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  1. #21
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    We have guys on our department that habitually cut it close (seconds) and are even late(after 0700 or 1800). Guys are very quick to bust balls and even lose tempers at the offenders. This has been corrected by moving "offenders" to shifts with stricter line officers, however not formally recorrecting. Most of all "minor" offenses such as tardiness are kept on the floor as long as possible, because once admin is involved paperwork is created, grievences are filed, Union money is spent ect.... Most of the time once a guy gets his balls busted for this he gets his stuff together and it stops.

    As for the other 98% of the department we arrive about 15-30 min prior to shift change out of respect to off going shift, just dont mandate it


  2. #22
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    RFDACM, you wrote: "Per FLSA you can be "forced" to work if you are present up to 10 min. prior to your shift...FLSA also says you can be held over up to 10 minutes w/o OT."

    Where did you get this from??? I'd be VERY interested to see that myself. I have never heard of such a thing.
    Last edited by Smokeater95; 11-19-2006 at 12:15 PM. Reason: forgot address

  3. #23
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    I was taught in rookie school
    If your early your on time, If your on time your late, and if your late your left.

    Have caught a few working fires by coming in early, on the other side caught a good commerical fire because the shift that relieves my shift are all minutemen. Generally try to get there about 30 min. early.

    On the other side does anyone have any suggestions for getting someone on the other shift to leave the firehouse. We have one guy who hangs around the firehouse up to an hour after his shift is over. At first it was funny but now its old. None of really dislike the guy, we just don't like talking to him. He'll tell you his life story and anything else you don't not want to know, and then he leaves his crap lying around the station.

  4. #24
    Forum Member Nozzleman25's Avatar
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    Our shift is 0800-0800, most guys are in the station by 0730. I get there about 0700, gives me time to have a cup of coffee, read the paper etc. If a call comes in I will take it. Usually if it is between 0700 and 0730 the officer I releive will go but I am there if he wants to get out early or something.

  5. #25
    Forum Member johnny46's Avatar
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    Our relief time is 0630 and most guys are at the station before 0600. However, we're not late until the morning taps. Guys who regularly slip under the wire aren't highly thought of. It's better to get there early and get your crap together prior to the shift change.

  6. #26
    Forum Member RRFD77's Avatar
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    I try to have my equipment on the load 30 minutes prior to our start time. Some people come in later but the general consensus on my group is 30 minutes prior to start time (0700 days-1700 nights) or you are late. By me getting there early it allows me to get into the flow of the day easier and really go over my equipment with a fine tooth comb.

  7. #27
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    Default On behalf of all minutemen

    I agree with nearly everything that everyone has said. It's good to be early, and it is bad to be late. However -

    Shift change is at 0700. Daycare opens @0645.

    So hey don't kick all of us in the a&^ for not bringing a cup and a pastry at 615.

  8. #28
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    Their are two issues here the first is what is your standard? (what does it say in the rules and regs?) By the rule or contract or whatever if the time is 0800 then 07:59:59 is OK.
    The true issue is what is the expectation, We start at 0800 (the rule) but that should mean you are dressed, gear on the rig, pass on from who you are relieving and mask checked out. I'd like to witness this if you can do that in 5 minutes.
    If your culture is minutemen then change the culture. Officers lead by example, barn boss you too. If your the new guy guilt the older guys into compliance. You don't wear an orange apron, it is not OK to stroll out on the floor at 20 after. Also it is not fair to have your relief hold over while you take your sweet time getting ready.

    Lets be the professionals we all know we are capable of being.

  9. #29
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    Default Shift change

    We change shifts at 0700. Our Code of Conduct states:

    "Personnel shall report for their tour of duty as early as necessary to arrange personal equipment for immediate emergency response at 07:00 hours."

    For some of our people, they can do it in 10 minutes or less. For others, it takes a half-hour.

  10. #30
    Let's talk fire trucks! BoxAlarm187's Avatar
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    Our shift change is at 0700, and I'm never there later than 0625. There are a lot of guys at the station (amongst all three shifts) that get there at 0600 hours every shift.

    We come into the station and immediately take off the person we're relieving's gear, put our gear on, and check all of our personal equipment (PPE, SCBA, handlights, TIC, etc). The drivers for the day will have all of thier equipment checks done by 0730, and by 0800 we're starting house duties.

    I've firmly believed since recruit school that you're on time when you're 30 minutes early.

  11. #31
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    I know, it is an old post, but it is one I liked.

