Sutphen Imperial Chassis

[RFDACM]

A quick view of the Sutphen website shows that only the SPH model has the new no over hang bucket. This "new" bucket looks like it may have dual doors but they're only slightly angled? Also, it does look like it has a front lip edge but like the Peirce flying dumpster and the E-One this is less versatile to work from than other manufactures buckets.

[Rescue101]

Ah RFD,I see you post first,check details later.Yes,the SPH as I indicated earlier has a new design,flat bottom bucket that I would regard as very easy to work out of.As memory serves there is a "lip"that runs around the outside of the bucket.The hydraulics are also improved allowing quicker deployment in all areas.Acess to the bucket is off the rig not off the mini stairwell on the bucket(SPH doesn't have this;the bucket stairwell that is ). T.C.

[SpartanGuy]

SPH has a button with no overhang on the bottom. It has four doors, if I remember correctly. Two on the front, one from the ladder, and one on the back driver's side so that you can walk along the side of the truck and enter the bucket. It does have a lip on the front, at least the one we demoed, as well as swing out stox basket holder.

[canuck1]

you guys are all talking buckets, and nobody has mentioned ALF's bucket! Easily the most well thought out design. 29 square feet of floor space (19 inside, and another 10 outside). 2 self closing angled doors, with out the need for a mansaver type (lift up) safety bar. Moveable control console in the bucket, without any dangling curly cords. Nice big sturdy handrails between the bucket and the ladder (check out the competition on this point!). Built in 3 pieces, so the whole thing doesn't have to be replaced (repaired) when it gets bashed up. Option for mounting roof ladder, to access roof tops with parapet walls. Stainless steel heat shielding all around. Auto, or manual leveling controls. 2 platform lifting arms (250 pounds each).

[SpartanGuy]

Yeah, forgot about that. The SPH's bucket has a permanently affixed folding extension ladder on the front of the bucket. Flip it out and down, extend it, and you have your ladder for parapets.

[RFDACM]

Rescue 101: OK I posted before I went to the site, at least I looked. I'm still not a fan. Yes, its better and maybe as good as some others. The handrails between the aerial and the bucket look and feel like the came off a Walmart Kiddie pool. Of course they(Sutphens) will work, and work well, everyday, just anything else. They will also not work at times, just like all the others.

A bucket, IMHO should have the abilty for access/egress from more than one angle (90 degrees). This means that regardless of where you stick the doors, the bucket must have angles at the outermost points (much like the ALF or KME). The lip should extend to three sides. The doors should swing in for rapid egress from the building into the bucket and require no more than a single action (like fire exit doors). As much room as possible, a workable gun and a decent floor. I was actaully very impressed with KME's bucket. ALF's is, as canuck 1 points out, pretty damn nice. E-One's "tip-in" feature is nice. (Can be done by manually moving the pendulum on a Scope)

As for the "permanent" parapet ladder: what if its too short? Many others offer the mounts which you place the straight ladder (mounted behind the bucket on the aerial) onto at the appropriate height.

[Rescue101]

RFD,I'm by no means a "bucket" guy.I've worked off straight sticks for a majority of my career.However,we are lookig at a tower to replace two current pieces so I have found all the commentary here beneficial.One thing I like about the Sutphen is the way they enclose the waterway,you have to go out of your way to whack that one unlike some of the other breeds.As I indicated earlier,I kind of like the E-ones ability to tip the bucket into the roof,I've opened up a couple roofs off our neighbors rig (95' -one).Never tried a "scope" although I'd like to.The ALF is nice but the rig is HUGE,it wouldn't fit in some parts of town.I'm baseing this on the one I saw at the NEFCC. .So the hunt continues. T.C.

[RFDACM]

TC: We found that the ALF 93 footer was smaller than the E-One, KME and the Peirce. Far smaller than the Aerialscope. All of them were the same hieght and width (not a spec either). The KME had the best turing radius (wall to wall) followed by ALF. This was for mid-mounts though, I have no idea on rearmounts. I have some comparative numbers from our actual bids as no one builds these things as small as they say on their websites!

I do like the Sutphen's waterway(until the end). Only Scope and Sumthin' offer this currently, but word is that others are trying to "protect" theirs for a shot at the FDNY bids.

[NewJerseyFFII]

TC: We found that the ALF 93 footer was smaller than the E-One, KME and the Peirce. Far smaller than the Aerialscope. All of them were the same hieght and width (not a spec either). The KME had the best turing radius (wall to wall) followed by ALF. This was for mid-mounts though, I have no idea on rearmounts. I have some comparative numbers from our actual bids as no one builds these things as small as they say on their websites!

I do like the Sutphen's waterway(until the end). Only Scope and Sumthin' offer this currently, but word is that others are trying to "protect" theirs for a shot at the FDNY bids.

Do you think that the " FDNY " will ever look into testing a ( E-one Bronto ) . It costs about the same as a 95' Seagrave Aerialscope and is built with a boxed boom ladder tower !...

[SpartanGuy]

I believe FDNY tried E-One once already, and they ran the wheels off of the ones they had in a lot less time than it normally takes them.

[RFDACM]

I'm sure someone with intimate knowledge may chime in. But I've heard from a few that E-One will never be back. Never is a long time, so who knows.

[tomwnh]

For some of you old truck guys (rescue101) think back to the old White truck of days gone buy. I think this chassis has some of that styling. Here is a link to a site that has some vintage Whites and you can see the grille and contors of those truck in this "new" chassis.

http://www.hankstruckpictures.com/whitetrks.htm


Also take a look at Autocar's web site, yes they are still making the Autocar truck chassis.

http://www.autocartruck.com/


White/Autocar as well as Volvo made a limited number of converted vocational truck chassis into fire chassis in the late 80's and early 90's that look very simular. Grille, windshields and cab style.

Just my opinion.

[chiefengineer11]

A few Volvo (formerly White) Road Xpeditor chassis (low cab forward, commonly used in refuse and local P & D work) were extended to four door fire chassis. They were very well done by Fontaine Modification Co. Fontaine maintains facilities near many major truck factories, for the purpose of doing modifications to trucks that are needed to make them suitable for a specific purpose or customer, but just wouldn't be compatible with a vehicle assembly line. One big booster of them was Snyder Volvo White Trucks in York, Pa. They put one on display at the Penna. Fire Expo every year for a number of years. I think that there's one in service in south central Penna. somewhere, but I don't know just where, and I don't know whose body it has. I also know that a company call Fire Cab (they were'nt around very long) built at least one but I don't know where it is.

When Volvo bought Mack Trucks the government made them divest one of their LCF lines. Otherwise, between the Road Xpeditor and the Mack MR, one company would have controlled over 90% of the LCF business. Autocar, LLC was formed to acquire the Xpeditor line and the Autocar name. Fontaine has a facility near the Autocar plant.

When we were looking a chassis for our new engine (see "Toyne wins") we did contact Autocar about this item. They, in turn contacted Fontaine, but Fontaine declined it. So that was the end of that.

Real pity. At one time when Autocar was still in Ardmore, Pa. and later in Exton, they sold complete fire trucks under their own name. Philadelphia had a bunch of them and some surrounding communities some, too. They had a great reputation for durability and reliability. So much so that that if Volvo (when they had it) or Autocar would build a fire chassis with the A-car name on it, I don't think they'd be able to build them fast enough.

Stay safe out there, everyone goes home!