1. #1
    MembersZone Subscriber
    SkipJack270's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2002
    Location
    New Haven, CT
    Posts
    110

    Default Lighters And The Airheads In Gov't

    I just recently read a report on CNN about lighters, and their being restricted from airline travel. By going to Zippo's website, it allows you to e-mail your elected reps about the issue. Here is a letter I sent. Tell me what you think, and also, if you know of someway I could get this submitted to different news agency's, I'd be most appreciative.
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~
    To Whom It May Concern;
    I just recently read in the news that all lighters are now being banned from on-board aircraft. While I believe in airline safety, and understand that the government is trying to protect the citizens, I think that this is not the right way to go about it. I understand, both from the news and from reading the laws, that this legislation was enacted due to the gentleman who tried to ignite his shoes on an airline flight. It would seem to me that this law has a few fatal flaws:
    - According to all of the research I did, I could not find a single incident (NOT ONE) where a lighter was either used as a weapon on-board an aircraft, nor any case where a lighter posed a threat to the safety and security of the aircraft. ( In the case of Zippos, true, you could hide something inside of it. Unless of course you ask the person to open the lighter, remove the mechanism, and show the cotton underneath. You make people with laptops turn them on and then deem them "safe", don't you?
    - If you are going to go to such an absurd length as banning lighters, lets take it a step further: Lets first ban shoes, because that was where the guy hide the contraband in the first place. So, no shoes allowed. Next, let's go ahead and ban flint and steel. As you may or may not know, flint and steel can create a spark, thereby bringing flame. Also, speaking of spark, you should definatly ban anything that runs on electricity, like cell phones, laptops, PDA's, walkmans, even flashlights. In the right hands (or in the hoplessly ignorant), you can cross wire them and get them to spark. Lets see how well that kind of law goes over with the business travelers.
    - Finally, it would seem to me that if you stopped wasting money on stupid things such as this ban, and instead put it toward the screeners and the equipment, maybe you'd catch more of the stuff before it ever got on-board. It would seem to me (though I am no expert on the subject) that if you could catch the wackos, terrorists, and nuts before they ever made it on-board, you'd make flying a hell of a lot safer.
    So, in closing, I would like to thank you, again, for squashing those things which you claim to hold so dear: My civil liberties. It wasn't enough that you had to ban smoking in "public venues". Now, you want to mess with us when we travel?
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~
    Isiah 43: When you walk through the fire,
    you will not be burned;
    the flames will not set you ablaze
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    9-11-01. We Will Never Forget You.

  2. #2
    MembersZone Subscriber
    SkipJack270's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2002
    Location
    New Haven, CT
    Posts
    110

    Default

    P.S. For reference, this was posted after I got an hours sleep between a duoble shift at my job (security guard.) SO, please excuse the randomness and the idiocy.
    Isiah 43: When you walk through the fire,
    you will not be burned;
    the flames will not set you ablaze
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    9-11-01. We Will Never Forget You.

  3. #3
    MembersZone Subscriber

    Join Date
    Jul 1999
    Location
    Flanders, NJ
    Posts
    13,537

    Default

    Zippo is a company with a history of blatant self-interest. Remember when they were sanctioned by the CPSC two years ago for their website showing kids how to perform tricks with their lighters?

  4. #4
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Waterboro, Maine
    Posts
    520

    Default

    Does this ban include matches and other possible ignition sources, or is it specifically"lighters"?

  5. #5
    Senior Member

    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Syracuse , NY
    Posts
    138

    Default

    The ban is on lighters only. You are allowed to carry matches (3 books,I think) on the plane.

    I flew home from Orlando yeterday and surrendered my lighter (that I bought for 99 cents in Florida) to the TSA agent.We flew into Chicago and had a 4 hour layover. I went outside to have a cigar and found 4 lighters left on the ashtry outside , right by the entrance door.I sure hope no kid walks by and grabs one.I tossed the four I saw into the trash but I'm sure others will leave some more.

    Yes mister TSA , lets take the lighters away from the adults.

