1. #1
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Posts
    5

    Default new vol with questions

    Hey everyone I am a vol that has been with my dept. for about 4-5 months now, and I respond too alot of calls in my personal vehical. and somtimes I get to the seen just before the responing pumper or right behind them and sence I am not riding on the truck I don't know ther plan of attack for the situation at hand and somtimes feel like I am out of place. Can anyone give me some tips on what to do especially if I am first on the seen. I think if i get a radio in my truck that will help, but I would like too know what everone elses tips are especially for vehical accidents.

  2. #2
    MembersZone Subscriber

    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    Emmetsburg, IA
    Posts
    95

    Default

    I don't know the policies in your area, but my first thought is, "Don't respond in your personal vehicle."

    Again, I don't know all of the circumstances, but keep in mind, that you cannot do anything of use at a fire scene without your gear and a truck. Now, I'm not saying that you should NEVER respond in your own vehicle - for example, I wouldn't drive past a fire to respond to the station when I knew the trucks were already in route. But, I've seen some departments have a dozen firefighters arrive in their personal vehicles, and nobody went to the station to get a truck. Doesn't do much good.

    99% of the time that I respond, I go directly to the station first. There is almost always a truck that still needs to go. I've seen the chief tell someone who has driven their car to the scene to go back to the station to get a truck that we need at the scene.

    Even if your personal vehicle was a fire engine, you wouldn't do much good responding alone - you can't run the pump and the nozzle at the same time.

    Just my thought on the issue. If you have more info that might explain why you respond in your own vehicle, let me know - gotta know the whole story before I can give a good answer.

    Also - welcome to the ranks! Glad to have you in the brotherhood.

  3. #3
    District Chief
    distchief60b's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2001
    Location
    Florida
    Posts
    6,413

    Default

    Dare I even start????

    First and foremost with only 4-5 months on you do not have the experience and background to make the appropriate decisions (by your own admission). Go to the station and respond on the unit. That way you will learn from others and see how things operate. A radio in your car will not help.

    As far as accidents go....well...again,....with 4-5 months on...what is your level of training? Again...go to the station and ride the equipment.

    I know that a lot of departments let people respond POV and if that is what works for them, far be it for me to say....change that.. But in a new person's case.....GO to the Station.

    How old are u? What is your level of fire training? Level of EMS Training?

    My last thought......check your spelling before you post!
    09-11 .. 343 "All Gave Some..Some Gave ALL" God Bless..R.I.P.
    ------------------------------
    IACOJ Minister of Southern Comfort
    "Purple Hydrant" Recipient (3 Times)
    BMI Investigator
    ------------------------------
    The comments, opinions, and positions expressed here are mine. They are expressed respectfully, in the spirit of safety and progress. They do not reflect the opinions or positions of my employer or my department.

  4. #4
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Posts
    5

    Default

    OK I am 23, I have basic first aid skills, and I don't respond directly to the seen if i have too pass an engine house to get ther. I spend alot of time at the engine houses in my off time 2 to 3 days a week so I am learning alot. I do respond to the engine house to be on standby alot. But most of our calls are at night when ther are only two firefighters on duty at one of our three houses. so if they have a working fire they will need people to respond to help and if i can get ther 10 min before the next truck then i can be of use. I can't drive the trucks so ther is resone to pass the seen to ride the next truck. I dont think i know everything and i want to learn so i can be the best at what i do, I realy think that this could be a carrer for me. All criticism is welcome thanks.

  5. #5
    Junior Member

    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Posts
    19

    Default RESPONSES IN P.O.V

    In my township,we are paid on call. we have to be approved for emergency drive status, tested continuously, and complete a probation period of 1 year, probation doesnt end till one meets all certification listed in our s.o.g's, and you cart the big guy himself (chief) to and from where he wants.
    My advice, WATCH YOUR *****!!!!!!
    when you respond, lights &siren or not, people notice. And taxpayers love nothing more than to complain about what they pay for. We have s.o.g's for response to incidents. A good point made was that you cant do the job without the right equipment. Learn your s.o.p's and know what to do. If you're not sure, ask. The only stupid question is the one not asked. 90% of the time I drive directly to the station unless the call is a medical that is close to home.

