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    Thumbs down No more using of 10 codes, by order of the feds?

    I just heard on our local news that all Fire, EMS and LEO's are supposed to stop using 10 codes, or face the loss of funding! Have I been in a coma, or under a rock? Someone please enlighten me!
    Chief
    Wren Volunteer Fire Department
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    10-74


    ....................


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    That's news to me....How will they enforce this anyway? Are the feds gonna listen to every freq in the country?
    The comments made by me are my opinions only, not of the Fire and EMS services I am affiliated with.

    I have lost my mind..has anyone seen it? it's not worth much..but it's mine

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    I got a question that runs along this same topic I guess for dispatching medical calls does anyone elses dispatch give the response and have the problem a different code?
    ex: medic unit and station # Delta 33 (which might be Delta response for a traumatic injury which has the code number of 33)
    Our county is going to switch to this for no apparent reason and the way they are doing it now isn't a problem.

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    one of those efforts of standardization: your 10-74 makes no sense to me. I'll just 10-7.

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    I kinda understand the need for standards, but the way they explained it was that we would have to use plain ole english.......(Or southern drawl )!
    Chief
    Wren Volunteer Fire Department
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    Southern Division

    http://www.wrenfiredepartment.4t.com/

    In Memory of:
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    1946-2005
    "Rest in peace James, you now have the ultimate set of wings on you."

    Thanks, LeuitEFDems

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    Default A little more info...........

    From http://www.wtva.com/


    may have been interesting to listen to on the police shows, but all those coded messages between dispatchers and patrolmen are about to disappear.
    The Federal Emergency Management Agency has ordered police, fire and other emergency responders to phase out the codes infavor of plain speaking English.
    Departments who fail to comply will face major funding losses from the federal government.
    The changes must be in effect by October of next year.
    Chief
    Wren Volunteer Fire Department
    IACOJ
    Southern Division

    http://www.wrenfiredepartment.4t.com/

    In Memory of:
    FireFighter/Pilot James Archer
    1946-2005
    "Rest in peace James, you now have the ultimate set of wings on you."

    Thanks, LeuitEFDems

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    Makes sense to me. Everyone's always complaining about not being able to talk to each other...but even if the technology's there, if you use different terminology, its just as bad. That was one of the major reasons behind the advent of ICS...to get everyone talking the same language.

    I can understand keeping some of them for "sensitive" communications...like for us calling to request a PD Code 4 (which means to have them come secure the scene). But beyond that, I'm all in favor of plain language communications.
    Chris Gaylord
    Emergency Planner / Fire Captain, UC Santa Cruz FD

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    It's also nice to use a 10-code to advise you have a DOA or a suicide victim or other sensitive things. Even though the scanner hounds have got it figured out, it doesn't sound quite so harsh as saying "we got a dead body here, cancel the ambulance".

    But I also preach the advantages of speaking plain English. Tough to enforce, but I guess the time of the 10-code has passed... as said scanner hounds and the Internet and simply hearing various codes of all kinds used in context have taken away any masking of your comments and their intent.
    You only have to be stupid once to be dead permanently
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    I'm not that up on NIMS yet; is the elimination of 10-codes a component?
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    There are other changes coming as well. Thats just part of now being one happy FEMA family.
    Jacktee

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    Quote Originally Posted by RLFD14
    It's also nice to use a 10-code to advise you have a DOA or a suicide victim or other sensitive things. Even though the scanner hounds have got it figured out, it doesn't sound quite so harsh as saying "we got a dead body here, cancel the ambulance".

    But I also preach the advantages of speaking plain English. Tough to enforce, but I guess the time of the 10-code has passed... as said scanner hounds and the Internet and simply hearing various codes of all kinds used in context have taken away any masking of your comments and their intent.
    Absolutely agree. The only 10 codes that we encourage our members to use are those concerning a suicide or a fatality. Other than those, just "speaka da English". Listening to the FDNY radio is enough to make your head spin!
    In Arduis Fidelis
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    NIMS (IS-700) if you applied for a grant last 2 yrs you said your were "nims compliant" nims says to use pain talk.

    but I dont think they can make you, only cut off money if you dont

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    Cool I don't think we have to worry about the radio cops

    Quote Originally Posted by fireflymedic
    but I dont think they can make you, only cut off money if you dont
    Somehow, I don't think the Feds will be monitoring every fire frequency to make sure folks use the correct verbage. Besides, even clear text can be confusing. Ask for a rescue company around here and you'll get a truck with tools and firefighters. Ask for it elsewhere and you might get an ambulance.

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    More overthinking. If everyone knows your ten codes...what difference does it make. At least with a ten codes everyone who NEEDS to know what you said will know...no room for interpritation, mispronouncing etc....we use them and have no problems. I couldnt imagine everyone trying to speak plain English on everything, or enter a sentence for the incident disposition on the MDT or the dispatcher. If learning Ten codes is to tough, then.......well nuff said.

