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  1. #1
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    Angry Cleveland Rocks!

    Nasty Altercation Between Cleveland Firefighters And Man

    A 29-year-old Strongsville man says an out-of-control Cleveland firefighter punched out four of his front teeth last week at the scene of a car wreck.

    Marc Huff rushed to Dead Man's Curve Thursday where his girlfriend's car was crunched and spun around. His girlfriend was not seriously hurt.

    But Huff left the scene in a police car, under arrest for misconduct in an emergency. He pleaded not guilty to the misde meanor charge Tuesday.

    And he filed complaints with the Fire Department and the city against firefighters.

    A fire investigator's complaint, filed in Cleveland Municipal Court, states that Huff's car nearly clipped one of the firefighters as he raced to the scene. It also states that Huff initially refused to leave the scene and then nearly drove over firefighters again.

    Then the 5-foot-9, 130-pound IRS tax collector started a physical altercation with several firefighters, according to fire Detective Joseph Stevens' report.

    Cleveland police, who took Huff to jail, don't mention that altercation in their report. The police report says Huff was "grabbed and subdued" by firemen because he was disorderly.

    Neither report makes mention of Huff's teeth being knocked from his mouth.

    A Fire Department spokesman and a spokesperson for the public safety department said they were not sure the arresting fire detectives had made a report, and if so, whether they could release it.

    "Like all complaints, we are taking this very seriously," Fire Department spokesman Larry Gray said.

    Huff said when he tried to leave the scene, one of the firefighters slammed his helmet on the hood of Huff's car and reached through the window to punch him in the mouth. When Huff exited the car, one firefighter shoved him, another put him in a chokehold, a third forced his hands behind his back, and they slammed him against his car, he said.

    "I was spitting out blood and saying, ?Please get off my neck. You?re going to break my neck," Huff says.

    Huff said one firefighter replied, "I hope I break your (expletive) neck."

    Shante Jones, the daughter of Huff's girlfriend, also raced to the accident scene. Jones, her mother and a friend had been at The Q watching a tennis match between Venus and Serena Williams and were headed home in separate cars, Jones said.

    Firefighters cursed at Huff and told him to get away from the scene, she said. She saw seven or eight men surround Huff, who was bleeding from the mouth. An arson detective took pictures of Huff's mouth and tried to help him locate his teeth, Jones said.

    "I think the whole thing was blown out of proportion," she said. "Everyone was panicking. He wasn't trying to hurt anyone, and there?s no reason they had to hurt him."

    The police report does not name the firefighters involved in the altercation. Police Lt. Thomas Stacho said police don't have additional information on the arrest because the Fire Department arrested Huff. At the Justice Center, Huff was inexplicably booked as a felony offender, even though he was charged with a misdemeanor.

    After Huff made bond and was released from jail - almost 15 hours later - he went to a hospital in Willoughby, where he was treated for tooth extraction, neck pain and physical assault, according to discharge papers from the emergency room.

    Huff also visited a dentist for some temporary partial dentures that have left him with a lisp, he said.

    "I thought public officials should be held to a higher standard," Huff said. "It's sad that they acted that way. The whole situation sucks."

    To reach this Plain Dealer reporter: rdissell@plaind.com, 216-999-4121

    If you cant run with the big dogs ,don't get off the porch.

    Their is a good chance too lose your teeth in Kentucky anytime you almost run down one of our own!Sorry about this guys luck ,but a poor attitude after a event like this will almost always produce a A** WHIPPING.
    Always a day late and a dollar short!

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    Quote Originally Posted by coldfront
    Their is a good chance too lose your teeth in Kentucky anytime you almost run down one of our own!Sorry about this guys luck ,but a poor attitude after a event like this will almost always produce a A** WHIPPING.
    Are you kidding me? We are expected to act responsibly. In uniform, I don't agree with that attitude at all. In a bar, out of uniform... That's a different story. I have been known to throw down a few times, but would never dod it in uniform. Ridiculous.

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    Quote Originally Posted by coldfront
    If you cant run with the big dogs ,don't get off the porch.

    Their is a good chance too lose your teeth in Kentucky anytime you almost run down one of our own!Sorry about this guys luck ,but a poor attitude after a event like this will almost always produce a A** WHIPPING.
    Yeah. Nice attitude. Just the kind of guy I want to work with. Good luck with this one pal.

  4. #4
    Let's talk fire trucks! BoxAlarm187's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by coldfront
    If you cant run with the big dogs ,don't get off the porch.

    Their is a good chance too lose your teeth in Kentucky anytime you almost run down one of our own!Sorry about this guys luck ,but a poor attitude after a event like this will almost always produce a A** WHIPPING.
    Surely one of the most well-thought-out responses to a news event that I have ever seen.