    Do you carry your gear in your vehicle?

    I can understand your frusteration with not knowing what to do when being the first one on scene, but remember you are a representative of the fire dept. so if you show up and run around like its a chinese fire drill, youll hear about it.

    Im not trying to sound like you richard cranium, or a know it all, take it from a fellow firefighter, ive been there, and done that. Use discretion that you will gain with time and experience. definately let us know the whole story though, about your experience, and training.

  6. #6
    Junior Member

    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    4

    Default

    I would agree with the others in this topic I would say respond to the hall first and formost.. your gear is there and also so the senior memebers. Like it was said before don't drive by an incident to get to the hall. We are NOT allowed to respond in private vehicles at all.
    Welcome to the family and keep learning you will never know everything there is always something different with fire! That is why we love it!

  7. #7
    Junior Member

    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Posts
    19

    Default reply to reply

    sorry about the last paragraph. i meant to type "im not trying to sound like a richard cranium" sorry bout that.

    just take your time and listen to what the others, especially officers tell you.

  8. #8
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Posts
    5

    Default

    OK so I am starting to think that responding in mersonal vehical is not such a good idea even though it considered ok by my dept. I just can't see my self passin an insident when i know they need more people on the seen. I never drive over the speed limit,and i stop at all stop signs/lights and i carry my gear in my truck.

  9. #9
    Forum Member
    RyanEMVFD's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 1999
    Location
    Why? It's not like you're going to visit me! But I'm near Waco, Texas
    Posts
    2,386

    Default

    One reason why I don't like POV responses is I wouldn't want anything to happen to my POV once it is on a scene. A lot of things can happen, a bystander steals it, a wall collapses on it, it gets hit by a fire truck, countless things can happen.
    NREMT-P\ Reserve Volunteer Firefighter\Reserve Police Officer
    IACOJ Attack

    Experts built the Titanic, amateurs built the Ark.

  10. #10
    Forum Member
    Weruj1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 1999
    Location
    NW Ohio
    Posts
    7,857

    Default

    Here is the only question I have at this minute ........... what do your SOG/P's say about what your units do once they arrive at a given scene ?
    IACOJ both divisions and PROUD OF IT !
    Pardon me sir.. .....but I believe we are all over here !
    ATTENTION ALL SHOPPERS: Will the dead horse please report to the forums.(thanks Motown)
    RAY WAS HERE 08/28/05
    LETHA' FOREVA' ! 010607
    I'm sorry, I haven't been paying much attention for the last 3 hours.....what were we discussing?
    "but I guarentee you I will FF your arse off" from>
    http://www.firehouse.com/forums/show...60#post1137060post 115

  11. #11
    MembersZone Subscriber

    Join Date
    Oct 2002
    Location
    Wisconsin
    Posts
    301

    Default

    Here is couple of other reasons not to respond in your POV:
    1. Liability-Does your insurance carrier aware of your additional vehicle uses?
    2. Accountability-From an incident command standpoint, it is difficult for any IC to account for people who show up in POV's.
    3. Can you effectively make a life saving difference by responding to the scene? If you get to a fire first with entrapment, The first reaction is going to be to get inside and make a save. Who knows what you are doing and where you are located?

    Just a couple points to ponder. Remember..YOUR safety is first.

  12. #12
    MembersZone Subscriber

    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Posts
    216

    Default

    From someone who response in the POV:

    In my department majority of us respond POV because that is the only way we can. We have One Engine and One Tank. Now before I go futher into the topic I will say I onced volunteered in a department were it was easier for me to respond to the station first.

    Now my current station covers about 110 sqaure miles with the one station. Example of a typical run for us to one of the county lines is 30 or so miles from station. I will say now that if we get a structure out there we are not protecting or saving much becuase it will take at least 20 mins to get there. Now most of our firefighters respond POV because myself, chief, one LT, One Capt, three firefighters and one JR live within 3 miles of the station. Our trucks will hold all together only 6 people(both trucks together).

    As a department we use Two-Way radios for communication. So we know who is getting the trucks and who is not. If the Capt and Chief get the trucks before I am at the end of my road I will respond POV. I carry my gear with me, for several reasons. SOme of the members don't.

