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    Default Russia keeps going by keeping it simple

    Published July 27, 2005


    It's time to thank the Russians.

    Thank them for keeping the international space station afloat while the shuttle has been in Mr. Goodwrench's shop.

    For more than two years they have ferried astronauts, delivered the Tang and taken out the garbage.

    Without them, our choices would have been to aim the space station at the Pacific or slap duct tape on the external fuel tank and hope for the best.

    And to think NASA officials once wanted to jettison the Russians from the space station.

    They complained the Russians were broke and causing delays. They were a bumbling bunch of low-tech Ivans. They bolted together sewer pipes, filled them with kerosene, put a couple of astronauts on top and sent them to that orbiting bucket of bolts known as Mir.

    But Bill Clinton kept the Russians on board.

    Smart guy, that Bill.

    The Russians are running a safer, more reliable space program than we are. Since Columbia burned up in the atmosphere, the Russians have sent five manned missions to the space station.

    The genius of the Russians is that they keep it simple.

    Their Soyuz capsule first flew in 1967. The parachute failed and a cosmonaut died. Three more cosmonauts died in 1971 when the capsule lost pressure upon re-entry.

    Nobody has died in a manned Soviet/Russian spaceflight since.

    Meanwhile, 14 astronauts have died on the shuttle. The Challenger and Columbia accidents shut down the American space program for more than five years at a cost of billions of dollars.

    The Russians, meanwhile, just keep on flying.

    They found a basic design that worked and stuck to it.

    The Americans came up with a much more complicated design and almost 25 years later, they still don't understand it.

    To get their capsules into orbit, Russians use the 1960s-era Soyuz rocket. It is the workhorse of their space program, lifting off more than 1,000 times with everything from military satellites to space tourist Dennis Tito on board.

    It is what space engineers refer to as a "Big Dumb Booster."

    Think of a rusty, 1967 Chevy pickup that has 245,000 miles and cranks every time.

    The Russian rockets are like a rock.

    When you've been flying the same system for decades, you get a handle on the glitches. You tend not to be blindsided by burned O-rings and falling foam. And when things go wrong, you can figure out the problem and fix it.

    After an unmanned Soyuz blew up during a 2002 liftoff, the Russians quickly ruled out a design flaw and safely launched astronauts less than a month later. Compare that to the delays following an American launch mishap.

    The Russians have spent decades minimizing what can go wrong with spaceflight while we have been going in the opposite direction.

    I'd sooner strap my fanny to a Soyuz than a shuttle.

    I'd trust Ivan with his pipe wrench more than a Cal Tech Ph.D. with his computer.

    I'm not alone. Those masters of copyright infringement, the Chinese, did not bootleg a shuttle to start their manned space program. They cloned Soyuz.

    The shuttle program faces retirement in 2010. A planned high-tech replacement called the X-33 was so high tech it was deemed impracticable, and canceled after $1.3 billion was spent on it. Now we have something called the Crew Exploration Vehicle scheduled for launch in 2014 at a cost of $15 billion. It will introduce a whole new generation of glitches into our space program.

    The Soyuz was flying almost 15 years before the first shuttle flight and will be flying after the last shuttle comes in for a landing at the Smithsonian. Unlike the shuttle, Soyuz is not broken.

    I would not be the least bit surprised if we have to rely on it to also bail out the Crew Exploration Vehicle.

    Thank goodness we have those bumbling Russians and their antiquated space program.

    Mike Thomas can be reached at 407-420-5525 or mthomas@orlandosentinel.com .

    http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/...eadlines-space

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    Default

    the thanks the Russians get

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ilyushin_Il-76

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    Originally posted by budthespud
    the thanks the Russians get

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ilyushin_Il-76
    Why do you keeping ignoring the the Yak-6 and the Po-2? Now thats commie high tech. Or won't they pay you lobbying fees?

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    Kind of curious on how the payload of a Soyuz compares to that of a shuttle. Isn't the Soyuz limited to max 3 people?
    "This thread is being closed as it is off-topic and not related to the fire industry." - Isn't that what the Off Duty forum was for?

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    have less cargo capacity than the NASA shuttles
    So again, they will put all this effort into something that still won't do the job that's needed.
    "This thread is being closed as it is off-topic and not related to the fire industry." - Isn't that what the Off Duty forum was for?

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    Whatever you say, Bones.

    Whatever you say.

    Your move.

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    What has Canadia really contributed to the space program other then a big knuckle crane arm?
    Be for Peace, but don't be for the Enemy!
    -Big Russ

    Learn from the mistakes of others; you won't live long enough to make them all yourself.

    Quote Originally Posted by nyckftbl View Post
    LOL....dont you people have anything else to do besides b*tch about our b*tching?

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    budthespud, why was the space station getting so low on supplies and not able to rid itself of all the collected garbage? Why did it have 2 malfunctioning gyroscopes?



    PS - it might have something to do with no room to bring supplies or remove garbage on the Soyuz craft.

    Simple - yes, able to do the needed job - no.
    "This thread is being closed as it is off-topic and not related to the fire industry." - Isn't that what the Off Duty forum was for?

