1. #1
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    Default Neat idea for crosslays.

    I saw this truck with a neat idea for the crosslays. They put them on trays to the side of the pump panel. I have never seen this before.
    Wouldent this make operating it easier, as the hoses are to the side of where the engineer stands. I also must be easier to reload.

    why dont we see more trucks like this?
    see it here.

    http://www.4guysfire.com/archive/delmar/delmar5.jpg

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    Actually, if you look around they are quite common. My question is what would be an appropriate method for packing the hose in the tray. Anyone?

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    Not sure what you mean by an appropriate method for loading, but we have cartridge loads for crosslays (these look to be the same concept), and we load similar to a triple layer in that that you pull the entire load out as "thirds," only our layers aren't stacked on top of one another, but stacked flat next to each other. I couldn't even begin to describe it better, but it works...

    The principal drawback that some folks would see to such an arrangement is that you've just added length to your rig. Putting the crosslays above the pump uses so called wasted space. Everyone has priorities in designing their rigs, and I suspect Delmar wasn't too worried about overall length by looking at the length of the cab, and overall rig length in general... Myself being a complete space monger, I would have put some sort of transverse compartment over the top crosslay for storage of rarely used longer items...

    Cartridges are great in that you can order extra trays, have hose pre-loaded back at the station, and put off washing/drying hose until a better time. Always a nice option for volunteer departments where staying longer to put the truck back in service may mean you're even later for work, away from a family function longer, etc.

    Sharp rig though. I like it.
    Last edited by npfd801; 09-13-2005 at 09:18 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by npfd801
    The principal drawback that some folks would see to such an arrangement is that you've just added length to your rig.
    Which is why I dont like them. As an engineer, I say the shorter the wheelbase the better.

    Departments around here are starting to put the crosslays on the fromt bumper. Talk about NICE.
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    Default reply

    What you show in that picture is actually called a speedlay. It is becoming more and more popular on side and top mount model pumps. E-One also uses them on there Metro ERV rear mount pump. I am a big fan of these and my department has them on a top mount pump and they work great. Ours do not have trays and i wish they did. I have seen the crosslays on the front bumper and they are a decent idea but i dotn see much advantage over a hose tray in the front bumper. Also some manufacturers who put crosslays in the front bumer do so by taking out the bumper re-inforcement, which i wouldnt recomend. The only time I would not suggest a speedlay is if you want a 4 door commercial cab with a top mount pump as this truck has a huge wheelbase to begin with so why add more to it. Just my 2 cents!

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    Quote Originally Posted by jake2415
    I have seen the crosslays on the front bumper and they are a decent idea but i dotn see much advantage over a hose tray in the front bumper.
    The advantage to the ones Ive seen is its a full size laod (200'-250') of 2" hose, not the 100' maybe 150" of of 1 1/2" or 1 3/4" like most bumper lines. They are also on top of the bumper, not down inside a tray, which makes them much easier to pull.
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    I'm with Dave on this one... the full-size hose troughs on the bumpers are great.
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    Default Just curious

    I was just wondering if they are above the bumper dont they interfere with the headlights and possibly warning lights? I suppose you could put both items on the front of the crosslay but it sure would look funky. Just wondering, let me know what you think and also if you have pictures of this being done with a full load of 2", thanks!

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    Quote Originally Posted by jake2415
    I was just wondering if they are above the bumper dont they interfere with the headlights and possibly warning lights? I suppose you could put both items on the front of the crosslay but it sure would look funky. Just wondering, let me know what you think and also if you have pictures of this being done with a full load of 2", thanks!
    Look on Rosenbaurs website for the Techdrive pumper. It has front bumper preconnects like they are talking about.
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    Default Front Bumper Hose Beds (Crosslays)

    I saw this design on their Tech Drive 2005 truck and it looks like a good idea BUT what about the front bumper crash protection because the only way it can be done it to "notch" the frame rails to get the hose bed lowered and full width. That being said what does it do to the frontal integrity of the cab if in an collision??

    A number of FD's in Eastern Canada that prefer the enclosed Pump Operator's panel utilize the Innovative brand full rollout Speedlay trays that are right above the frame and so easy to deploy and reload from either side and they don't add that much to the pump panel module width.

    Toronto, Mississauga, Burlington and a few others use them on their newest Engines.

