Thread: Iaff Decals
12-01-2005, 08:43 PM #1
- Join Date
- Dec 2005
I'd like to bring up a question with the Local Union firefighters that may frequent this site....this is by no means offensive to the Volunteers or meant as a "bashing" thread......but myself being a paying Union member in good standings to a group that does a good job at representing me (at least at my Career) I find it rather BOLD and disrespectful to see IAFF Union stickers on the vehicles of Volunteers. It may not be a practice in the area for Volunteers to place Union stickers on their vehicle but......I was recently at the local Wal-Mart, I was getting out of my vehicle parked beside a gentleman that had a Union decal on his vehicle......I thought "Cool....." so I asked what Local, and he said "What"?? I said "Your Union sticker.....what Local".....he said, "I am not Paid, just got it from a friend". To me, this is very disrespectful and wrong that Volunteers are using these stickers on the their vehicles. I know by reading the bi-laws, it is against Union policy for ANYONE to display a Union sticker if they are outside, and NOT a represented member of the Union. What are your thoughts......this also goes along the lines of some Volunteers in my County that some how "acquire" our DFRS attire and wear it at their leisure while on duty. Volunteers should not be using IAFF decals OR Career issued clothing.......thats why WE have our stickers and clothing, and they have theirs.....so we can distinguish who is who!!
12-01-2005, 09:26 PM #2
I guess I would have thought that by the amount of venom thrown around this forum, with regard to the IAFF, that no volunteer would want to degrade themselves and display an IAFF emblem.
In reality though, I donít think it is that big of an issue. Itís an annoyance, in that many volunteers are quick to criticize the IAFF for some of our ďrulesĒ, but turn around and think itís ok, or have no problem using our label. My objection would be if they started to do something stupid where the logo is easily seen, and recognized. Union members we can potentially discipline, non-members we have no ability to control, period.
On the other side of the coin, itís more than likely IAFF members who are either giving them the logoís, clothing, or decals. If we should be upset at anyone, it should be those individualís.
I personally will not lose any sleep over the matter.
12-01-2005, 09:34 PM #3
- Join Date
- Nov 2005
The jerk that gave the vollie the union decal needs to be dealt with before the vollie
12-01-2005, 09:51 PM #4
I promise, I will never put an IAFF sticker on my vehicle.
That being said, I'd think you would be a lot more upset with the people giving out those stickers/clothing. I also agree that a non-IAFF member should not be displaying/wearing their items."This thread is being closed as it is off-topic and not related to the fire industry." - Isn't that what the Off Duty forum was for?
12-01-2005, 09:53 PM #5
While it doesn't make much sense to me, I don't see it as a huge matter. It's like a career FF with a NVFC decal. Makes you go ???, but to each their own.
12-01-2005, 10:08 PM #6
I've never understood that issue.
It's a sticker. It is not a legal piece of identification, nor does it identify the firefighter in any way other than perhaps a local union number (which most stickers do not have anyway). It gives the person displaying it NO special rights or priviledges, except maybe parking in the union parking lot.
Can a volly, or even a member of the general public not be a booster? What if the volley worked for a combo dept?
I can see if a person is trying to use it to get out of tickets or something else. But if they are just displaying the sticker, IT'S FREE PUBLICITY!
I display a generic Firefighter maltese cross in my window, with no IAFF affiliation. I also take dozens of career guys on tours through my resort fire dept every year. Some give me stickers, others patches, t-shirts, etc. I have yet hear one of those guys say they don't consider us a valid dept, or that we are not allowed to actually wear the shirt we have traded. Most often, I'm told to "wear it well".
Most of my guys have several t-shirts from various departments around the world. they wear them to drill night, or tastefully on time off, and I have never heard a peep from a career guy about it.
I just don't get what the big deal is.Never argue with an Idiot. They drag you down to their level, and then beat you with experience!
12-01-2005, 10:33 PM #7
I'm wearing my Clark County Local 1908 shirt right now. Guess I should take it off because I'm just a vollie, right?
I have a "Vollie Firefighter" sticker on my car. I also have an IAFF sticker from the department I used to belong to before I moved. I wasn't a member, but many of us displayed the stickers in support of the guys we worked with as volunteers. They thought it was great to see the volunteers of the department supporting them. None of us ever claimed to be IAFF, and none of us ever claimed to be career. We were proud of our guys, that's all.
Guess I don't see what the big deal is?Originally Posted by ThNozzleMan
I A C O J
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12-01-2005, 10:43 PM #8Originally Posted by mcaldwell
Here's a personal story:
I have a department sticker on my car. It is there not to show off but because I have earned it and I'm proud of my achievement. (It also works as a parking pass)
I was at a friendís house whose dad is a retired union FF. He was going to put one of his spare stickers on my car. I respectfully declined. Why? I feel it's an earned privilege. Now, if someday I become an IAFF member I will have no problem with displaying it.
I also feel the same way about shirts. I just don't feel right wearing someone else's shirt.