  5. #5
    Forum Member RspctFrmCalgary's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BoxAlarm187
    Surely one of the most well-thought-out responses to a news event that I have ever seen.
    The title of the thread was my first clue Not only condoning such "alleged" behaviour by the firefighters, but embracing it whole-heartedly!
    September 11th - Never Forget

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    I think it all sounds fishy.

    The truth is likely somewhere in the middle. The guy was being a dink, the FFs probly over steped a bit.

    Never know unless you were there when it happened.
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    -Despair: Its always darkest before it goes Pitch Black.

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    Angry Run Rabbit Run!

    1.Yes ,I might be a Redneck!

    2. I have scrapped a fellow responder from the Highway after a ill temper motorize ran him down.To make a mistake is human.To make a mistake then run your trap about usually leads to bad things.I wish we all could turn the other cheek!

    3.A car is deadly weapon.If you want to use that vehicle to run me down then expect a forceful response.
    Last edited by coldfront; 12-08-2005 at 11:18 PM.
    Always a day late and a dollar short!

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    Are you kidding me? We are expected to act responsibly. In uniform, I don't agree with that attitude at all. In a bar, out of uniform... That's a different story. I have been known to throw down a few times, but would never dod it in uniform. Ridiculous.
    If someone almost runs one of us (FD, PD or EMS) over (or twice in this situation) acts disorderly and is combative, he needs to be restrained before he hurts anyone else. I know I haven't been trained in the proper police techniques but I can make a good faith effort to prevent anyone from getting hurt. I can assure you if that happened here two teeth would be the least of his worries after the PD gets ahold of him.

    I say we wait to hear the full story before all the saints on this job claim they wouldn't do such a thing.

    FTM-PTB

  9. #9
    Disillusioned Subscriber Steamer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FFFRED
    If someone almost runs one of us (FD, PD or EMS) over (or twice in this situation) acts disorderly and is combative, he needs to be restrained before he hurts anyone else. I know I haven't been trained in the proper police techniques but I can make a good faith effort to prevent anyone from getting hurt. I can assure you if that happened here two teeth would be the least of his worries after the PD gets ahold of him.

    I say we wait to hear the full story before all the saints on this job claim they wouldn't do such a thing.

    FTM-PTB
    I'm with Fred on this one. My guess is that the truth lies somewhere in between.
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    It says the FD arrested him...so I'm assuming that the FD has police powers or gives those powers to their FF's. If that's the case, then I would expect them to restrain the offender like a regular cop would. If the FF's faught with the offender, then it would be easy to have it happen in the struggle. I see it plenty.
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  11. #11
    55 Years & Still Rolling hwoods's Avatar
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    Talking Yeah.........

    I Know, this is a scary thought, but I agree with FFFred. We have some difficult times here when dealing with people, such as an accident screwing up traffic. In a neighboring jurisdiction, 2 medics were inside a wrecked car, packaging a patient for removal, when another car struck the one they were working in. You can only take so much stuff from those that we are sworn to protect, so sometimes we take action a bit forcefully. On one occasion, a man stepped out in front of our Ambulance as it was approaching an accident. They stopped to avoid hitting him, and yelled at him to get out of the road, he replied that they should go home, that there were enough Ambulances already there. I was behind the ambulance and ran up to see what the problem was. Turns out to be a drunk who we had to physically remove from the road. Stupid stuff happens and you have to deal with it. My wife, nice lady, sometimes has to help with traffic control. And she doesn't put up with nothing either, she has extingushed a lit flare on a car's hood.
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    Forum Member FHandz15's Avatar
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    Anyone notice that since everyone has a cell phone, every emotionally distraught boyfriend/girlfriend/mother/father/friend/dog...etc now shows up on EVERY MVA no matter what time of day, and usually they are there before you or right after to help "mix" things up and help get the pt. you just spent 5 minutes calming down all upset again.......

    Also, anyone ever have someone in an accident have to call their lawyer AND their insurance agent prior to deciding if they want to go to the ER? I have.....


    I'd do the same thing Cleveland did, I'd just pull his shirt over his head first to tie up his arms like they do in the NHL.

  13. #13
    Forum Member backsteprescue123's Avatar
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    Just about and hour and a half ago I was driving on I-75 near my house where there was a semi vs. car. It is snowing like crazy and we have approx. 3-4" snow on the ground and alot of ice. As we were passing the accident at a greatly reduced speed 2 semi's and a couple of cars fly by at about 55-65 MPH with no concern for the responders. What is going through the head's of these people?

    A couple of years ago our dept. along with another dept. responded to an MVA at roughly 0500(est.) while extricating the victims, a van slid into the wreck and injured numerous responders. Thank God that no one died or was too seriously hurt.

    http://www.rossfordfire.com/033103mva.html
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  14. #14
    55 Years & Still Rolling hwoods's Avatar
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    Thumbs down We Fix That..............

    Quote Originally Posted by FHandz15
    Anyone notice that since everyone has a cell phone, every emotionally distraught boyfriend/girlfriend/mother/father/friend/dog...etc now shows up on EVERY MVA no matter what time of day, and usually they are there before you or right after to help "mix" things up and help get the pt. you just spent 5 minutes calming down all upset again.......

