be a Firefighter! The position in the eyes of some may appear to be a lowly one... It is a nobel calling

  9. #9
    55 Years & Still Rolling hwoods's Avatar
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    Angry Same Old, Same Old......................

    No, it's not you folks, it's the discussion Topic. One of our big problems in the Fire/Rescue service, lack of ADOPTION of a National Standard. We have Standards in place for certifying training on a National basis, we just need Federal Legislation requiring each state to recognize these Training Certifications for what they really are: Formal Training/Education taught to a commonly accepted standard. Firefighter II should be the same in Maryland and New Mexico, after all, the Fire is the same, the apparatus carries the same builder's names, the water is H2o, and almost everything else is the same. This debate is not about Quality of Training and Education in the Fire Service, it's about greed and isolationism. The amount of money that an individual, or his/her department, must shell out for a Fire Training Class, IN SOME STATES, is nothing short of Criminal. Period. Each state should be required to accept National Pro Board Certifications, regardless of what other state issued them, without reservation. AND, they should accept NREMT Certifications as well. This requirement could easily be folded into legislation that funds Homeland Security Grants for the states. Fire Service Training should be handled at the State level, with each state providing FREE training for all personnel. Who pays? The State's General Fund should provide funding as a line item in the State budget each year. Maryland handles Fire, Rescue, and EMS Training thru the Maryland Fire and Rescue Institute ( www.MFRI.org ) which is an arm of the University of Maryland. Is this the perfect system? I don't really know. It IS better than most, in quality of Training, and in cost and accessability. As is my usual approach, I don't complain without offering ideas on how to improve the situation. Here's where I think we should go with this:
    1. Contact the National Volunteer Fire Council, Demand that they get off their butts and do something positive, in this case, work hard to have a single Cohesive National System. (Merge the several different systems into one, preferably the NBFSPQ)
    2. Contact your Senators and Congressmen, demanding that they institute legislation to require the states to use and recognize a National standard for Training.
    These two things should give all of us something to do for a while. And, for those of you who are Full time and members of the IAFF, the Union should get involved also. A National system would make job changes easier. PLEASE Don't drop this in a day or two, keep after it.
    Last edited by hwoods; 03-20-2005 at 03:07 PM.
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