Thread: 48/96 Cons

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    Question 48/96 Cons

    My department is looking at the 48/96 schedule. I have found plenty of pros to it and I think I am sold on it but I was wondering if any of you that have experience with it have found any downsides to the schedule?

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    Check the legality of it in your state. Here in KY paid departments are 24-48 per statute.

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    Here is a website from the Boise Fire Department that has good resources regarding the 48/96 schedule

    http://www.48-96.com/
    Buckle Up, Slow Down, Arrive Alive
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    IACOJ 2003

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    We actually went to this website to get some info and had some good info. Very biased but good info.....

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    Does that mean you actually work 48 hours strait?
    A'int No Rocket Scientist's in The Firehall

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    Does that mean you actually work 48 hours strait?
    YES you work 48 on then are off 4 days straight.
    Front line since 1983 and still going strong

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    48 hours? man I am a bag of crap after 24, dont think I'd like that one
    A'int No Rocket Scientist's in The Firehall

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    Default also called a 2 x 4

    where is Bou..............do a quick search .................
    IACOJ both divisions and PROUD OF IT !
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    I'm sorry, I haven't been paying much attention for the last 3 hours.....what were we discussing?
    "but I guarentee you I will FF your arse off" from>
    http://www.firehouse.com/forums/show...60#post1137060post 115

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    Bou is in Southern Calie right now testing for a Captains position.
    Front line since 1983 and still going strong

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    Well GOOD LUCK BOU !!!!!!! may the curse of mini-me NOT be upon you !
    IACOJ both divisions and PROUD OF IT !
    Pardon me sir.. .....but I believe we are all over here !
    ATTENTION ALL SHOPPERS: Will the dead horse please report to the forums.(thanks Motown)
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    LETHA' FOREVA' ! 010607
    I'm sorry, I haven't been paying much attention for the last 3 hours.....what were we discussing?
    "but I guarentee you I will FF your arse off" from>
    http://www.firehouse.com/forums/show...60#post1137060post 115

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    48 on and 96 off......Can be very tough on the family, especially your spouse.
    If your kids are young, she would have to get the kids to the sitter, pick them up and cater to their every need alone for 48 hours. If the kids are teenagers you might as well call her “Chauffer”. I feel the cost savings on drive time and maintenance would be offset by the added childcare costs.
    With any wheel we work in this job (except staff) the family takes a hit. Ask their opinion before pushing for it. It might just save you half of your retirement.
    I also think that the drivers are being put in a tough spot. A busy 48 hour shift would be taxing on the driver mentally. Accident cause do to exhaustion is preventable. Provisions need to be in writing prior to going to this schedule to protect the employees.
    How would this affect your sick bank? Can you come in at anytime that you start feeling better or are you compelled to be taxed the full 48 hours?
    How does this affect your overtime? Can you work a 72 or does this limit the off duty pool to only pulling from the one group not affected?

    I work a 4 group system on a 42 hour work wheel. I can not talk from experience but I do see cons.
    IACOJ

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    Mulldog, I think that a lot of people see the same things you see when looking at the schedule. As with any change it would be an adjustment. Right now I work the Modified Kelly, Berkley, what ever you want to call it and here is the way I look at it. If I have a busy 24 hour shift I have 24 hours to recover unless it is my 4 day. It is much easier to recover over 4 days rather than one, even if it is a 48 hour shift. Our neighboring deparment went to the schedule and they love it.

    The website that was posted outlines the schedule and some of the results of it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by KyleIce
    Mulldog, I think that a lot of people see the same things you see when looking at the schedule. As with any change it would be an adjustment. Right now I work the Modified Kelly, Berkley, what ever you want to call it and here is the way I look at it. If I have a busy 24 hour shift I have 24 hours to recover unless it is my 4 day. It is much easier to recover over 4 days rather than one, even if it is a 48 hour shift. Our neighboring deparment went to the schedule and they love it.

    The website that was posted outlines the schedule and some of the results of it.
    Kyle, you're quite right about the recovery time. However why are you not considering 24/72? It would seem to be a much more satisfactory choice
    A'int No Rocket Scientist's in The Firehall

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    Quote Originally Posted by Smoke20286
    Kyle, you're quite right about the recovery time. However why are you not considering 24/72? It would seem to be a much more satisfactory choice
    I guess I am not following....if I am working 1 on/3 off wouldn't that mean that there are 4 seprate shifts? We currently have only 3 shifts.

