1. #1
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    Default Aid and Comfort to the Enemy

    Let's see....

    1. John Kerry accuses US troops of "terrorizing" innocent women and children in midnight raids on their homes.

    2. Howard Dean states "The idea that the United States is going to win the war in Iraq is just plain wrong,".

    Sounds like aid and comfort to the enemy to me. Both of them are disgraces to this country.

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    Man this ones going to get ugly LOL


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    Default Sssh!

    George, please keep your voice down. Howard Dean is the best thing that's happened to the Republican party since Ronald Reagan and I don't want the Dems to figure it out before the '08 elections!

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    Default Jesus H. Christ..

    Give it up..

    I doubt that your average insurgent gives a rats *** about what Kerry, Dean, You or I have to say.. they are way too busy trying to find ways to kill the American Infidels / Invaders that are soiling what they consider to be their land. Thats not a comment on our troops, it's just looking at it from an insurgents point of view. Trust me, sitting in their hidey holes, I doubt many of them have even heard of Kerry.

    However, I bet that statements like those made by Kerry & Dean are actually profoundly offending you, because A) it's true, comfort to the enemy or not B) It's actually comforting and aiding the political opponents of Dick & Bush.. you know, Democrats. Bush & Dick's sagging political polls at last show that the media (just the media, not the left wing / right wing or otherwise) have woken up and starting actually questioning the WTF factor of the Republican policies and that people have gotten over their head stuck in the sand approach to this invasion.

    Saying that, I do unfortunately believe we should not leave prematurely.. we have screwed that country up (yeah, worse than it was) and we need to stay until they have adequate means to prevent civil war and perhaps ethnic cleansing.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fawlty
    Give it up..

    I doubt that your average insurgent gives a rats *** about what Kerry, Dean, You or I have to say.. they are way too busy trying to find ways to kill the American Infidels / Invaders that are soiling what they consider to be their land. Thats not a comment on our troops, it's just looking at it from an insurgents point of view. Trust me, sitting in their hidey holes, I doubt many of them have even heard of Kerry.

    However, I bet that statements like those made by Kerry & Dean are actually profoundly offending you, because A) it's true, comfort to the enemy or not B) It's actually comforting and aiding the political opponents of Dick & Bush.. you know, Democrats. Bush & Dick's sagging political polls at last show that the media (just the media, not the left wing / right wing or otherwise) have woken up and starting actually questioning the WTF factor of the Republican policies and that people have gotten over their head stuck in the sand approach to this invasion.

    Saying that, I do unfortunately believe we should not leave prematurely.. we have screwed that country up (yeah, worse than it was) and we need to stay until they have adequate means to prevent civil war and perhaps ethnic cleansing.
    So....

    You would agree that our troops are acting like terrorists and we CAN't win this war?

    We (along with our allies) have restored the basic infrastructure of most of the country, opening hospitals, schools and governement agencies. We have returned the governing of the country to the citizens and we are in the process of helping them form a competent, cohesive defense force to allow them to defend their own country, and yet you consider that "screwing up" Iraq "worse than it was"?

    Can you possibly intelligently defend those positions?

    Also, I would respectfully disagree with your assessment of the impact of the words of our "leaders". They have tremendous psychological impact on our troops and are, at this time, benig blasted all over Al Jezeera. I thnk one could argue that this is a very significant impact.

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    Quote Originally Posted by EFD840
    George, please keep your voice down. Howard Dean is the best thing that's happened to the Republican party since Ronald Reagan and I don't want the Dems to figure it out before the '08 elections!
    '

    Don't worry. They won't figure it out. They actually think they are winning this. They have no clue that they have left the majority of real Democrats behind and are pandering to the move on people. After all, they have all the money. The poor worlking man (read: Traditional Democrat) doesn't have the gobs of money to support these whacks.