On another note, my grandparents bought a used van from an IAFF FF. He didn't take the sticker off before he sold it and my grandparents were afraid of taking it off and damaging the defroster. So they drove around for years with an IAFF sticker without having any affiliation.
Not that I donít support other FF, I just view decals and shirts as identifying someone as a member.
Last edited by ffexpCP; 12-01-2005 at 10:48 PM.
12-01-2005, 11:36 PM #9
- Join Date
- Jul 2002
why start the same argument?
12-02-2005, 12:37 AM #10
- Join Date
- Jan 2003
If you are not a union member why would you put the sticker on your car? I don't think anyone should have them except dues paying UNION members. Would it also be right for them to display a Local #2 sticker? By displaying the sticker of a members only group, you are implying that you are a member of that group - and that makes it wrong. T-shirts are a different matter because they are sold to the public - Union affiliation is not!
12-02-2005, 01:20 AM #11
who cares either way its just a lousy sticker******=================
------GOD BLESS AMERICA ! ------
12-02-2005, 02:23 AM #12
- Join Date
- Jan 2004
- New Mexico
If it is wrong to wear / posess union apparell, and for union members to give / sell, then I should be ****ed off, and the local should be hung, cause I bought a couple of shirts they were selling recently at a fund raiser. And I guess some more people are really gonna be in trouble cause my chief has some shirts from Chicago that were traded last summer. Go ahead and lock me up now, I am wearing a shirt from the New Orleans F.D. that I acquired in March ( before the hurricane).
I can understand if someone, volunteer or not, was wearing a shirt, or displaying a sticker, that said something like "I am a proud member of IAFF" or "I am a member or whatchacallit fire department", but just to be wearing or displaying something with the logo is a far cry from a disaster.
Maybe you should think about it in the morning when you get up and put on your Flyers jersey, are drinking coffee out of your Yankees mug, and are going to work wearing your Steelers beenie cap, driving in your car with the Bears license plate ring.
The businesses around here hand out caps to customers. It is done as a means of advertisement. Just because I wear a Caterpillar cap, does not make me an employee. If I went to a local dealer wearing my CAT cap, and tried to pass myself off as an equip. operator so I could take an unsupervised test drive, that would be another story. I have an AERO CARE cap. It does not make me a pilot, or a medic, nor do I have any desire to do so. A logo is a logo.
Until there is a threat made on my life, I am going to continue to wear my IAFF shirt that I purchased from the local.........In SUPPORT !
Not only did I support them with my 15 dollars, but I also support them physically, verbally, and spiritually. I am a volunteer, but these local paid firefighters are my friends, and we are brothers in service, we train together, ght together, and party together. Ultimately, we all answer to the same maker, and we all put our pants on one leg at a time.
You should feel proud to see your sticker, patch, cap, or shirt displayed by someone you don't know, because then you know that there is someone out there, who doesn't even know you, that is standing up for the same things that you believe in.
12-02-2005, 05:08 AM #13
- Join Date
- Dec 2000
I guess its okay to put a US Marines or Army sticker on my car then too? Better yet a Masons emblem on my car (maybe I like the symbol). I am not a member of any of these and therefore I believe it should only be used by those who serve or are members of that group.
A T-Shirt is one thing because in many cases you can buy mass produced FNDY or CFD shirts anywhere (just like wearing your favorite team jersey)but the iaff sticker is only to be displayed by those that pay the dues.
12-02-2005, 07:05 AM #14
I think this is a little over zealous. I am a proud IAFF L42 member. I also display the logo on my truck as well as my wife's car, my daughters car and my mothers. They are not dues paying members just as none of the family members of my local union brothers and sisters. I know that if something happens(flat tire etc.) one of my brothers or sisters will extend a helping hand to my family.
If I see a IAFF sticker on a vehicle that I pass in traffic or in a parking lot, I am proud to be a FF and am also proud that someone else desires to display the symbol. I don't card them or question their affiliation. I wave hello to a brother, sister and/or family member of a prideful tradition.
Get over it.
Thread Killer Extraordinaire!
12-02-2005, 09:25 AM #15
- Join Date
- Nov 2005
- Nevada, TX, U-S-A!!
If any of you have young kids you will get this...
When I read this post, all I could here in my head were the seagulls in Finding Nemo. They run around saying, "Mine. Mine. Mine."
It sounds like a bunch of school boys. "You aren't in my club so you can't play with us. You can't have that card in your spokes, only members of our club can do that." Infantile.
What I am hearing from some of you is that you don't want anyone to show support for your group. If you want to expand your organization, it has to be publicized. Who cares who shows it? It is being seen and that is a good thing. If that person is running around making statements and acting as a member of a group they don't belong to, then yes it is a problem. If it is simply displaying someone else's logo, be greatful they are trying to further your cause.
