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Thread: KME Selling?

  1. #21
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    It sounds like your problem is with the service department of your "KME " dealership , I would contact the president of ( KME ) !


  2. #22
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    Massffpm60, i read your post and sorry to hear about your quint failing at every Major fire you had. If you are not having satisfaction with getting answers and upset, which i know i would be due to i would not want my quint failing at any fire. please let me know your department name and information, i will do my very best to get you some help , i know a lot of people like to come on this forum and bash KME along with many other manufactors, but that is not helping anyone, it onlys makes issue worse, of couse we all have problems with new appartus, but if you can't offer help to brother fireman in getting issues taken care of, why be a brother firefighter, and i think i have a pretty good connection into KME if you saw the previous post i wrote on here, so please let me know if i can help,

    Donald Leshko
    Fire Chief
    Hazleton Fire Department
    Hazleton, PA 18201

  3. #23
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    Unhappy Ditto, Ditto, and Ditto.

    Quote Originally Posted by massffpm60
    we have a kme quint it has failed at every major fire we had sence we got it i would like to hear from all departments that have had problems with there kme
    That's exactly the same experience with ours! That is, if it ever makes it that far. It often dies on the apron, or two blocks out while enroute, though. I feel sorry as of late for all the people at KME;I mean I don't want anybody to go out of business or lose their jobs, for pete's sake. But common guys, it's high time for a major engineering and philosophy overhaul.

    Go on back in this thread, way back, and look up the threads on KME issues, buddy! We're going over old issues on this one. By the way, how old or new is yours? Anyway, good luck.

  4. #24
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    CptnMatt
    If i could can i ask yea a few questions on the matter you talked about, what year is your KME?? make, model and vehicle type?? what department do you run with?? and the problem you are talking about, does it happen everytime you take the vehicle out of the station?? Did you have it checked out when it did this and what did the service people come up with?? and do you know by chance who your dealer is??

    IF you could answer those questions for me, i can see if i can find out some answers for you or get you help if hte problem is still not fixed, sounds pretty serious to me that it keeps dieing every time the vehicles come out no your apron or gets two blocks away and dies. so please if you can write me back, even email me if you want c229@ptd.net i have some good contacts at the KME plants and try to get you some answers and get this situation fixed so we can get your vehicle back in service.

    Donald Leshko
    Fire Chief
    Hazleton Fire Department
    Hazleton , PA 18201

  5. #25
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    Cool Well, Since You Asked,...

    Dear hfdchiefone,
    Well, kind Sir, I surely do appreciate your concern for a fellow department, and I am appreciative of your willingness to intervene. However, I really don't think that there is anything extraordinarily facile, i.e., any one thing that can be singled out as to what would be a simple, easy fix on this animal. It's not like the situation is merely that there is some minor thing that scores of mechanics, in the course of dozens upon dozens of trips to both the local dealers, as well as the main factory in Pennsylvania, [a 1,000 miles away], haven't been able to remedy already. I mean, It's not as if we're incapable of sound and prudent operation, or maintenance, of this thing. The comments of mine of it's dying on the way to the fire, on occasions, is not the main issue, anyway. What DOES INDEED seem to be the common area of unreliability in this 1998 100' Aerialcat is both the computer-controlled electrical system that does all of the BAD THINGS that oh-so-many other owners have repeatedly mentioned on this website over a great many years, and the aerial's numerous sensors that automatically shut this thing down ON ITS OWN ACCORD, WITHOUT LETTING ANYONE KNOW WHY THE AERIAL'S DOWN. AND IT COULD BE FOR ANY ONE OF A GREAT NUMBER OF REASONS! FAULTY SENSORS, WIRING FAULTS IN THE CIRCUITRY, BAD WIRES THEMSELVES. we've experienced them all, and more, and so have many, many, others here as well.

    Now, to digress over to a point of personal opinion, I think that the model's most glairing design flaw is from AN ARROGANT COMPUTER CHIP DESIGNER WHO THINKS THAT A CHIP SHOULD HAVE MORE AUTHORITY THAN THE ENGINEERS THEMSELVES OVER THE OPERATION OF THEIR AERIALCAT!!! Again, this last point is just an opinion of mine, having been assigned to operate this thing for a few years, before becoming a Captain.

    WE, THE NUMEROUS KME AERIALCAT OPERATORS WHO'VE COMPLAINED ON THIS WEBSITE HERE, HAVE EXPERIENCED THEM ALL, AND MORE, OVER THE YEARS. IT'S NOT JUST ME ALONE, AS THESE FORUM SITES HAVE DISPLAYED. It's not just us alone, in my department, alone.

