1. #1
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    Default Lighting Packages for Cheif mobiles...

    No, not for waker mobile supreme...

    Fir a IC/Chiefs F150 vehcile.

    I am working on budgets, trying to help the local cheifs justify/get new IC vehciles so they can retire they crap machines...

    Anyway.

    Lights.

    They would like to have a ligting package that does not include an external light bar. They have had bad exerpiences...with trees/tight forest roads.

    They want everything under glass, behind grill, whatever.

    I know jack about lights...

    So, what would you guys suggest, LED prefered, strobe likely because of price. I am looking in Gals...WOW, crap, not to encouraging.

    I am going to request Gals prices, but I would like to hear what you guys ahve to say first.

    How do the under glass lights work? How about the ones in the grills, never been around either..

    Thanks!!!
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  2. #2
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    Thumbs up Right Direction................

    L.E.D.s should be your First Choice. They should also be your only choice, in my not-so-humble opinion. Whelen Mfg. Co. makes a wide selection, in all types of lights. I would suggest the "Stick" lights, which are a row of LEDs in a metal or plastic housing. We use a LOT of "Unmarked" vehicles here, and the LED Sticks are rapidly replacing all the others. When working up your proposal, use Gall's Prices. But buy elsewhere, and come in under budget.
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    Sho-Me (Able 2) is rather popular in slick top/unmarked patrol cars, with the exception of highway patrol using all Whelen Gen 3. My father's slick top has Sho me front and rear LEDs (deck and dash) but nothing in the grill. The cheapest prices I have found on Sho-Me is from RIM Inudstries http://www.rimindustries.com/products.htm
    It also helps to get a set of the small 3"-5" LED sticks, that you could be mounted in the rear window, and they can be left on without the engine running and still have rear warning for MVAs.

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    Get a Yukon with a sunroof. Have a rookie stand in the sun roof with a pair of MAG Chargers. As you go down the road grab the rookie by Big jim and the twins. The high pitch shrill and him flailing around with the flashlights should get more than enough attention.

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    You'd be surprised how much cheaper LED's can be over strobes. Remember, you need a power supply for the strobes which will run several hundred dollars. The LED's are all direct 12 volt and use very little power. They are practically indistructable and don't burn out. Strobes still have their uses, but you can reduce it by a lot now.

    (2) Whelen TIR3 LED's behind the grill
    (2) Whelen single Talons in the back window
    (1) Whelen Double Talon over mirror
    (2) Clear hideaways strobes in the front corners
    (2) Clear hideaway strobes in the rear tails
    (1) Whelen Wig-Wag flasher for the highbeams

    That is a dual-level slicktop setup for a Ford. It is about $800 in equipment plus installation costs.
    Even the burger-flippers at McDonald's probably have some McWackers.

  6. #6
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    Thanks for the input and suggestions guys! I think we are going with the rookie idea...budget reasons...

    -Brotherhood: I don't know half of you half as well as I should like; and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve.
    -Mistakes: It could be that the purpose of you life is to serve as a warning to others.

    -Adversity: That which does not kill me postpones the inevitable.

    -Despair: Its always darkest before it goes Pitch Black.

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    Only recommendation I'd make on the police package is to go with double talons in the rear, with one of each heads on each talon being Amber, that is if your budget restrictions would allow for it. SHP has this setup but with one clear. That amber really penetrates and shows up a long ways away. If that doesnt fit the budget, you could go with a double amber slim light from Sho-Me, for under $75 including flasher.

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    I second the all LED's idea.

    I am a deputy chief in my department and allowed to have lights and siren. Currently I am running a POV as a experiment in LED's and on a bad battery. Just to see what I can put on it *chuckles*

    Currently..

