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  1. #1
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    Default Open Cab Apparatus

    We have a 1984 Seagrave pumper as a backup 2 to new pumpers. We still need it to support out ops, but there are concerns that we are open to liability by operating an open crew cab truck. The money isnt there to replace it.

    Should we keep it in service?


  2. #2
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    Smile legal?

    What does the city/town legal beagle have to say? Probably a safety issue for the guys rather than the citizenry? Seat belts? Full open cab or half cab?

  3. #3
    MembersZone Subscriber dmleblanc's Avatar
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    There are still plenty of open cab apparatus out there....from a liability standpoint, if they were existing before NFPA recommended enclosed cabs, they are grandfathered in (BTW, NFPA is just that, a "recommendation"....it is a standard but not the law). If you have taken all other prudent steps to ensure the safety of those riding in it (i.e., a written SOP requiring seat belt use, mansaver bars or gates across the crosswalk, relegating it to "reserve" or backup status so it's used less than the other, "safer" trucks), then I think you've limited your liability considerably.

    Be prepared to also demonstrate that you're working toward a replacement...in other words, be able to prove that you really can't afford to replace it at present, but are planning to do so in the future.
    Chief Dwayne LeBlanc
    Paincourtville Volunteer Fire Department
    Paincourtville, LA

    "I have a dream. It's not a big dream, it's just a little dream. My dream — and I hope you don't find this too crazy — is that I would like the people of this community to feel that if, God forbid, there were a fire, calling the fire department would actually be a wise thing to do. You can't have people, if their houses are burning down, saying, 'Whatever you do, don't call the fire department!' That would be bad."
    — C.D. Bales, "Roxanne"

  4. #4
    Forum Member backsteprescue123's Avatar
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    Default

    The dept. where I am at has two open cab apparatus. A 1984 Pierce and a 1978 Sutphen, both have Mansaver bars.

    http://www.rossfordfire.com/790.html

    http://www.rossfordfire.com/791.html
    ------------------------------------
    These opinions are mine and do not reflect the opinions of any organizations I am affiliated with.
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  5. #5
    Forum Member Weruj1's Avatar
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    Default

    RFRD is correct they are half open cabs ...........before the 1998 E-One we ran a pair of open cab ALF 700 series IIRC. Those were the days ..............
    IACOJ both divisions and PROUD OF IT !
    Pardon me sir.. .....but I believe we are all over here !
    ATTENTION ALL SHOPPERS: Will the dead horse please report to the forums.(thanks Motown)
    RAY WAS HERE 08/28/05
    LETHA' FOREVA' ! 010607
    I'm sorry, I haven't been paying much attention for the last 3 hours.....what were we discussing?
    "but I guarentee you I will FF your arse off" from>
    http://www.firehouse.com/forums/show...60#post1137060post 115

  6. #6
    Let's talk fire trucks! BoxAlarm187's Avatar
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    Default

    Food for thought only, NFPA 1901 Annex D "suggests" an effort to have all vehicle built prior to 1991 to attempt to come into compliance with the current edition of 1901. Naturally, this would include enclosed riding areas for all personnel.

  7. #7
    Forum Member Monrovia1's Avatar
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    Default

    A department out here did that, They spent the money to have what was than there 2nd out engine a partially enclosed pumper and had fully enclosed
    Allot of the half enclosed units in this area are mostly in reserve very few left in front line service

  8. #8
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    Seatbelts are the issue here. Looking at apparatus accidents the open cab isn't the issue if you are belted in. In 1990 ish? a Waterbury Ct. rig was involved in an accident due in part to poor maintenance. The rig was an open cab and a firefighter standing in the open cab was trapped between the cab and the maddydale. Aside from that firefighters have been injured falling out of the cab. If you wear a seatbelt you won't be adding to the liability.
    Their are thousands of open cabs in the US, and their isn't real evidence that the open cab itself is a contributer to firefighter injuries and deaths.
    Now, if you have riots in your area then the open cab is an issue.

  9. #9
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    Default

    Howard A. Hughes, and Heriberto Rivera died in that Waterbury Ct accident on May 10th 1990.

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