    I said that because I know many don't believe in POV's but if you can ever experience my area you will see it is needed.

    Now I am not sure how your department is set up and I 100% agree with the others of follow the SOP/SOG and By-laws.

    YOu have been int he service for 5 months at the max. Beleive me and I think others will agree, that with the little experience you have you will feel like you are of place. But your not your really just not experience, once you get a few years under your belt the scene will start coming more to you. My best advise is to just be there and work. Now if you arrive before them, just get your head and don't do something stupid.

    For the others, I am not sure our everyone else dpes it. But my department will cover any damage to my vehicle in the response to and from a call. My insurance rpovide does know what I use the vehicle for and it is covered.
    Thanks
    DM
    ___________
    "I am telling the truth, I was driving through the warehouse and the wall jumped in front of my fork lift. I honked the horn and it never listened."

  13. #13
    MembersZone Subscriber

    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Posts
    8

    Default

    i agree with what the others are saying but like they pointed at we don't know what your sop's are. in my department we are forbidden to respond in our own vehicles for several reasons. you can't do much without the engine or rescue be it a fire or mva. second if everyone responds in thier own vehicle they seldom think about apparatus placement and many times the personal vehicles are just in the way. third like you said in your first post you havent talked to anyone and you have no radio to give them a scene size up so in my opinion you would be better to respond on the fire apparatus. I commend you on volunteering and i know you get excited when the call comes in which is another reason i think you should respond to the firehouse. Talk to your officers and Train as much as you can.." Train how you fight and fight how you train " Be Safe and pay attention to the people around you and you will be fine. best of luck to you.

  14. #14
    MembersZone Subscriber
    firepimp's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    Citrus County , FL
    Posts
    187

    Default

    Responding POV is horrible , you can't do anything , you don't have the training nor the expierience.

    I am on a volly department as well , we are allowed to respond POV if passing the scene in route to the station or right around the corner , and pretty much going POV and getting on scene first the only thing you can do that would help is give a decent scene size up so to know how much support is needed and what trucks . If you respond to a scene POV and trucks are on scene DON'T , or stop ask if they need help with patient care because you can always grab some gloves and provide assistance to ems , but other than that respond to the station a radio will not help anything than temp. you to respond more in POV .

    I have stopped plenty of times POV and then left when the first truck arrived , and responded to the station , instead of a radio use a cell phone I have a back number in my cell phone programmed to dispatch instead of calling 911 I call fire and give them a scene size up without creating hassle.

    I don't know what training you have but being 4 - 5 months probably not much so what does that mean ?? You cannot perform much correctly no matter what you've seen or think you know , you are creating a liability hazard just incase your ever on scene and screw up , your on a path to getting yourself in trouble and the department and showing a bad image to the community.

    I'm sorry if I saound like an a-hole but I think all of what i said might help you out some , I only have a year in the department but I know my limits rules and the proper things to do , I have very wise and authoritive senior members who i listen and watch with open ears and eyes , as well I took alot of training before and while Im still a volly member. As well I learn alot on every different scene my department runs about 130 calls a month more or less and make at least 70 of them a month , Im good friends with 3 of the chiefs , and many officers so on poker nights I ask questions , learn and train from them they've been doing this longer than I've been born so ask them questions instead of comeing on here and asking them we don't know your area , department and also attitude ask a senior officer or just someone that's cool enough to talk with about , it's a little embarressing maybe to ask questions that you think are stupid on your department but you never know you may learn alot from what they say and they may as well.
    Last edited by firepimp; 03-18-2005 at 06:59 AM.
    " We are not extraordinary people , we are people caught in extraordinary situations. " Chapter 1 IFSTA Manual