    This aerial has failed us in the midst of greatest need consistantly, especially at the last two mega-fires of ours that each made National news from here over the last 4 years alone. So no, Dear Chief, I don't quite honestly think that there is anything that you could personally do for us -or all the other KME aerial owners across the United States- other than intervene with the engineers at KME to redesign their entire electrical systems to be more trouble-free and (While they are at it) more user friendly. Specifically, there should be a screen, readout, or indicator light system (You and they can choose which: - I don't care which!) that tells the Apparatus Engineer/Operator just why the truck will no longer work. It shouldn't just shut down your aerial on its own without letting you at least know why!!!

    And you shouldn't have to go chasing all over the rig, and opening up various panels to bend down and into the dark inner recesses of the electrical systems to try to trip relays or other such nonsense in order to regain some sense of control of the apparatus. Especially in the midst of the confusion of any fire scene that's big enough to be needing a 100' Aerial in action, anyway.

    And the electrical system should be reworked so that overloads don't burn up all the wiring itself that's running throughout the whole rig, while they're at it. What, why, or how they decide to do that, I don't know or exactly care. I'm not the electrical engineer. I'm the Apparatus Engineer.

    Well, you asked for it, so there it is. The opinions mentioned throughout this post are mine alone, but they are based on real and personal experiences of mine, and the references to the opinion and comments of others are to the best of my recollection. As I said in my earlier post, I don't have any particular hard feelings for KME personally, and I do think there is a huge hole for improvement in all American Fire Apparatus types built by all manufacturers. KME has the potential to go into a deep retreat, and come out at the end of it, with a totally innovative and uniquely reliable line of 21st Century American Fire Apparatus that don't look anything like the staid old rigs that we all are using up to now; -designs that haven't significantly changed since the early 1920's. There is every potential that they (KME)could become the brand that would be the MUST HAVE in every engine bay in the U.S., instead of the other way around . It's all up to them. If you want to really help, maybe you could help Them to see that.

    Thanks, once again, Chief, for your concern, and have a nice day.

  6. #26
    Forum Member blmoore20's Avatar
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    Default I'm getting tired of this...

    Everyone is entitled to their onions but please don't try to pass off your "feelings" as fact. I did a search or these forums for "Aerialcat failure" and "KME aerial failure" and found nothing relevent.

    NFPA requires safety systems on all aerials to prevent us from doing something stupid. If your aerial is "shutting down" during operations,could it be operators doing something they are not supposed to do?

    The Chief asked if he could help you out and you gave him nothing but personal opinion and unfounded "facts".

    Our department has 3 KME's a 1989, 1995 and 2002. All trucks have been very reliable. The 1995 had an alternator go at a fire and the pump operator couldn't bring up the pressure but is this KMEs fault, NFPA's for making us move away from manual throttles or is it just simple equipment failure?

    I'm sorry I choose you to sound off on you, but these forums should be constructive and informative but more often than not they turn into bashing things you personally don't like. That's fine but don't try to pass it off as fact.

  7. #27
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    Default Well, well...

    Quote Originally Posted by blmoore20
    Everyone is entitled to their onions but please don't try to pass off your "feelings" as fact. I did a search or these forums for "Aerialcat failure" and "KME aerial failure" and found nothing relevent.

    NFPA requires safety systems on all aerials to prevent us from doing something stupid. If your aerial is "shutting down" during operations,could it be operators doing something they are not supposed to do?

    The Chief asked if he could help you out and you gave him nothing but personal opinion and unfounded "facts".

    Our department has 3 KME's a 1989, 1995 and 2002. All trucks have been very reliable. The 1995 had an alternator go at a fire and the pump operator couldn't bring up the pressure but is this KMEs fault, NFPA's for making us move away from manual throttles or is it just simple equipment failure?

    I'm sorry I choose you to sound off on you, but these forums should be constructive and informative but more often than not they turn into bashing things you personally don't like. That's fine but don't try to pass it off as fact.
    Dear blmoore,

    I can't for the life of me see where you can possibly say that what I related to the other gentleman was anything but the facts as I, and numerous others, have experienced them to be over many, many years. In fact, I thought that I was very courteous and respectful to not only hfdchiefone, but the people at KME as well. I thought that I was in fact most constructive on my suggestions for improvement on the existing system, and also how KME might become the best fire apparatus line in the future. Where on God's Green Earth do you get anything other that that from my post?

    In addition, these comments of mine did not spring forth in a spurious moment of anger or vitriol, but were rather what I have carefully thought about for many years and wanted to eventually put forth at the appropriate moment. This appeared to be such a time and place. You cannot negate the truth of these facts with your dismissive charge of 'onions' (opinions?), as they all did indeed happen as I said.