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    Goes both ways George, many of us were wrong to accuse Clinton of waging the dog when he finally did hit some of the alQuida Camps with Tomahawks in 1998. If we had shown more support for those actions, maybe Osama would have thought differently before sending planes into American buildings. I disagree strongly with Kerry and Dean on this matter, but we slide down a slippery slope away from the 1st Asmendment when we start throwing around phrases like "aid and comfort to the Enemy" and "disgrace to this Country". The whole spirit of this country is tied to the fct that they can say those things and that we can debate the issue while our troops continue to get the job done.
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    Quote Originally Posted by nyckftbl View Post
    LOL....dont you people have anything else to do besides b*tch about our b*tching?

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    Quote Originally Posted by DennisTheMenace
    Goes both ways George, many of us were wrong to accuse Clinton of waging the dog when he finally did hit some of the alQuida Camps with Tomahawks in 1998. If we had shown more support for those actions, maybe Osama would have thought differently before sending planes into American buildings. I disagree strongly with Kerry and Dean on this matter, but we slide down a slippery slope away from the 1st Asmendment when we start throwing around phrases like "aid and comfort to the Enemy" and "disgrace to this Country". The whole spirit of this country is tied to the fct that they can say those things and that we can debate the issue while our troops continue to get the job done.
    There is no "slippery slope" involved when our troops aer accused by one of our national leaders of being terrorists. There is no "slippery slope" when a national leader tacitly suggests that our forces surrender because we can't win a war.

    If Clinton had actually fired missiles at an al-Queda camp, I would have supported it. However, there is enough evidence that he basically fired some missiles into vacant land that his claims of an aggressive strike against terrorists is laghable. Osama was probably peeing his pants laughing when this happened.

    Is it a First Amendment issue when we have a poor excuse for an American citizen in Iraq (where he is not supposed to be) actually defending the dictator that our troops died defeating and throwing from power? He should be refused re-entry into this country.

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    Quote Originally Posted by GeorgeWendtCFI
    Let's see....

    1. John Kerry accuses US troops of "terrorizing" innocent women and children in midnight raids on their homes.

    2. Howard Dean states "The idea that the United States is going to win the war in Iraq is just plain wrong,".

    Sounds like aid and comfort to the enemy to me. Both of them are disgraces to this country.
    There was an era where statements like that would have been considered TREASON. After all we are at WAR.

    Now days everyone is afraid of offending everyone and being PC.
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    Quote Originally Posted by SSTONER
    There was an era where statements like that would have been considered TREASON. After all we are at WAR.

    Now days everyone is afraid of offending everyone and being PC.
    As far as the law has been concerned there has NEVER been such an era in this nation since 1776. Joe McCarthy tried to make it so, but that was just politics. If a majority of the Nation agrees with these fools, then their thoughts will prevail, if a majority disagree they will fail, it is the beauty of our system AND the Constitution. I fought for people I disagree with to say their stupid crap, if our mission is noble and our actions correct the fools lose.
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    Quote Originally Posted by nyckftbl View Post
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    Default How about a link?

    I would like to see a full account of Kerry and Deans comments. Dennis is exactly on the mark. How can we expect Iraqis to form a democracy when we want to charge people who make unpopular statements with treason?
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    Quote Originally Posted by MIKEYLIKESIT
    I would like to see a full account of Kerry and Deans comments. Dennis is exactly on the mark. How can we expect Iraqis to form a democracy when we want to charge people who make unpopular statements with treason?
    Unpopular? They are far more than just unpopular - they undermind the entire operation over there! They lead the american people(unfairly) to belive the WAR is not going to be won. It also works to undermind the troops who are over there also.

    This tactic was used in Vietnam. Kerry of all people should be aware of that.

    If you said " MJ is great with kids!" - now thats unpopular.
    Last edited by SSTONER; 12-06-2005 at 11:22 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by SSTONER
    Unpopular? They are far more than just unpopular - they undermind the entire operation over there! They lead the american people(unfairly) to belive the WAR is not going to be won. It also works to undermind the troops who are over there also.