  15. #15
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Posts
    197

    Default

    Hey Charlie...
    I'm in a very rural area and sometimes its most convenient for some of us to respond in pov's, even though we're supposed to respond to the station. Some guys and gals may feel that its not correct to respond in a personal vehicle, but it's a matter of life or death for our area. I live 8 miles from the station and can make it to the scene quicker than to the station before the trucks roll. We're all volunteer by the way.
    In regards to MVAs, that's a critical incident in most cases and CPR and/or 1st aid are needed almost always. If I respond to a MVA and am first on scene, I just jump in. Our size up of the incident can save responding units some time when they arrive, and you can at least direct EMS to more critical patients by having that knowledge. Don't just wait for the trucks.
    If I respond to any type of run and the trucks are already there, I usually find the IC and ask what they want me to do. They're in charge and know who's doing what most of the time.
    Some of us may butt heads about this and tell me how wrong it is to respond pov, but if I can drive to the scene and begin resuscitation or whatever I'm able to do, then I will.

  16. #16
    MembersZone Subscriber

    Join Date
    Oct 2002
    Location
    indianapolis
    Posts
    273

    Default my thoughts

    Charlie,
    I live in a rural area that covers about 120 sq miles with a primary station and one sub-station. There are many times that we will go past a fire or incident to get to the station. But we don't want a bunch of POV on scene so the only people that keep their gear with them is the Chiefs and the Captain. The LT don't get to keep their gear with them. We do this to ensure that enough people turn out to the station to get the trucks to the scene, provide a more organized response, provide for accountability and minimize confusion on scene.
    Let me give you an illustration about what happens when you have pov response. I was at my in laws house in another state and someone next door threw an old fiberglass boat on the burn pile and it put out this thick black smoke. Someone called it in as a structure fire. Anyway as I was watching, I start seeing all these cars and pickups start showing up. Some had bunker gear some didn't. The street was lined with them. I walked up to listen to the radio when I heard people asking where the truck was. Apparently all these guys had shown up to the scene, One guy went to the station to get the truck and he went to a different fire! They had gotten 2 calls about the location and he went to a controlled burn 3 miles away. So there they were 10 firefighters some with gear some without and not a truck to be seen at a possible structure fire. And the truck was at a fire with only one guy! I was thankful that it was only a controlled burn at both locations and not anything serious.
    My point is this, POV response by members is a bad idea. There is no safety in it, yes it is hard to pass a scene and not stop but remember that you can't save lives if you are not properly equipped. This requires a truck and gear. Yes sometimes we put ourselves into unsafe situations to save lives. But they are calculated and planned. An uncontrolled scene is not properly planned out.
    Stay safe, Go home after each call,

  17. #17
    MembersZone Subscriber
    sdff1520's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2001
    Location
    SD
    Posts
    322

    Default

    Options:
    1. Do not respond POV

    2. Arrive on scene chase the "looky-loos" away and wait for apparatus to arrive and establish command.

  18. #18
    MembersZone Subscriber

    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Posts
    216

    Default

    I agree with no using a POV if you can.

    Just some thoughts.

    1) we train for truck and POV placement.
    2) we use Two-Ways so we can do a scene size up
    3) if you don't have gear you go home, we tried the gear at station and it didn't work.
    4) Since we have to get to the station via POV and we have Two-Way radios we make sure someone takes a truck, unless it is a EMT call.
    5) untill you have your 90 days in you are not to respond to a fire,
    Unless you have completed the State Basic Firefighter and issued gear.
    6) If needed like us you can clear a path out to get to the house.

    I have agrued with my chief that we need a truck with jump seats so people like me who happen to drive a little slower then most like can gear up and pack up. And since we are int he mountains majority of the roads and drive ways are very narrow, POV can jam them up. So if we can jam all the people that live close to the station in the truck less mess.
    Thanks
    DM
    ___________
    "I am telling the truth, I was driving through the warehouse and the wall jumped in front of my fork lift. I honked the horn and it never listened."

  19. #19
    Forum Member
    fireguy919's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    eastern Ohio
    Posts
    952

    Default

    if your dept. runs that way thats fine. but if you dont have the exp. you should wait till a truck shows up before you pull in. if you can have a good effect on scence stop if not go to staton. if your not running red most people wont know your in the fd. like someone else said if you beat the truck in doesnt look good with the residents. and they will bad mouth you because they dont understand. from the sounds of it your on your way to learning. no one ever knows everything about this bussiness and if they think they do they should get out before someone gets killed. be safe learn from other and dont be afraid to ask questions good luck.