    In addition, I never said that was ever any aerial structural failure, but rather my comments were in regard to a failure to function, let alone mentioning their historical failures to be able to even stay in service at a rate comparable to other apparatus in our bays; and these web sites are chock full of other such postings, indeed. In fact, a post just a bit earlier than mine also referred to their sensors mudding up and icing up an inordinate amount of time, as just one minor example, and also mentioned issues of down time, I believe, so get real. You didn't do much looking here on your own before you shot off back at me.

    Nobody here, or anywhere else, as far as I can tell, ever said anything bad about KME pumpers. Ever, so far as I can tell. Is this, by chance, what all 3 of your apparatus are. If so, then why chime in here at all? If not, then just kindly share with us what KME Aerialcat(s) you do own, and share with us just how reliably they have performed for you that you personally know about. Just the facts, please. I wouldn't want onions clouding the issue here. Have a nice day.

  8. #28
    MembersZone Subscriber jfTL41's Avatar
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    Grumman made junk, went out of business...KME bought Grumman Aerials...any questions?

  9. #29
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    Default KME vs. pierce

    i am inquiring about KME Vs. pierce. company is looking at the pierce enforcer vs. the KME predator i need some input that would. i am personally for pierce but i am just looking for some insight

  10. #30
    Forum Member IronsMan53's Avatar
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    Most of what you would get on here is personal brand loyalty BS. Don't buy into any of it. If someone gives you a heads up about something specific about each brand then research it yourself before you believe them.

    The ABSOLUTE BEST thing for your company to do is to get each dealer to bring you Enforcer and Predator demo rigs so that you can make a fair and informed comparison. Don't just look at how nice each one looks. Climb all over the rigs and check out the body construction, how the electrical wiring is run, fit and finish of components, cab crew space, locations of controls, etc, etc, etc...

    Also, get a list from each dealer of nearby companies that have the same model rigs that you are considering. Go look at their rigs and talk to the guys that operate them.

    You can't go wrong with doing the above.
    I can't believe they actually pay me to do this!!!

    One friend noted yesterday that a fire officer only carries a flashlight, sometimes prompting grumbling from firefighters who have to lug tools and hoses.
    "The old saying is you never know how heavy that flashlight can become," the friend said.
    -from a tragic story posted on firefighterclosecalls.com

  11. #31
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    Default Rigs Failing

    Beware of Multi-Plexing!!

  12. #32
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    As I've previously stated in other posts, our new tower is on the line at ALF. We decided to skip all the loyalty B.S. and take a trip to see trucks in person. We mostly limited our talks with actual firefighters assigned to the trucks. No Chiefs, because sometimes there is a little more than we know about with their choices (Boston, Waltham, our Dept.) In just about every case we found the majority of issues are with multiplexing and electronic sensors. You can get a truck without most of the junk, but most of the big manufacturers won't forgo anything thats in NFPA, or atleast unless you realyy push them, then check the price and warranty.

    As for KME they were pushing the new IQAN system, but we had decided that any major component had to be installed and working on 25 similar trucks. No sense being a test site for the price of these things. At least three companies tried to "sell" us onthe Phone a Friend Life line. This is where when the truck breaks down you plug a phone into it and the fix it by computer over the phone. If it didn't have a multiplexed problem it wouldn't need a computer-phone repair system.

  13. #33
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    Thumbs up

    Quote Originally Posted by DFDWaagner
    i am inquiring about KME Vs. pierce. company is looking at the pierce enforcer vs. the KME predator i need some input that would. i am personally for pierce but i am just looking for some insight
    We looked at the " Pierce Enforcer " and it is a great truck for the money with a 400 Cummins motor , 3000 EVS trans . Our board of fire commisoners went with a " KME Excel " Extreme pumper that only cost $ 275,000 without equipment , so far it has been very good with no major problems and the dealer " J.B. HUNT is very honest, and they are good people to work with !

  14. #34
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    Default hey njffII

    what company are u from in NJ

  15. #35
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    Originally Posted by DFDWaagner
    i am inquiring about KME Vs. pierce. company is looking at the pierce enforcer vs. the KME predator i need some input that would. i am personally for pierce but i am just looking for some insight
    DFD, we have 4 Pierces now.
    "It is not always greener on the other side of the fence"
    I don't think it matters what you get, you are gonna have some problems. Door latches and roof leaks seem to have been our problems on our Pierces. Paint is another issue we have had, but that may be due to our truck wash soap. The Pierces we have are easy to use.

    Here is our newest addition.
    Last edited by F52Westside; 01-11-2007 at 06:06 PM.
    Stay Safe & Bring 'em Home!
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    ** "The comments made here are this person's views and not that of the organizations to which I am affiliated" **

  16. #36
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    Thumbs up

    Woodbridge Twp District # 4 Keasbey , our new pumper is on the KME web site under " pumper gallery " No. 5906
    Last edited by NewJerseyFFII; 02-07-2006 at 02:43 PM.

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