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    Russia's space plan was superior from the get-go.

    Last night, on CBC, they showed how the Russians
    had functions broken into two vehicles: an unmanned
    cargo machine and a cosmonauts'/astronauts' machine.

    The Shuttle had an honorable career up until Columbia.

    Time for it to go.

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    NASA maintains it needs the ageing shuttle, which was conceived with 1970s technology, for another five years and 15 missions to finish the space station, which is more than 25 times over its $US4billion budget.

    However, with popular opinion turning against the shuttle, politicians who hold the purse strings may force NASA's hand.

    "You can have only so much faith in people who have all the money and time and still don't do the job," Republican congressman Dana Rohrabacher said. "That big plume of flame coming out of it (the shuttle), those are $1000 bills being burnt."


    http://www.theaustralian.news.com.a...5E29098,00.html

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    Default And this is worth?

    And this has anything to do with Wildland Firefighting?
    "If it ain't broke, don't fix it...but, maybe we had better take a closer look at it."

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    Hick.... this too will soon digress into the discussion of using the IL-76 for wildland fires
    Buckle Up, Slow Down, Arrive Alive
    "Everybody Goes Home"

    IACOJ 2003

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    Did you want to go that way?

    Is that why you brought up the IL-76 waterbomber?

    I'm here to take any questions you might have.

    Fire away. (no pun intended)

    11,000 gallons from 300 feet at 151 knots in about 10 seconds.

    Now that's what I call a fire line.

    The pattern is 12 football fields' worth; 1.1 km x 80 meters.

    I'm not sure there's the competency in the US Forest
    Service to handle it, but when it was in Australia, a couple of
    plumbers filled it. For what it's worth, they loved the job.

    Maybe give it to the military. That'd do it.
    Last edited by budthespud; 08-11-2005 at 02:23 AM.

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    so what has Canadia done in space?
    Be for Peace, but don't be for the Enemy!
    -Big Russ

    Learn from the mistakes of others; you won't live long enough to make them all yourself.

    Quote Originally Posted by nyckftbl View Post
    LOL....dont you people have anything else to do besides b*tch about our b*tching?

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    The trusty little CL-215 415; the Martin Mars; the other
    Bombardier aircraft in the medium jet range area selling
    very well; the AVRO-Arrow JFK made us scrap
    and the Canadarm. Assorted bush planes and float
    planes.



    Alexander Graham Bell also did the Silver Dart - a better
    flier than the Wright Bros came up with - in Cape Breton.

    There you got it.

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    Without Canada that astronaut would not have been able to go underneath the space shuttle to remove the gap filler. But whatever Im not here to get into a Canada VS USA battle. But really why should we spend all that money to start a space program and send rockets into space when we have probably like 6 astronauts who can catch a ride on a shuttle whenever they want.

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    Russia's space plan was superior from the get-go.
    Keyword = WAS

    It might be a shame for the world that their "plans" never came to fruition.
    "This thread is being closed as it is off-topic and not related to the fire industry." - Isn't that what the Off Duty forum was for?

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    Clipper's an EU-Russia program. Look it up.

    No thanks for the Soyuz rescue ?

    My, my, my. What poor form you show us here.

    Didn't your Mother teach you any manners?
    Last edited by budthespud; 08-11-2005 at 08:28 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by budthespud
    No thanks for the Soyuz rescue ?
    Now Spud, don't go putting words into anyone's mouth. Never said the Soyuz was useless nor not needed. Just said it's not capable of the jobs needed. It definitely serves a purpose. It just doesn't serve enough purposes.

    That Russian cargo only craft, weren't they being used up until a few years ago when one went a little out of control and kind of crashed into the space station? Didn't they then stop flying those? (not bashing or anything, just trying to remember if I have the correct craft in my mind).
    "This thread is being closed as it is off-topic and not related to the fire industry." - Isn't that what the Off Duty forum was for?

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    I wasn't talking equipment. I was talking gratitude and
    manners. I still don't see anything here but evasion on
    the manners and a diversion to equipment talk.

    Say thank you, Bones. I dare you. Thank the Russians
    for saving the ISS people. Is that too much to ask?

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    Thank You.


    And I'm still wondering if that is the correct craft I am remembering?
    "This thread is being closed as it is off-topic and not related to the fire industry." - Isn't that what the Off Duty forum was for?

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    I will ask my Russian space buffs that question and get
    back to you. In any case there s/b 2 vessels; one for
    the cargo and one for the people.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bones42
    Thank You.


    And I'm still wondering if that is the correct craft I am remembering?
    An American on another chatboard recalls a nudging incident in
    respect of Mir and a cargo craft. There was no real damage.

    The craft exchanged drivers' license and registration particulars
    and referred the matter to their respective insurers.

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    Ya, that time frame sounds about right. Thanks. The Mir wasn't too bad a little project either. Has the cargo craft flown at all since then?

    What would this space chatboard be?
    "This thread is being closed as it is off-topic and not related to the fire industry." - Isn't that what the Off Duty forum was for?

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