    This tactic was used in Vietnam. Kerry of all people should be aware of that.
    They have not undermined anything yet, they are just telling their opinion in the public debate.

    Since my side has done a CRAPPY job of explaining how the war is going to /can be won, they have taken the initiative to say their side. This can't be done in a shouting match of loud thunderous nothingness vs. loud pessemistic sort of-substance.

    The administration has to get their head out of the sand and talk to the American people in a manner other then "trust us, we're the government and we are in charge" we did not buy that from Democrat Administrations, we should not swallow it whole from this one either. I say this and I am a HUGE Bush supporter.
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    Quote Originally Posted by nyckftbl View Post
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fawlty
    Give it up..

    I doubt that your average insurgent gives a rats *** about what Kerry, Dean, You or I have to say.. they are way too busy trying to find ways to kill the American Infidels / Invaders that are soiling what they consider to be their land. Thats not a comment on our troops, it's just looking at it from an insurgents point of view. Trust me, sitting in their hidey holes, I doubt many of them have even heard of Kerry.
    Actually, they do know....b/c the enemy is very effective with propoganda. Don't pass these insurgents off as dumb or as "hole" people....With in themselves, thier leaders know how to motivate thier people. And yes EVERY bit of negitive media that is said or printed gets back to them and they use it.

    ....or were you just being sarcastic.....???

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    Quote Originally Posted by VinnieB
    Actually, they do know....b/c the enemy is very effective with propoganda. Don't pass these insurgents off as dumb or as "hole" people....With in themselves, thier leaders know how to motivate thier people. And yes EVERY bit of negitive media that is said or printed gets back to them and they use it.

    ....or were you just being sarcastic.....???
    True, but the dem's are only able to get away with it because the WH is failing miserably with PR. You can't win hearts and minds with sticks and stones.
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    Quote Originally Posted by nyckftbl View Post
    LOL....dont you people have anything else to do besides b*tch about our b*tching?

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    Quote Originally Posted by DennisTheMenace
    True, but the dem's are only able to get away with it because the WH is failing miserably with PR. You can't win hearts and minds with sticks and stones.
    Up until about two weeks ago, I would agree with you. For the past two weeks, they have been clear and on point. And the poll numbers reflect a slight upturn.

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    Quote Originally Posted by GeorgeWendtCFI
    Up until about two weeks ago, I would agree with you. For the past two weeks, they have been clear and on point. And the poll numbers reflect a slight upturn.
    I would say they are loud, I would not say that they are on point or clear. When they get clear on the message we should see something more then a "slight upturn", that upturn could be accredited to the Redskins winning and the Cowboys losing this week.
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    It is difficult to have more than a slight upturn when the media still reports this story with bias.

    I know that many of you hate Ruck Limbaugh with an overwhelming passion. But he said this yesterday and truer words have never been spoken:

    Courage is speaking for freedom while faced with tyranny, not speaking for tyranny while living in freedom

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    If you disagree with the way this country has been ran, you can feel free to leave at anytime. Don't support our troops? Get out. Kerry's comments do undermine them. It drops morale and with low morale, what do you expect them to accomplish? Don't you have days where you don't want to go to work because you just dont feel like it? With idiots like Kerry talking negatively, the troops go through that everyday. They hear CRAP like that and wonder why they are there. Most of them understand that we appreciate them and know that they are doing what they can to prevent or reduce threats against this great nation.

    If anyone is to share the blame it is Bush Sr. He should have finished the job years ago. I, too, am a huge Bush supporter, but I will be the first to say Sr. messed up when he didn't finish the job. GW now HAS to clean up the mess if we ever want to live life like we did before all the terrorism crap started. We need to set an example that we will not tolerate terroristic actions here, and Bush has started that effort. Forget politics and start worrying about protecting this country.