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    that is an alright idea for a mostly rural operation where the engine is to be up the drive. in the city, we tend to put the engine past the fire building. this is were we are better served with either the use of crosslays or working off of the hose bed. It all comes down to accurately sizing up your potential and combinintg it with sound tactical decisions.
    In my department we use a combo of speedlays (1.5" trash fog 100', 1.75" sb 300'), crosslays (1.75" fog 200', 2.5" sb 250'), and hose beds (2.5" 200' wyed to 1.75 fog 200'; 5" 700', and 3" blitzfire 400').
    We are assesing for a new engine our loads and it seems we'll elimnate the speedlays (wheel base consideration) and looad the rear with 600' 2.5", 1000' 5", and keep the 3" the same.
    We are a medium to light industry, high retail, and moster house suburb.
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    Quote Originally Posted by aerialguy1
    I saw this design on their Tech Drive 2005 truck and it looks like a good idea BUT what about the front bumper crash protection because the only way it can be done it to "notch" the frame rails to get the hose bed lowered and full width. That being said what does it do to the frontal integrity of the cab if in an collision??
    I wouldnt go with a recessed tray. The ones I have scene are from Pierce and they are on top of the bumper and do not compromise the bumpers integrity. Also, they do not affect the headlights/front warning lights/turn signals.
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    Default Crosslay Hose Bed Designs

    I agree with DAVE1983 that putting them on top makes more sense and safer but you get those who don't like the astetics of how it looks. As to the post by LEDEBUR1 I'd wonder how do you reload and I personally don't like the use of a pull out tray due to the ergonomics of it.

    I'm also seeing a number of FD's going to Multiple Rear Pre-Connects as they find it easier to deploy off the rear to go to either side of the apparatus so to keep the OAL and WB shorter and yet still have a front Trashline discharge.

    In Canada a lot of FD's in Ontario are going with Roll-Out Speedlays that are right at the frame rail height and deploy out each side for ease of reloading and dont' compromise the wheelbase that much if at all depending on how its designed.

    If you go to www.torontofirepics.com you can see a number of their Engines with the Speedlay design behind the RH (yes they have the Operator's Panel on the RH curb side to protect the operator) roll-up door.

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    Here is my departments new LaFrance delivered about 2 years ago.

    Vernon ET-241 (crosslay shot)

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    We just spec'd a pumper with speedlay's. Like previously mentioned, it adds approx 15-18 inches to the overall length. Most of the comittee members were for it (myself included). We have a front bumper hose tray/front suction, so putting anykind of preconnect on the front bumper was out. We should be getting the truck by the end of the year, should be nice.

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    Our Pierces have the hose trays just in front of the midships panel and we use the minuteman load for all three-Yellow and Red 200' 2" attack lines and the blue 200' 2" RIT line.


    Quote Originally Posted by CdnFyreGuy
    Actually, if you look around they are quite common. My question is what would be an appropriate method for packing the hose in the tray. Anyone?

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    Default Lowered Crosslays/Speedlays

    We had the manufacturer push the height of our preconnects down close to the street. We also have a bumper bin with 100' of 1.75". I like having the cover on the front bumper line. It looks cleaner. We also keep our high-rise paks on the officer's-side first compartment behind the pump panel. If additional lines are needed, we can connect and deploy those with a gated wye. Just another idea.

    Here are some pics;
    http://deepwaterfd.photosite.com

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    Question Eh guys... need an opinion on something.

    Hi guys... / girls too if you're in here. Wondering the advantages of a minuteman load. One of the guys on our department swears by them and is making the suggestion to modify our existing loads to minutemans... frankly, I've never really worked with them so in my opinion, the deployment seems a bit cranky for most applications. I'm just trying to figure out what it is that's got him so bent into shape over this load... I noticed that all your loads are minuteman on that one truck... so I was trying to figure out what the rational is behind it.

    some guys seem to have an attitude that "as long as it comes off the truck, it's good enough." My other department has a good load that gets the line out fast, and allows the PO to get water to the nozzle pronto- with minimal kinking. Seems you'd have to walk out a minuteman completely before you have a chance to get some water through it... and 200ft is a long way to walk before you start to charge a line.

    So can someone sell me on it? Help me see the light!
    Last edited by Eno821; 10-23-2005 at 04:57 PM.
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