    Also, anyone ever have someone in an accident have to call their lawyer AND their insurance agent prior to deciding if they want to go to the ER? I have.....


    I'd do the same thing Cleveland did, I'd just pull his shirt over his head first to tie up his arms like they do in the NHL.
    I absolutely do not have a cell phone problem on jobs that I am in charge of. I order people to turn off the phone. Period. If they don't move fast enough, I turn the phone off for them. End of story.
    Never use Force! Get a Bigger Hammer.
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    Asst. Chief John R. Woods Sr. 1937 - 2006

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    I Refuse to be a Spectator. If I come to the Game, I'm Playing.

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  15. #15
    Forum Member backsteprescue123's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hwoods
    I absolutely do not have a cell phone problem on jobs that I am in charge of. I order people to turn off the phone. Period. If they don't move fast enough, I turn the phone off for them. End of story.

    Too Funny. That would be interesting to see, the IC taking the phone from a person on the scene.
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  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by FFFRED
    If someone almost runs one of us (FD, PD or EMS) over (or twice in this situation) acts disorderly and is combative, he needs to be restrained before he hurts anyone else. I know I haven't been trained in the proper police techniques but I can make a good faith effort to prevent anyone from getting hurt. I can assure you if that happened here two teeth would be the least of his worries after the PD gets ahold of him.

    I say we wait to hear the full story before all the saints on this job claim they wouldn't do such a thing.

    FTM-PTB
    Well, I guess I am a saint(actually, far from it) because I have been hit, kicked, spit on, bumped with a car, etc... and no one ever lost their teeth (from me anyway, the cops may have a different story). A** whippings have no place here in our service. We are here to help people, even when we think they least deserve it or when they are being total idiots. I would love to knock the hell out of a guy that drives drunk with his kids in the car, but that would hurt us and the case against him. It is ALWAYS better not to take offensive actions in this situation. So whatever the "full story" is, it does not warrant such behavior.

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    Unhappy Cleveland Rockthssss...

    Huff also visited a dentist for some temporary partial dentures that have left him with a lisp, he said.

    "I thought public officials should be held to a higher standard," Huff said. "It's sad that they acted that way. The whole situation sucks."


    Actually, I believe based on the above information, his last statement should have read "The whole thituation thucks!!"

    I feel for the FF's involved in this, after a near miss you know the andreladin starts running really high.. and with this mouthy mutt giving the whole I gotta be with my g/f thing.. I know where they came from. Wouldn't go so far as to condone it, but I understand.

    Sad thing is, you know this guy will be filing suit, and you know that with the right attorney, he'll win massive damages.

    Out of interest, I wonder if he identified himself as an IRS agent before they decided to forever make it difficult for him to eat corn on the cob??

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    The way I learned about citizen's arrest is that if you physically prevent someone from leaving when he/she wants to,then legally you have arrested them.
    Because we "mere" citizens are not police academy trained in the Miranda Act warning,we don't have to give them and really shouldn't due to the risk of opening ourselves up to giving the wrong information and making more trouble for the real cops.
    If you have to make a citizen's arrest,just make sure that they don't leave,you don't have to search them but keep an eye on them in case they want to divest themselves(that's West Kentucky for"get rid of")anything that will incriminate them or could be used to hurt you and/or other firefighters.As one big guy said to a possible DUI suspect,"Sit there like a good boy or ELSE."while he held a halligan bar.
    Like with someone you think deliberately started a fire,don't lead them in a conversation about what happened but try to remember what they say before the police arrive.If you have a chief's buggy with a dash camera,even better.That is just as admissible in court as is all those dashcam cop show entries are.

    Quote Originally Posted by pfd4life
    It says the FD arrested him...so I'm assuming that the FD has police powers or gives those powers to their FF's. If that's the case, then I would expect them to restrain the offender like a regular cop would. If the FF's faught with the offender, then it would be easy to have it happen in the struggle. I see it plenty.
    Last edited by doughesson; 12-09-2005 at 05:50 PM.

  19. #19
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    Pretty much anything BUT the most important job they had at handperating a 3,000lb motor vehicle.
    I ride a bike everywhere I go and used to drive a wheelchair bus for a taxi company.I am still amazed at people that think they can multitask while driving and end up weaving all over the place unaware of how close they came to hitting a bike rider,other vehicle or lamppost.

    Quote Originally Posted by RFRDxplorer
    As we were passing the accident at a greatly reduced speed 2 semi's and a couple of cars fly by at about 55-65 MPH with no concern for the responders. What is going through the head's of these people?
    http://www.rossfordfire.com/033103mva.html

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    I'm with FFFred and hwoods on tis one (I can see them both cringing from here). There is only so much stupidity you should put up with before "restraining" the ignorant SOB.

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