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  1. #1
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    Default Engine Air Intake

    I was wondering where on late model custom apparatus is the engine air intake. I know on our late model Spartans that it is behind the right headlight assembly.

    Also curious if anyone has had problems with water being sucked in, and/or ember screens getting plugged up to offen.

    This started as a discussion in my FH with Katrina and using Apparatus in deep water.


  2. #2
    Forum Member MEck51's Avatar
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    Default

    Some trucks have intakes placed on the side of the truck in between the front row of seats and the rear seats, it is usaly behind some type of grille. Others have stacks that protrud thru the roof and others still have the more traditional behind the grille.

  3. #3
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    Default gimme air

    Every manufacturer, depending on the model, puts them in any number of different places. On the Quantum they are on the drivers side just back of the front bumper. They are subject to water ingestion if the water goes over the front bumper. The air cleaner itself sits low and once full of water starves the engine of oxygen. At least the engine isn't damaged. The electronics for most engines is on the left side rather low and is subject to water wicking and killing the brain box. Warning fire engines are not designed to ford deep water. Water will wick into front hubs and rear differentials and anything else exposed. Unless your unit is WATER PROOF most things are only water resisitant.

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    lvwrench

    Do you know if that set up applies to the Dash style cab?

    I agree that engines are not boats, but we will do with our equipment as the situation calls for.

    Also, does anyone know about E-Ones or KME?
    Last edited by PumpGuy; 08-29-2005 at 01:39 PM.

  5. #5
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    Default

    Our Enforcers have the air intake about 5'10" above ground level between the officer's door and the rear crew door.
    I remember watching a"Storm Stories"on the Weather Channel about the floods of 92 when one burg had a fire in the middle of town and couldn't get to it because the water was up above the intakes' level.
    Their solution was to whistle up a National Guard lowboy trailer and put the engine on that,haul it to the scene and set up to draft with the air high enough out of the water not to matter.
    I guess that manufacturers should place the air intake as high as possible even on rigs not destined to live and work in high flood risk areas.They might be sold to one that is such an area.


    Quote Originally Posted by lvwrench
    Every manufacturer, depending on the model, puts them in any number of different places. On the Quantum they are on the drivers side just back of the front bumper. They are subject to water ingestion if the water goes over the front bumper. The air cleaner itself sits low and once full of water starves the engine of oxygen. At least the engine isn't damaged. The electronics for most engines is on the left side rather low and is subject to water wicking and killing the brain box. Warning fire engines are not designed to ford deep water. Water will wick into front hubs and rear differentials and anything else exposed. Unless your unit is WATER PROOF most things are only water resisitant.

  6. #6
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    Default

    I like the way a lot of Pierces are set up, high on the side of the cab with the ember screen right there. That way if the screen sucks up a lot of junk you can just wipe it off, and it is placed plenty high as well.

    Birken

  7. #7
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    Default air

    Pump Guy I believe that the Pierce dash and Lance have the air intake on the drivers side back of the door and higher up than the Quantum. We flash flood here every so many years and the last one only took out one unit from total ingestion of water into the head from a water surge of about 6feet. All of our other units were restarted by punching a hole in the bottom of the air cleaner and draining the water out. Bring units to shop and replace air cleaners, front hub oil, rear differential gear lube, clean out garbage, pressure wash unit, throw some grease into places to force water out and away we went. In the past I have had units wick water into brain boxes and die, and into sensors and die. ECU's replaced at about$1500.00 a pop and sensors dried out with unit restart.

  8. #8
    Forum Member Dave1983's Avatar
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by lvwrench
    Pump Guy I believe that the Pierce dash and Lance have the air intake on the drivers side back of the door and higher up than the Quantum.
    The intake for the Dash and Enforcer is on the officers side above the front wheel between the cab and crew cab doors. Dont know about the new Lance. Our 93 Lance has a roof intake behind the drivers seat. As for the other Pierces, I dont know anything about the Arrow XT or the Contender. Its my understanding that like the Quantum, the intake for the Saber is underneath and has a problem with water.
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    Talking air

    Thanks Dave1983 for the update and clarification. I know that our new Lance is back of the drivers position as was our previous Lance pumpers from the late 80's. Sometimes these things change from year to year and model to model.

  10. #10
    Forum Member LeuitEFDems's Avatar
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    Default

    I just checked for the air intake today on our '01 Saber...it's on the Pass, side, at bumper level up front (ours is higher off the ground due to the 4WD option)
    The comments made by me are my opinions only, not of the Fire and EMS services I am affiliated with.

    I have lost my mind..has anyone seen it? it's not worth much..but it's mine

  11. #11
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    On our E-One Typhoon the air intake is just above the front wheel wells, on both sides. I'll have to check on our Cyclone II's.
    Stay low and move it in.

    Be safe.


    Larry

  12. #12
    Forum Member Dave1983's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lvwrench
    Thanks Dave1983 for the update and clarification. I know that our new Lance is back of the drivers position as was our previous Lance pumpers from the late 80's. Sometimes these things change from year to year and model to model.
    Yeah, they do like to change these things. The actual intake for our 88 Lance was in the middle between the front and rear cab, with openings on each side above the front wheels.
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  13. #13
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    Default

    The Biggest Problem We've Had With Fording Deep Water Is Getting The Transmission Wet. The Dip Stick Tube Does Not Always Seal Out That Kind Of Water. That Is An Expensive Swiming Lesson. Our Dept. Says Halfway Up The Wheels Means Stay Out.

  14. #14
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    In the aforementioned Pierce Lance the transmission dipstick is up just about as high as the air intake. There is a vent on top of the transmission that is a bit lower. But still pretty high. My judgement may be skewed (I am department mechanic) but I would tend to agree that if you want your apparatus to stay viable for the duration of the emergency and for the years to come, water up to the hubs is about as high as you can expect to go.

    Birken

  15. #15
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by BirkenVogt
    In the aforementioned Pierce Lance the transmission dipstick is up just about as high as the air intake. There is a vent on top of the transmission that is a bit lower. But still pretty high. My judgement may be skewed (I am department mechanic) but I would tend to agree that if you want your apparatus to stay viable for the duration of the emergency and for the years to come, water up to the hubs is about as high as you can expect to go.

    Birken
    Both our 02 Pierces (Dash & Enforcer) are good to 30" of water, or so the factory says. We havent tried it yet.
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  16. #16
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    I don't doubt they would run in it but the axles, hubs, u-joints, and all steering shafts and linkages and anything else you can think of are going to need attention after such an excursion and there are bound to be electrical problems as even the watertight connectors are not designed to be submerged.

    My point is, for a short term rescue situation it might be OK, but in a long term problem like this one, you are liable to start showing some problems before the incident is even over, and in a situation like this at least in my case you are probably going to have all your trucks out so losing even one is a bad idea.

    It is bound to be a tough call sometimes whether to go in the water or not.

    Birken

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