  20. #20
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    Bossier Parrish, Louisiana
    Posts
    10,676

    Default

    In our department, and in fact most of the departments in this area, generally only the drivers respond to the stations as we cover 120 miles with 5 stations and drivers are instructed to roll immediattly. We do not wait for crews, and in a lot of cases a truck will not roll from every station, even for structure fires, as they are each assigned "response zones" and may be assigned as 2nd alarm companies. If your SOP says that you respond to the scene .. FOLLOW YOUR DEPARTMENT'S SOPs and respond to the scene!!!

    Here on some things you can do while waiting:

    Put on your gear slowly. Take this time to calm down and gather
    your wits.

    Calmy assure scene safety by controlling the homeowners or bystanders from doing anything dumb and creating a safety zone.

    Assure scene access by watching the driveway or the area in the front of the building and chasing away those who may want to park there to watch.

    Gather information for your arriving officers:
    Is everyone out?
    Where is the electrical lines? The natural gas meter?
    Are there any propane tanks in the rear being impinged by flames?
    What is the satus of the roof - stable, sagging?
    Are the walls starting to bow out?
    Look for a hydrant? Protect it from look-e-loos.
    Assess the road for stability.

    POVs can respond safely to the scene and in some situations, it is necessary that they do due to the size of the district. Talk to an officer or senior man you trust and he may be able to pass on words of wisdom and guideance in accordance with your SOPs.
    Last edited by LaFireEducator; 03-18-2005 at 07:41 PM.

  21. #21
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    Reiffton Fire Company, Exeter, PA
    Posts
    402

    Default

    Okay, this is a pet peeve of mine. I keep my gear at both of the stations I run at, thus I always go there. In fact I was told by my chief once that if the call is one where gear isn't required, and I'd be passing it going to the station, then go to the call (it came about from a construction accident at a school construction site across from my development, and him passing me on the way there while I was on the way to the station). Since then, and that was about two years ago, I think I've gone to four calls POV. That way makes sense, HOWEVER:

    In my Berks County company, we have a few peopleople go POV to a scene and then their excuse is always "It was closer than the station." Well, I started noticing that no matter where in the twp. the call was, it was somehow closer to their house than the station and they would always wack in in their POV's. That's when I start to get annoyed, ESPECIALLY when they try to take the line from me. I think everyone, except for officers, should have to keep their gear at the station, to avoid, what some of you have said, a whole bunch of POV's at the scene (especially since everyone who does it seems to park where the apparatus has to go....)

  22. #22
    Early Adopter
    cozmosis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 1999
    Location
    Arkansas
    Posts
    1,925

    Default

    I think your intentions are good. You became a firefighter to help people... and that's what you want to do. It makes sense to you to stop at the scene and take action instead of responding. If that's allowed in your department, that might be okay eventually. But not now...

    You don't learn what to do on scene through an Internet message board. You learn by listening to instruction from your officers, by watching more experienced members do the job and by doing the work yourself. Do yourself a favor and respond to the scene, ride out on the rig, put your time in and you'll learn the job.

  23. #23
    MembersZone Subscriber

    Join Date
    Dec 2000
    Posts
    1,719

    Default

    I'll second Cozmosis' post. Go to the station and ride the apparatus with more experienced members.

    Working (and more importantly learning) as part of a team will reduce your frustration and anxiety.
    FTM-PTB-DTRT

  24. #24
    Forum Member
    snowball's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2000
    Location
    Just North of South Central
    Posts
    2,740

    Default

    I work for a combination department, all of our PCF's have been instructed to stage away from the scene untill the first engine arrives.
    This helps in two ways
    #1 thier pov won't be in the way for incoming equipment. The bigger the scene the farther away you park.
    #2 The public (most of wich do not know we are a combination department)won't see a person standing around in turnouts doing nothing during an emergency.

    I understand your situation, if you have people staffing at the station, then going there means you will probably miss the boat.

  25. #25
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Posts
    5

    Default

    Thanks everyone. You have all given me some good advice and I think it will help me. thank you very much everyone.

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts

Log in

Click here to log in or register