    1 - Galls Dual LED window light under the rear view mirror. This moves people. (red/red)

    2 - Code 3 LED-X modules in my grille (red/red)

    2 - Code 3 LED-X modules on the sides of the front bumper (red/red)

    2 - Sho-Me LED's on my side mirrors (red/red)

    1 - Whelen Slimlighter in rear window (red/red) (I was concerned about lack of amber in the rear so see my next purchase)

    1 - SVP 8 LED traffic director.

    total draw of under 8 amps.

    Call me a whacker if you so wish, but my Chief has said, that he knows i can be seen, especially when parked on scene and declared as Incident Command.

    So a whacker i am...

    Jason
    Jason.
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    Goalies are the best btw :P

  9. #9
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    A friend has the new Galls LED Dash Lite I believe that it is around $109. It is a very good piece of equipment and can have different colors and falsh patterns,oh and you can definatly see it.
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  10. #10
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    Default Yo...

    Right now I am NOT a big fan of LEDs. Why? Because I think
    they are not as visible to traffic. Not being visible to
    traffic means getting in an accident. Getting in an accident
    means lawsuits. Lawsuits could mean jail time or fines for
    you and me.

    So...

    Galls is total crap. Stay away from it.

    Check out the packages at this site-

    http://www.code3pse.com/

    Trsut me, for the lights and siren controller, go
    here. Your chief will love it.

    http://www.fedsig.com/products/index.php?id=117
    Last edited by CALFFBOU; 06-09-2005 at 07:44 PM.

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    I agree with the LEDs...... If you can afford Whelen, do it. You can get some of the 500 600 or 700 series lights for flush mounting to the body. They work well on fenders for side warning or mounted on the front of the grill. Each has it's own internal flasher and all you need is a power supply.

    As for inside the vehicle, I would suggest going with some of the Sho-Me Micro lights. They are very effective. Put 4-6 in the front windshield along the top and put 4 in the back. They come in kits of 2 or 4 with a switch and flasher unit. Or you can buy the lights individually. I think each flasher will run 8 lights. I found the best prices at www.lshlights.com

    Good luck and let us know what you decided.......

    PS........ Definitely stay away from Galls!!!
    The comments made by me are my opinions only. They DO NOT reflect the opinions of my employer(s). If you have an issue with something I may say, take it up with me, either by posting in the forums, emailing me through my profile, or PMing me through my profile.
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    If you are looking for LED's go to TOMAR. Guarantee no one compares bar none. Got them on my vehicle. I get more complaints that they are TOO brite even off center. When I was looking at them and comparing TOMAR was the ONLY one you could see at a 45 degree angle from the center. Here is a link that might help in decision.

    http://www.tomar.com/austin-video.html

  13. #13
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    Exclamation

    GALLS and any other mail order companies like Galls are high price and the products with their name on it is JUNK!! Stay away from them.

    Use their prices as a guide when you are preparing the specifications and budget prices. Like some one has said, you will be higher and if you get the funds, then you will have some money saved and can add a few other things to the car.

    I would use all Halogen if I were decking out a new chief’s car. The Halogen will be brighter using a RED lens as opposed to the Strobe, which is brighter using a Blue Lens, as the police use.

    Have amber on the rear mixed with the red.

    Don’t under light the vehicle or over light it. There are plenty of pictures in Firehouse magazine and other publications that can give you a good idea. Visit other areas, department, trade shows and take a peek at the others guy’s rides.

    Whelen has very good products as well as Federal. The others I would stay away from as if you have a problem or need service, these two that I mention will be more available than the others. Galls, and other whacker companies, DO NOT MAKE SERVICE calls to their customers!!!

  14. #14
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    Default Re: Yo...

    Originally posted by CALFFBOU
    Right now I am NOT a big fan of LEDs. Why? Because I think
    they are not as visible to traffic. Not being visible to
    traffic means getting in an accident. Getting in an accident
    means lawsuits. Lawsuits could mean jail time or fines for
    you and me.

    So...

    Galls is total crap. Stay away from it.