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    They don't have to monitor any frequencies. There are more than enough people willing to make a headline by saying "The Desktop Fire Company not in Compliance" - thus they have ears everywhere.
    Jacktee

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    ICS 100, at least in my area, states that all communications should be in "plain text" to alleviate any differences in codes. ICS 200 reinforces that also. ICS 700 also reinforces that. It's really nothing new, just not something a lot of people follow.
    "This thread is being closed as it is off-topic and not related to the fire industry." - Isn't that what the Off Duty forum was for?

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    Quote Originally Posted by LFD2203
    one of those efforts of standardization: your 10-74 makes no sense to me. I'll just 10-7.
    heheh..

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    Wink

    I believe delaware was already headed to plain speech anyway. at least the chiefs were on the ball on THIS one JK




    Hey k3twpfire


    do u really need to supplement your committed personell and equipment (10-74)??
    Last edited by tbonetrexler; 08-23-2005 at 09:53 AM.

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    Among other things, NIMS provides for standardization of communications terminology and procedures using a plain english system for transmission of messages and standardization of apparatus and equipment designations using a plain english/resource typing system. So, eventually, we'll all know exactly what we're getting when we request "two type-1 engines" or "three type-2 tenders" or whatever else we need.

    Besides, there's no possible rational argument for the patchwork pseudo-system of communications procedures and terminology we have in this country. Everyone runs around doing their own thing and saying, "if they want to work with us, they can do it our way." That's a load of crap, and I don't mind telling you. While I don't necessarily see the need for everything included in the NIMS initiatives, standardized communication procedures and terminology are definitely things the emergency services need, no matter how much the emergency services think they don't.

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    Default 10-codes

    Most agencies around my area stopped using 10-codes a while ago.

    I do still think we should use them for DOA's and bomb threats.

    Besides, even clear text can be confusing. Ask for a rescue company around here and you'll get a truck with tools and firefighters. Ask for it elsewhere and you might get an ambulance.
    This is true also. We have Medic 806 which is a ALS mini-pumper, and if someone asks for a squad you get an ambulance.

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    Quote Originally Posted by arhaney
    I just heard on our local news that all Fire, EMS and LEO's are supposed to stop using 10 codes, or face the loss of funding! Have I been in a coma, or under a rock? Someone please enlighten me!
    [sarcasm]Are you telling me that there are still departments out there backwards enough to use 10 codes?[/sarcasm]

    You'd think that, by now, nobody with any clue would still be using radio codes -- 10 codes or otherwise. How long have we had NFA ICS as a national model? The late 80's? For that matter, is there any flavor of ICS out there that doesn't espouse using "plain English"?

    It has never been kosher with the FCC to use "secret codes" on the public service airwaves. If your department uses codes, it has always been required to release them to the public if asked. (How many have department code sheets marked "Not for public release"? Does anyone really believe that every scanner and whacker-beeper junky out there in radio land doesn't know your radio codes? Puh-leez... )

    It shouldn't take the Feds extorting us with grant money to do something that we ought to have done on our own 20 years ago but that's too often the way it works in the fire service...
    "Nemo Plus Voluptatis Quam Nos Habant"

    The Code is more what you'd call "guidelines" than actual rules.

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    We just use plain english. I never understood the need for codes.

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    I guess we dont have "a clue" then. What I dont understand is why everyone thinks they need to tell everyone else how its best to operate. What works one place may not work somewhere else. Whatever happened to the local dept. running its own Dept. It isnt just 10 codes ( which in NYC ARE neccesary), its almost everything else...Interior or Exterior attack, type of Turnout gear used, type of lights on the rig, how many ladders are carried, size of hose, type of nozzle, type of uniform, color of rig, and the list goes on and on. Why not just make one USA fire dept, we all can work for the same agency....I can get detailed to Florida in the winter?? People are fooling themselves if they think EVERY city or town in this country need to do things exactly the same. Remember, alot of whats done today was developed BECAUSE departments run things their way, and came up with methods and equiptment that others eventually adopted. Its getting insane.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DeputyMarshal
    [sarcasm]Are you telling me that there are still departments out there backwards enough to use 10 codes?[/sarcasm]

    You'd think that, by now, nobody with any clue would still be using radio codes -- 10 codes or otherwise. How long have we had NFA ICS as a national model? The late 80's? For that matter, is there any flavor of ICS out there that doesn't espouse using "plain English"?

    It has never been kosher with the FCC to use "secret codes" on the public service airwaves. If your department uses codes, it has always been required to release them to the public if asked. (How many have department code sheets marked "Not for public release"? Does anyone really believe that every scanner and whacker-beeper junky out there in radio land doesn't know your radio codes? Puh-leez... )

    It shouldn't take the Feds extorting us with grant money to do something that we ought to have done on our own 20 years ago but that's too often the way it works in the fire service...
    The point I was trying to make was that I had not heard that the feds were going to start messing with funding over this. You have to remember that down in the south, we're still not with the rest of the world. Everyone around here still uses 10 codes, from the SO, MHP, and all fire services
    Chief
    Wren Volunteer Fire Department
    IACOJ
    Southern Division

    http://www.wrenfiredepartment.4t.com/

    In Memory of:
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    1946-2005
    "Rest in peace James, you now have the ultimate set of wings on you."

    Thanks, LeuitEFDems

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