    I arrive at my station for my 8:00 shift at about 7:20-7:30 every shift. The one time I had to fix my motorcycle on the way to work, I had to pull the seat and gas tank off to fix gas leaking from the fuel shutoff, and still made it to work 15 minutes early. I don't like to have to take an EMS run 5 minutes before shift change, so I try to be early for the next crew. I also do not like to be hurried in the morning. With the road construction in the area I live in, I can not rule out a traffic jam on the interstate everyday, so I PLAN on being in one.

  12. #32
    Forum Member CooterRob's Avatar
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    I always show up 30 minutes early to pull my gear out check it out... look my rig over for any equipment changes that were not put on the board, get a full report of what went on the shift prior. If I'm driving then I do the driver check list. I see guys doing this stuff 3 or 4 hours after shift starts and find them at the computer looking "BUSY", hiding from the brass chatting or eating breakfast. Kinda dumb considering you can get a call in that time period. Oh well... lastly I also then wash the rig if it needs it. I guess I'm a model FF...

    I am new where I am at BTW...

    :-)
    "I don't wanna hear about it... I wanna see results!!!":-P

  13. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by CooterRob View Post
    I always show up 30 minutes early to pull my gear out check it out... look my rig over for any equipment changes that were not put on the board, get a full report of what went on the shift prior. If I'm driving then I do the driver check list. I see guys doing this stuff 3 or 4 hours after shift starts and find them at the computer looking "BUSY", hiding from the brass chatting or eating breakfast. Kinda dumb considering you can get a call in that time period. Oh well... lastly I also then wash the rig if it needs it. I guess I'm a model FF...

    I am new where I am at BTW...

    :-)
    Hey CooterRob, You interested in a career move???

    Yes, you are a model FF compared to many I've known.

    C6

  14. #34
    Forum Member HeavyRescueTech's Avatar
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    my shift is 6am to 6pm. I get here at 6am, and I (hope) to be leaving at 6pm, when I am relieved by the night crew. I am expected to be in uniform with all my personal equipment and ready to go at 6am at my station. and I am paid for my 12 hour shift, and just my 12 hour shift.

    I work a FT EMS job, but I would probably do the same if I was on a FT FD job. Maybe arrive 15 minutes early if we all had coffee together or something like that. and I would arrive 15-30 minutes early to prevent the night crew from a late job, but only if i knew that if the night crew did the same for me, and took a late job, I could leave early (when they left for the job) and still get paid for my full 8/12/24 hours.

    Here is my point of view: I am paid to do a job. I don't work for free. It is my responsibility to make sure I am ready to do my job. That means I am in uniform, my PPE is in the same condition that I left it (good), and I am ready to do my job.

    should a full debriefing occur? absolutely. should the truck checks be completed before the first run of the day? sure. should the apparatus be washed when it won't be interrupted? of course. you want to know how you would get me to come in an hour early to get this done? pay me for my time!!! or rather, let the off coming crew leave when their relief shows up, without docking his pay/timecard.

    For those that come in an hour+ before shift change, and the off coming crew can't leave early, where does it end? come in early to check your gear. come in early to check your truck. come in early to get a full debriefing. come in early to check your FH.com email. come in to check your dept email. wash the floors. repair the burnt out bulbs in the apparatus bay. maybe even teach the guys how to use a new tool?

    Even better, is it worked into your union contract that you are expected to show up for work an hour or more early for no compensation?

    since coming in early appears to be very beneficial to your operation, why not add it to your contract that crews can come in early (and get paid for it), so you can get all the turnover stuff done, make sure everything is ready to go when the shift officially ends, and everyone is getting paid for the work they are doing?
    If my basic HazMat training has taught me nothing else, it's that if you see a glowing green monkey running away from something, follow that monkey!

    FF/EMT/DBP

  15. #35
    Let's talk fire trucks! BoxAlarm187's Avatar
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    I come in early because I want to ensure that the rig is ready to go before I'm "officially" on-duty before 7AM.

    I also relieve the off-going shift as soon as I get there, so if I 0630 call comes in (we have shift change at 7), they won't get stuck on it past the end of the their scheduled shift. The guys assigned to the medic for the day espically appreciate this.

    The other two shifts do this also, so I don't have to worry about a drawn-out call close to shift change.

    I don't mind "working for free" as you put it. I love the job, and don't mind getting their early to check my gear, rig, and other items to ensure when Ms Smith calls 911 at 0701 that I'm not at the mercy of the previous shift as to whether or not things are good to go. It's not because I don't trust them, it's because we're all human and mistakes happen.
    Career Fire Captain
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    Never taking for granted that I'm privileged enough to have the greatest job in the world!

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