    Check out the packages at this site-

    http://www.code3pse.com/

    Trsut me, for the lights and siren controller, go
    here. Your chief will love it.

    http://www.fedsig.com/products/index.php?id=117
    Hmmm, I find that LEDs are MUCH more visable then either halogen or strobe. Bou, perhaps its just the original style (GEN I) you've seen? Ill admit, when LED's first came out I wasnt impressed. But the GEN II's and now the GEN III's are fantastic.

    I've had a chance to see LED equiped rigs parked next to rigs with halogen and/or strobe in evetything from the bright Florida sun to heavy fog to huricane driven rain and the LED's are just as visible as the halogens (more so in fog), and much more then strobes in all conditions, especially bright sunlight.
    Last edited by Dave1983; 06-10-2005 at 09:03 PM.
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  15. #15
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    If cost is somewhat of a factor, then stay away from blue and clear LED's. Those along with green are much more expensive than the red or the amber. I'm sure there's some technical explination to it, but from what I understand, it's just that they're more expensive to make.
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    Default Re: Re: Yo...

    Originally posted by Dave1983


    Hmmm, I find that LEDs are MUCH more visable then either halogen or strobe. Bou, perhaps its just the original style (GEN I) you've seen? Ill admit, when LED's first came out I wasnt impressed. But the GEN II's and now the GEN III's are fantastic.

    I've had a chance to see LED equiped rigs parked next to rigs with halogen and/or strobe in evetything from the bright Florida sun to heavy fog to huricane driven rain and the LED's are just as visible as the halogens (more so in fog), and much more then strobes in all conditions, especially bright sunlight.
    I agree 100% dave.

    The Gen I were not the best and I prefered the strobes, over them.
    My dash light is GenII and if someone don't see them, they are blind. Because I have seen cops pull over for the LED'S and they didn't even see the halogens on the fire truck a bit behind me.

    LED's are the way to go. As well as you dave, I seen the LED's we have on the new Ambulances I work on side by side with our halogen equipped fire trucks and you couldn't see any of the halogen flashes at all. Everyone caught the LED's right away. One Ambulance with LED's and 6 Fire Trucks and you have trouble seeing the Halogens. And this was in the brightest of sunshine that you have ever seen.

    Another downside to halogen is that you have to replace bulbs quite frequently. As a point, I have LED's on my explorer, that have been there for 2 years. and no diminish in the light's quality. And 3 of the 5 new fire trucks with halogen lightbars and flashing lights on them had to have bulbs replaced already. And some had them burn out in under two months after getting them. No thanks.

    I will stick to my LED's. At least I will know I have been seen.

    This is just my opinion tho.
    Jason.
    Career Paramedic/Volunteer Firefighter
    Saving Lives or Basements everyday.
    Member of the IACOJ

    Goalies are the best btw :P

  17. #17
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    Default

    Just curious, Why does everyone hate Galls?? High prices, bad customer service, poor quality equipment???
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    Originally posted by RFRDxplorer
    Just curious, Why does everyone hate Galls?? High prices, bad customer service, poor quality equipment???
    I wish I knew. I have gotten many things from Galls, and had to return things for repair. And never a problem at all. I can't seem to figure it out.
    Jason.
    Career Paramedic/Volunteer Firefighter
    Saving Lives or Basements everyday.
    Member of the IACOJ

    Goalies are the best btw :P

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    for those who don't know, last year galls was shut down for a few days by the Feds. Seems galls was selling things outside of the country like night vision and ballistic vests to countries like Iraq (you know the ones that are shooting at our guys). Why would ANYONE in their right mind buy from them. BTW I am from KY.

    Lest we never forget 9-11-01 and our 343

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    Default Yo...

    Lieutenant387- Thanks for the reminder! I forgot. Screw
    Galls and their cheap junk! F-them!


    Sorry guys, I am just not a LED fan. Maybe I am getting
    "old skool"?

