Another for what were they thinking file.

[stm4710]

Yesterday in the city of Boston there were tunnel fires that had been on and off since the night before. I watched live coverage as another fire erupted during the evening news. The fire was of unknown causes at the time, yet you see NO SCBA at all, NO bunker pants and no gloves. This wasnt you cant judge them it was just 1/16th of second thing. You watched them all walk around like that until the arrivial of a BC then they don there packs and masks.

Here is a blow up photo of what I was talking about.



Edit, opps......i accidently delteled the photo.....not added it.

[Spectre08]

where's the photo?

[clancyxdogg]

I see a fire in a hole in the ground and a fireman working outside, humping hose in 90 degree heat. Do you think the cameraman has an SCBA on? Does the BPD doing traffic control down the street have turnout gear on?

[BD6413]

Yeah Really.....I see an exterior Fire no interior attack so why do we need SCBA ?

It was 90 plus degress so I can agree with no Bunker Pants Issue.

[Emberxx]

I don't know...my opinion? Not that anyone asked, but I'm gonna give it anyway

This guy is on a fireground. You never know what is going to occur, that's the reason why you bunk out before you reach a fire scene. Ninety degrees or not - it only takes seconds for the conditions to change.

[JackTee09]

Hmmmm..............

[ChicagoFF]

Does Boston even wear bunker gear? I thought they had gone back to 3/4's and coats. As for masks and gloves, why wear gear if you don't need it? It's outside and doesn't look real smokey in the picture.

[clancyxdogg]

Here is a great study on how and when Boston FD wears turnouts. I saved it from another thread on bunker gear.

[Emberxx]

According to that study the modified bunker gear policy was put in place to reduce heat stress related injuries. Since it's introduction, heat stress injuries have increased. Also, injuries to the knees and feet have risen.

[FFFRED]

According to that study the modified bunker gear policy was put in place to reduce heat stress related injuries. Since it's introduction, heat stress injuries have increased. Also, injuries to the knees and feet have risen.

Where has this been published? I know many Boston Jakes who work in some of their busier houses and none of them ever mentioned these problems. Not saying this isn't the case...just that I'm not aware of those results either through first hand accounts or studies and reports.

As for the photo...I don't see anything wrong with what we see there.

FTM-PTB

[clancyxdogg]

Recently heard while pouring water into a manhole in 90 degree weather: "Hey, get your gear on! whaddya want an ankle burn?"
Do you guys wear all your gear to a mulch fire at an ATM, too? After all, "it only takes seconds for the conditions to change." What about medicals? You never know, somebody could knock over a candle.

[Emberxx]

Recently heard while pouring water into a manhole in 90 degree weather: "Hey, get your gear on! whaddya want an ankle burn?"
Do you guys wear all your gear to a mulch fire at an ATM, too? After all, "it only takes seconds for the conditions to change." What about medicals? You never know, somebody could knock over a candle.

Wow...

I did not realize that Boston had modified bunker standards, this was the first time I've heard of something like that. So you can understand my confusion on the subject. Considering the heat here, I was interested enough to read the study. I'm not for or against it, as I am still learning more about it.

But in my post I was speaking spefically to that picture, which if you had read it, I stated. This guy has actual fire showing behind him. This isn't a mulch fire at an ATM.

And as far as where the study was published, in the above link that clancydogg provided.

[clancyxdogg]

Yup.... actual fire coming about three feet out of a manhole in the middle of the street. Agreed.

[Emberxx]

Quote:

"Yesterday in the city of Boston there were tunnel fires that had been on and off since the night before. I watched live coverage as another fire erupted during the evening news. The fire was of unknown causes at the time"...

[clancyxdogg]

Crews respond to manhole fires in North End
By Associated Press
Thursday, August 11, 2005 - Updated: 06:00 PM EST

BOSTON - Residents and businesses were evacuated and power was shut-off after an electrical cable failure in Boston's North End sparked several manhole fires Thursday, officials said.

Flames and thick black smoke could be seen shooting out from at least one manhole on Hanover Street. Fire officials said several others were smoldering underground.

Caroline Allen, a spokeswoman for NSTAR electric company, said power was shut off to the area to allow crews to cut a cable and put customers on other lines.

Allen said there was undetected damage from explosions in the same area Wednesday night that sent four firefighters to the hospital.

Boston fire Lt. David Pfeil said one firefighter was treated Thursday for a minor injury on his hand.

[Emberxx]

Flames and thick black smoke could be seen shooting out from at least one manhole

I can clearly understand why someone shouldn't wear bunker gear around flames and thick black smoke coming out of a manhole from which they stood a few feet from.

[clancyxdogg]

Yeah, me too- because, you see, he's outside of the manhole.

[ChicagoFF]

Wow...

I did not realize that Boston had modified bunker standards, this was the first time I've heard of something like that.

We don't wear bunker gear here at all. By your standards we wouldn't be alowed at any fire? We do just fine without it. I don't mean to get on you specifically - most people on here are bunker gear fanatics and don't think you can do anything without bunkers and full ppe. I just don't agree.

[stm4710]

You all say that ohh it wasnt that bad, he was out side yadda yadda.

What wholesome substances do you think were burning down there!!!!! Scented candles???
PVC,sewer gasses,insulation,transformers with oil in them......if they were old transformers CFC's burning and God knows how many rats.
Fact is, during the new broadcast things got bad and I watched these guys walk around with NO scba on. It wasnt a 30 second clip.....the reporter was on scene for about 20 minutes.

Im sorry but just cause there is no smoke doesnt mean there isnt toxic gasses as well. Wear the SCBA and consider it hazardous until otherwise proven. My long term health isnt worth risking to look like a old crusty leather lung on camera. When the BC arrived...every one was in full gear and packed up.



Also if conditions got so bad they they evacuated the area and citizens had to use the SCBA.....how were those firefighter immune from the same toxic gasses being closer to the manhole??????

[JackTee09]

I have some good pals on the BFD. So this morning I sent an email asking them about what we saw and what was written. It can't be repeated here because profanity upsets the balance of a good thread.

Boston does it their way.
LA does it their way.
FDNY does it their way.
Atlanta does it there way.
Spring Mountain - ditto
Your department - ditto

Don't try to make what your department does the gold standard - the fact is, and it is true - places do things differently. You can gripe about it and say it is not right - but the fact is everywhere is different. People who only know about one department seem to miss that point.

The same happens in college - a chemistry course taught by the same professor year after year will be the same, right? Not always.

Group hug!