12-02-2005, 10:09 AM #16
- Join Date
- Sep 2001
- No. Providence R.I. : Land of the "How ya doins"
As both a career and a volunteer firefighter I will throw my 2 cents in. My volly house has a number of career FF's in it, and we are all proud members of the IAFF. A couple of vollys have inquired about getting stickers and we all refused. Not in a stuck up way, but here in RI it is a misdemeanor to display logos of a labor organization that you aren't a member of. This applies not only to IAFF, but FOP, Teamsters, IBPO, Steamfitters, Bricklayers etc. Here professional courtesy goes a long way and I have been pulled over and asked to see dept. ID or union card during a traffic stop. Family members are ok. Friends and friends of friends are not. Most people want them around here because they do help when the police see them. If you aren't a member or immediately related to a member then you have no business displaying them."I have no ambition in this world but one, and that is to be a fireman. The position may, in the eyes of some, appear to be a lowly one; but we know the work which a fireman has to do believe that his is a noble calling."
Edward F. Croker
Fire Dept. City of New York
HOOK N' CAN of the I.A.C.O.J.
12-02-2005, 10:23 AM #17Originally Posted by jerrygarciaA'int No Rocket Scientist's in The Firehall
12-02-2005, 10:39 AM #18Originally Posted by mcaldwell
Nor do we need free publicity
If you a volly in a combo dept you still are not a member of the IAFF.
The fact that we display a decal identifying fellow union members should have no bearing on the legitimacy of YOUR fire dept.
If you feel insecure somehow I'm sorry, but trust me displaying a union sticker for a union you do not belong to is not going to increase your feeling of self worthA'int No Rocket Scientist's in The Firehall
12-02-2005, 10:52 AM #19
I pay allot of money in Union Dues every year for that little sticker, and I waited a long time to get it, so I'm a little ****ed when someone dispalys it fraudulently.
12-02-2005, 11:03 AM #20
- Join Date
- May 2004
It took me 5 years, dozens of tests, unlimited traveling, education and training to have the right to display that sticker on my vehicle. To me, it is something that is earned. I can't stop others from displaying it, however, I would not feel right unless I earned it. Thousands of people take tests every year to become essentially part of that organization (a career firefighter). Some make it, some do not.
12-02-2005, 11:26 AM #21
I have to say it sees to amazing to me that grown adults, who are suppose to be brother firefighters can bring up issues like a sticker. It is a sticker PERIOD. It is not a uniform and most likely the everyday citizen could careless about stickers on car windows.
I guess that IAFF sticker means you can do a better job then the volunteer. Do you wash yourself better then he does too? Is your car better then his? Is your house better then his? I asked a co-worker if his house was on fire would he prefer a paid firefighter or a volunteer firefighter to rescue him. His response was intresting, he said "other then one getting a pay check and the other not, don't you both get tranied to do the same job?" He answered my question by saying he would want the fire department to put his house out and save him, it would not matter to him if the guys where paid or not. I guess the only people it matters too are the career and volunteer members of these forums. I sure hope that my FDNY sweater I have doesnt offened anyone, cause I wear it often and I am not a member of FDNY, furthermore the FDNY decal I have on my car window hopefully doesnt offened anyone. I consider myself a firefighter. Yes I volunteer, but I support anyone with guts to do this job, volunteer or paid.
And to sum something up, read this poem posted by Lammrover. I read it, didnt say anything about career or volunteer. just talked about the job we do as a brotherhood.
Poem link: http://forums.firehouse.com/showthread.php?t=76269
Last edited by nozzelvfd; 12-02-2005 at 11:32 AM.You need only two tools: WD-40 and duct tape. If it doesn't move and it should, use WD-40. If it moves and shouldn't, use the duct tape.
12-02-2005, 11:41 AM #22
- Join Date
- Nov 2005
My dad just retired 2 years ago after 30 years in the fire service. While in high school he stuck an IAFF sticker on my truck, and I proudly displayed it because my father was a proud member. I am now a career FF with a combo department. I would love to join the union and even looked into starting a local, but due to the fact that we are not a municipality we can't have a local. After 9-11 my father gave me a local sticker that is colored like an American flag and stay "Never Forget". Well I put that on my new truck full well knowing that I am not in the union. I put it on there for 2 reasons, first to support the union that my dad is still a member of and secondly to honor the fallen FF's. So does that make me a whacker? If so screw it.
12-02-2005, 12:30 PM #23Maybe you should think about it in the morning when you get up and put on your Flyers jersey
I would normally say who cares, but last week I took some drunk military guy to the ER after he totaled 3 cars on the freeway at 6AM after a long night of drinking. I saw the IAFF sticker in his rear window and asked him which dept. he worked at and he said he wasn't a FF. No big deal, I only think several hundred thousand people saw the sticker from the news helicopter hovering above. I thought it was a little......improper I guess.
12-02-2005, 12:30 PM #24
- Join Date
- Oct 2005
If your a Volly driving around witha IAFF sticker you need to re-think your thinking you need that space on your glass for your fire service decals and own dept logo's.
FTM PTB RFB
12-02-2005, 12:51 PM #25
- Join Date
- Apr 2003
If you are your family is not apart of the IAFF the sticker should not be on your car. Why in the hell would you put one on there if you weren't apart of the union? It has nothing to do with being anti-volunteer. It's about representing the IAFF and your affiliation, and it doesn't make any sense to me why one would do that if they are not a member, besides a poser.
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