  6. #6
    MembersZone Subscriber
    mglax13's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Location
    Mineola, New York
    Posts
    175

    Default

    I work at JFK airport part time for a security company that a guy in my FD owns. I deal with the TSA everyday, and I hope that no one here works for the TSA and reads this, but TSA literally means "Thousands Standing Around". I can't even begin to go on about the stuff that I've seen get through the TSA. A number of people I've spoken to including myself have made it through there with items that could have caused a major problem. I choose not to post certain specific stories about the TSA here because if someone were to read about these security breaches that they allow, I could probably get into some kind of trouble. I'm sure just saying what I've already said has made my FBI file grow a little. Lets just say that they're all smoke and mirrors.
    MFD Truck 2
    The Workhorse Company

  7. #7
    MembersZone Subscriber

    Join Date
    Jul 1999
    Location
    Flanders, NJ
    Posts
    13,537

    Default

    Originally posted by Parrothead
    The ban is on lighters only. You are allowed to carry matches (3 books,I think) on the plane.

    I flew home from Orlando yeterday and surrendered my lighter (that I bought for 99 cents in Florida) to the TSA agent.We flew into Chicago and had a 4 hour layover. I went outside to have a cigar and found 4 lighters left on the ashtry outside , right by the entrance door.I sure hope no kid walks by and grabs one.I tossed the four I saw into the trash but I'm sure others will leave some more.

    Yes mister TSA , lets take the lighters away from the adults.
    There is nothing wrong with not allowing lighters on an aircraft. You can't smoke on the plane anyway. You can carry matches. You can ask someone for a light.

    This is just another example of smokers thinking they are a priveleged class of people. (How many other classes of people get to take sanctioned breaks in designated areas of a workplace to abuse an addictive substance?)

  8. #8
    Senior Member

    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Syracuse , NY
    Posts
    138

    Default

    Ever try to light a cigar with a match in the wind?

    This is just another example of smokers thinking they are a priveleged class of people.
    Yes , I feel priveleged. I get to go outside when it's 10 degrees and snowing if I want to enjoy a cigar.

    Let's remember that tobacco is still a legal product for adults. The zealots haven't been able to stop the sale of it (yet).

  9. #9
    MembersZone Subscriber
    SkipJack270's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2002
    Location
    New Haven, CT
    Posts
    110

    Default

    Originally posted by Parrothead
    Ever try to light a cigar with a match in the wind?



    Yes , I feel priveleged. I get to go outside when it's 10 degrees and snowing if I want to enjoy a cigar.

    Let's remember that tobacco is still a legal product for adults. The zealots haven't been able to stop the sale of it (yet).
    I second that. Also, let me add that smokers, being that we are a relativly small majority (as compared to drinkers) are also taxed unfairly. If you really wanted to get some money, tax firewater at the same rates as tobacco. Oh, that's right, drunks only kill themselves with their chosen vice, right? Wrong. DUI MVA. 'nuff said.
    Isiah 43: When you walk through the fire,
    you will not be burned;
    the flames will not set you ablaze
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    9-11-01. We Will Never Forget You.

  10. #10
    Forum Member
    DeputyChiefGonzo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2000
    Location
    Somewhere between genius and insanity!
    Posts
    13,586

    Default

    Originally posted by GeorgeWendtCFI


    There is nothing wrong with not allowing lighters on an aircraft. You can't smoke on the plane anyway. You can carry matches. You can ask someone for a light.

    This is just another example of smokers thinking they are a priveleged class of people. (How many other classes of people get to take sanctioned breaks in designated areas of a workplace to abuse an addictive substance?)
    It would be very interesting to total up the time that smokers leave their work stations, light up and then return during the course of a day... then the non smokers can demand the same courtesy in the form of an extended lunch break!
    ‎"The education of a firefighter and the continued education of a firefighter is what makes "real" firefighters. Continuous skill development is the core of progressive firefighting. We learn by doing and doing it again and again, both on the training ground and the fireground."
    Lt. Ray McCormack, FDNY

  11. #11
    MembersZone Subscriber
    pvfire424's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    Kansas City Mo
    Posts
    667

    Default

    Hey Gonzo , then who would do all the work ?

  12. #12
    MembersZone Subscriber
    SkipJack270's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2002
    Location
    New Haven, CT
    Posts
    110

    Default

    Valid arguments as though they may be, somehow the label "class of people" just doesn't work for me. Makes smokers seem like a lower class of person. I am willing to bet that many, many more people are closet drunks and "nip of the bottle" types than there are smokers. As previously stated, DUIs and alcohol induced crimes, I would wager, are a much larger problem than smokers.
    Isiah 43: When you walk through the fire,
    you will not be burned;
    the flames will not set you ablaze
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    9-11-01. We Will Never Forget You.