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    I think George just misses Nozz and is hoping to draw him out of his silence
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    Quote Originally Posted by RspctFrmCalgary
    I think George just misses Nozz and is hoping to draw him out of his silence
    Damn, you caught me.

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    Quote Originally Posted by RadRob
    If you disagree with the way this country has been ran, you can feel free to leave at anytime. Don't support our troops? Get out. Kerry's comments do undermine them. It drops morale and with low morale, what do you expect them to accomplish? Don't you have days where you don't want to go to work because you just dont feel like it? With idiots like Kerry talking negatively, the troops go through that everyday. They hear CRAP like that and wonder why they are there. Most of them understand that we appreciate them and know that they are doing what they can to prevent or reduce threats against this great nation.
    SO you left the country from January 1993-January 1995 when Clinton was in the White House and Congress was ruled by the Dems? I am sure that you did not like the way the country was run during those two years. The love it or leave it talk is tired, old and just plain wrong-headed and un-American even.


    Quote Originally Posted by RadRob
    If anyone is to share the blame it is Bush Sr. He should have finished the job years ago. I, too, am a huge Bush supporter, but I will be the first to say Sr. messed up when he didn't finish the job. GW now HAS to clean up the mess if we ever want to live life like we did before all the terrorism crap started. We need to set an example that we will not tolerate terroristic actions here, and Bush has started that effort. Forget politics and start worrying about protecting this country.
    TO begin with, 41 is not a Sr. his son does not share the middle name of Herbert with him. And having been there, I will tell you that while we could have gone all the way to Baghdad with no problem militarily, the political climate at the time and the amazing coalition that 41 put together would not allow it to happen, he did the right thing. There would have been no one to take over Iraq at that time and we would likely be in the same situation we are in right now. The only failure was for the UN to not demand that Saddam pay for his crime of invading Kuwait at that time. You can't just "forget politics" for more then a week at a time, because we live in a global community and we need to have friends to continue to grow as a nation.
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    Quote Originally Posted by nyckftbl View Post
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    Quote Originally Posted by DennisTheMenace
    SO you left the country from January 1993-January 1995 when Clinton was in the White House and Congress was ruled by the Dems? I am sure that you did not like the way the country was run during those two years. The love it or leave it talk is tired, old and just plain wrong-headed and un-American even.
    Did I like the fact that Clinton was elected? No. Did I support him? You bet. I never said love it or leave it. I said you can leave anytime you want to. THEN I said if you don't support our troops, LEAVE. That is far from un-American and wrong-headed. Being in the military as you were, I can hardly believe you said that. But I guess anything is possible in these forums.

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    Quote Originally Posted by RadRob
    Did I like the fact that Clinton was elected? No. Did I support him? You bet. I never said love it or leave it. I said you can leave anytime you want to. THEN I said if you don't support our troops, LEAVE. That is far from un-American and wrong-headed. Being in the military as you were, I can hardly believe you said that. But I guess anything is possible in these forums.
    I fought for the right for folks to be what they want, helpful, religious, athiest, saint, jerk, whatever; America if a big open place, we can all fit in. If you want to be a jerk or negative influance on others; fate, God, Karma, or whatever you believe in will eventually catch up and dole out an appropriate judgement. I fought so that everyone could decide what side of all of that they want to be on, everyone should have that freedom, we are just lucky enough to have been born into it here in America. Very lucky in fact.
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    Quote Originally Posted by nyckftbl View Post
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    Because their comments might and can serve to raise the morale of enemy forces and lower the morale of United States forces.That comes under the "aid and comfort to the enemy"part.
    John Kerry of all people being discussed should know that you don't badtalk the troops while they are in the field serving to secure YOUR Rights.

    Quote Originally Posted by MIKEYLIKESIT
    I would like to see a full account of Kerry and Deans comments. Dennis is exactly on the mark. How can we expect Iraqis to form a democracy when we want to charge people who make unpopular statements with treason?

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