    Or are you thinking if 24/48?

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    Quote Originally Posted by KyleIce
    I guess I am not following....if I am working 1 on/3 off wouldn't that mean that there are 4 seprate shifts? We currently have only 3 shifts.

    Or are you thinking if 24/48?
    If I have a busy 24 hour shift I have 24 hours to recover unless it is my 4 day. It is much easier to recover over 4 days rather than one
    I was thinking with 24/72 you would have 3 days to recover, without having to work 48 strait
    A'int No Rocket Scientist's in The Firehall

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    Thumbs down

    No thanks. May be good for the young ones, but us old timers have had enough after 24. I just got off a 48 (24 of OT) and I feel like I got over by a quint.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Smoke20286
    Kyle, you're quite right about the recovery time. However why are you not considering 24/72? It would seem to be a much more satisfactory choice
    24/72 is a 42 hr week. The 48/96 is a 56 hr week. Big difference.

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    Quote Originally Posted by gunnyv
    24/72 is a 42 hr week. The 48/96 is a 56 hr week. Big difference.
    This is a schedule that I have never heard of. Does this mean that there are 4 shifts (i.e. A,B,C,D)??

    If that is the case, this is not a possibility for us. We only have 3.

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    Quote Originally Posted by KyleIce
    This is a schedule that I have never heard of. Does this mean that there are 4 shifts (i.e. A,B,C,D)??
    That is correct. Try to sell hiring 25% more FFs so you can get more time off

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    24/72 was a management suggestion here, they put it forward as a way to SAVE money, even though it required an extra shift. I have no idea why, it was before my time. 24/72 is fairly common on the east coast.
    A'int No Rocket Scientist's in The Firehall

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    48/96 works out the same to modified kelley hours wise with FLSA (Different lenght comp periods)

    It works for us as we are small dept with less than 1000 calls a year. I LOVE having 4days off all the time, it feels like I don't even work.

    I walk to work, but if you cut half of your commute out, you would save some money.

    I got romped on last week, I worked a 48 plus picked up a OT 24. Had a bunch of calls (lost track), A fire and a low angle rescue (Guy rolled his truck 250 down a hill) I was tired after that.

    We also have a very open house, my wife usually is here for dinner every night I am on shift.

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    If I were working 24/72 I wouldn't be interested, but we work 24/48. I would like to try it since there has never been a department to conduct a trial period and then vote it down. In fact, I haven't heard of any that have voted less than 90% in favor after the trial.

    I would take the advice of those who work or have worked the shift a lot more seriously than somebody who has never tried it.

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    I work a 48/96 and I love the schedule. When I first came on, we worked a day-24-night. Most guys traded that last night off and ended up working a 48. That was the origination of our current schedule. Sure, some guys have problems with the schedule, but the ones that do go into a support division such as Fire Prevention or Arson (40-hour week) or our dispatch center (42-hour week).

    Plus, when you trade or have vacation for a 48, that's 10 days off at the lake baby!

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    Here is my schedule and I absolutely love it...
    It is a 16 day cycle and it starts on a Tuesday. It is somewhat difficult to explain but try to follow me here...all shifts are 24 hours...
    Tuesday-Wed. off-Thursday-Fri. off-Saturday-Sun. off-Monday-3 0ff-Friday-Sat. off-Sunday-2 off-Wednesday-5 off...
    Basically you have one long week and then the rest is a cakewalk...
    Also incorporated into that is a Kelley system which either gives you a day or night trick off approx. every 3 weeks...
    Also, EMS is integrated into our department so if you are a paramedic as I am, you work 12 on the box and then 12 on the engine in the rotation of day-night-off...so basically every third day you work you are on the engine for 24, but you might have to fill in at another station, which is never bad...
    Personally, I believe it to be the best rotation and not just because I work it...I believe it speaks for itself...

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    Thumbs down How busy??

    IMHO... You hit a hot station on that schedule (48/96) and you would be a danger to yourself, your crew, and the public!! Might work in a slow house, but it would not be the safest schedule to work...not that what we do is "safe" anyqway...but that schedule is just asking for an increase in injuries and accidents!

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