  13. #13
    Forum Member
    firenresq77's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2000
    Location
    Northwest Ohio
    Posts
    5,213

    Default

    This ban started the day before I was flying to New York. I didn't really understand it....... From what I read, you are allowed to have matches on your person, but no lighter. You are not allowed to have either in your luggage.........

    Here's another thing I thought about when I was in a gift shop there...... Many people collect Zippos. You see them all the time with different designs........ What are you supposed to do if you buy one as a gift or to collect? Can you open it to prove there is no fluid in it or that there has been no fluid in it???


    This is just another example of smokers thinking they are a priveleged class of people. (How many other classes of people get to take sanctioned breaks in designated areas of a workplace to abuse an addictive substance?)
    What about the coffee drinkers out there? Many of them have to get up and go get their coffee in another area. They take just as many, if not more, breaks than smokers. Plus, what happens when you drink all that coffee?? You're going to have to pee more often, which means you will be away from your desk.........

    At my job there are non-smokers that are gone more often than the smokers.
    The comments made by me are my opinions only. They DO NOT reflect the opinions of my employer(s). If you have an issue with something I may say, take it up with me, either by posting in the forums, emailing me through my profile, or PMing me through my profile.
    We are all adults so there is no need to act like a child........
    IACOJ

  14. #14
    Senior Member

    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    Salem, Massachusetts
    Posts
    422

    Default

    I agree that this ban of lighters is terrible!. The only thing bad about it is that it didn't include matches!!!
    Caffeine is the key to motivation!

  15. #15
    Senior Member

    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Syracuse , NY
    Posts
    138

    Default

    BTW - I forgot to mention,I don't get smoke breaks.I smoke when I can.I'm a Fire Fighter. If it was truly a break , I wouldn't have to do ANYTHING 'til it was over,such as answer the call when the bell hits.

    Then again , I don't get meal breaks , bathroom breaks, ..........

  16. #16
    MembersZone Subscriber
    SkipJack270's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2002
    Location
    New Haven, CT
    Posts
    110

    Default

    This is probably a sentiment that should have gone in the introduction, but I want to make something clear, in case anybody out there has a bad image of me: I smoke, yes. Yes, second hand smoke is possibly worse than the original drag. However, I only smoke A - When I am by myself, in my car. B- In an outside enviroment, when there are no kids around. C- When people ask if I can move and not smoke near them or whatever, I oblige. It's my vice, not theirs. So, when I originally wrote the letter, I didn't want to come off as somebody who didn't give two whatsis about what other people think. I do my best to be responsible about it, and keep it to myself, as much as possible. It's just that, when viewed with other legal forms of vice and indulgments, it seems as though, on a lot of fronts, smokers get ragged on the worst. Before anybody says, I know smoking is bad, it will kill me, etc, etc, etc. So could walking across the street, or climbing that ladder, or even eating that partially chewed food. However, I enjoy it, and for now, that's good enough for me.
    Isiah 43: When you walk through the fire,
    you will not be burned;
    the flames will not set you ablaze
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    9-11-01. We Will Never Forget You.

  17. #17
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Waterboro, Maine
    Posts
    520

    Default

    Nothing like that first smoke after a long flight.

  18. #18
    Forum Member
    SafetyPro's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Location
    Santa Cruz, CA
    Posts
    486

    Default

    As a point of clarification on matches, only "safety matches" are allowed on aircraft. "Strike anywhere" matches are not permitted.

    The ban went into effect the week before I left for vacation in Australia. One thing that wasn't adequately thought out is that most every other country and airline in the world allows lighters on aircraft. Which means that now every country has to warn passengers heading to the U.S. that they can't bring their lighter in with them (because the law is written such that even if a flight originates internationally, lighters aren't allowed if the plane is LANDING in the U.S.). Which meant that when I came back, Qantas had a special security check just for our flight to ensure everyone knew lighters were banned.

    BTW, I'm a non-smoker, I just think its a stupid rule and don't see that it adds anything to my safety as a flier.
    Chris Gaylord
    Emergency Planner / Fire Captain, UC Santa Cruz FD

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts

Log in

Click here to log in or register