    Anyways, I am also not a big fan of putting strobes in tail
    lights. Why? It detracts from the main purpose of the light.
    Makes it harder to see if the vehcile is braking, using a
    turn indicator, etc...

    I do like the wig-wags in the white back up lights. Those
    are nice.

    Happy light talking...Bou
    Last edited by CALFFBOU; 06-11-2005 at 02:11 AM.

  21. #21
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    Originally posted by RFRDxplorer
    Just curious, Why does everyone hate Galls?? High prices, bad customer service, poor quality equipment???
    Yes.
    Even the burger-flippers at McDonald's probably have some McWackers.

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    Whelen rep in our area is 30% of the list (see Whelen web site). The state has a contract for police items from Whelen that is 40% off list.

    Interesting item in Forbes mag this week. Apparently the Japanese co that perfected the white/clear LED used in these lights spent $1.5billion (thats with a B) on R&D. They apparently are a bit annoyed that the chicoms, Koreans, and Taiwanese are illegally pirate manufacturing white LEDs without license/royalty fees. Have not gotten anywhere with the legal system in these countries so they reportedly are now sueing the heck out of the US companies using bootleg white LEDs in their products (US or offshore assembled). New development apparently. Could push up the price of white LED equipment as the mfg have to get legal with LED source of burn up $ on lawyers. But now?

  23. #23
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    Originally posted by neiowa
    Whelen rep in our area is 30% of the list (see Whelen web site). The state has a contract for police items from Whelen that is 40% off list.

    Interesting item in Forbes mag this week. Apparently the Japanese co that perfected the white/clear LED used in these lights spent $1.5billion (thats with a B) on R&D. They apparently are a bit annoyed that the chicoms, Koreans, and Taiwanese are illegally pirate manufacturing white LEDs without license/royalty fees. Have not gotten anywhere with the legal system in these countries so they reportedly are now sueing the heck out of the US companies using bootleg white LEDs in their products (US or offshore assembled). New development apparently. Could push up the price of white LED equipment as the mfg have to get legal with LED source of burn up $ on lawyers. But now?
    If they would not break patent laws they would not have to spend so much money on lawyers.....

    The reason that LED's are so much more noticeable over halogen is not so much the CP's but rother the sharpness that they turn on and off, rather then the slow light up and fade out.
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    Originally posted by DennisTheMenace
    If they would not break patent laws they would not have to spend so much money on lawyers.....

    The reason that LED's are so much more noticeable over halogen is not so much the CP's but rother the sharpness that they turn on and off, rather then the slow light up and fade out.
    You are right about the on/off thing but in most cases, they are simply brighter as well.
    Even the burger-flippers at McDonald's probably have some McWackers.

  25. #25
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    Sampson,
    Here is something that may help you choose...

    In London, Chiefs get the choice of a Lease car or use your own and the Brigade pay you for use, mileage and to have the equipment fitted.

    I just changed my 2003 Saab 9-3 for a 2005 Saab 9-5 Estate (Station Wagon?) I was advised to use the little sho-me LED's mentioned. Sure they are good, hidden away nicely under the grille, but I'm not sure if they are much better than the halogens I had fitted to the other car, maybe because they are at the same height as the alternating headlights they are hidden a little by the main beam flshing....you can certainly see me coming though...even if a lot of it is down to the headlamp flashers... the thing that I believe really gets me seen.

    I have those in the front, a Whelan dash king (imported from the other car) on the rear shelf and we also have to have a magnetic mounted LFB issue Roof strobe.

    Here are some photos I did for another Officer who wanted to see how the LED's compared...the second photo is taken on a delay so you can see all of the lights at once. The last Phot oshows the last car with the halogens in the bottom grille.

    I can drive my car as a Civilian off duty and even on duty going about non urgent work without shouting "LOOK HERE COMES THE FIRE CHIEF" and still be seen safely and effectively when I turn out.
    Last edited by SteveDude; 06-13-2005 at 05:21 PM.
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