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  1. #1
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    Exclamation WTC1,2&7 collapse questions.

    I've noticed that many sites all around cyberspace claim that WTC1,2,7 were brought down by bombs/demolition charges. Does anyone here agree ?

    Is there any validity to claims that many NYFD firemen making claims they heard bombs exploding before the collapses ?

    I have no intention of flaming the forum or such, but many others claim that many NYFD firemen have been gagged about talking anything WTC related so I thought I'd directly come to this forum and ask... Is this true.

    Any other opinions are also welcome from a professional perspective.

    Sincerely,

    John


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    Forum Member DeputyChiefGonzo's Avatar
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    Let me spell out for you....

    It's all nothing but conspiracy theory

    Bulls***!
    ‎"The education of a firefighter and the continued education of a firefighter is what makes "real" firefighters. Continuous skill development is the core of progressive firefighting. We learn by doing and doing it again and again, both on the training ground and the fireground."
    Lt. Ray McCormack, FDNY

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    You need to arm yourself with facts instead of conspiracy theories. Go to www.nist.gov and read the official investigation report on the collapse.

    7 collapsed hours after 1 & 2. I was there when 7 collapsed. No explosions. No bombs.

    Let it be clear: I am not a FDNY MOS.

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    The conspiracy websites are pretty amusing to read. The combination of selective use of facts, invented facts, and pre-determined conclusions is apparent regardless of which "theory" you read. I look at it this way-A former U.S. president could not keep a sexual liason with an intern a secret. Do you really think anyone could keep fake moon landings, UFO's, aliens on ice, bombs in WTC and any other outlandish claim a secret if they were true?

    Of course, I could be a government operative with an assignment to derail discussion to keep the true story from getting out...
    Last edited by KenNFD1219; 12-21-2005 at 05:32 PM.
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    I have this theory about how they faked the Red Sox winning the World Series....

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    I also believe in Santa-Tooth Fairy-Wicked Witch of the West-if you pull a Funny Face in the Wind it will stay like it-forever. OJ is innocent-Michael Jackson is not weird-just normal like me and you. Errol Flynn saved Burma on his own. Clinton did not have a sexual relationship with Monica--just parked a certain piece of his anatomy in a dental zone. Watergate did not happen

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    Default Here is one that did happen pretty interesting

    Never mind. It's not related to the discussion. Sorry.
    Last edited by savoy6; 12-27-2005 at 05:09 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by KenNFD1219
    The conspiracy websites are pretty amusing to read. The combination of selective use of facts, invented facts, and pre-determined conclusions is apparent regardless of which "theory" you read. I look at it this way-A former U.S. president could not keep a sexual liason with an intern a secret. Do you really think anyone could keep fake moon landings, UFO's, aliens on ice, bombs in WTC and any other outlandish claim a secret if they were true?
    AMEN brother !!!

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    Those conspiracy theories led me to this site; I was doing research about the WTC fires for a paper and all I could find elsewhere on the internet was this conspiracy stuff. All you need to remember is this: fire brought them down, there was no need for explosives. Fire weakens steel, if it didn't they would not put fireproofing on steel. The people making these theories are not building engineers, all engineers agree fire/impact made the towers fall. And for reports of explosions, I am sure in a situation like that there are going to be loud sounds that may sound like explosions. Large pieces of falling debris for example.

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    The only issue I see with the collapse by fire official story is the time of collapse of all 3 buildings. They ALL fell at near free fall speed ... whereas the laws of physics regarding momentum and structural mass resistance would show the collapse should have been slower and/or even partial.

    Also Silverstein(owner of WTC's) stated in a documentary in 2002 that they 'pulled it' and watched WTC7 fall in the same context as demolition. And again WTC collapsed at free fall speed which could only happen if ALL support superstructures failed at the exact same time.

    Why all the secrecy behind releasing all the confiscated Pentagon videos of the 'crash' ?

    The secrecy only breeds further conspiracy theories.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zamboni
    The only issue I see with the collapse by fire official story is the time of collapse of all 3 buildings. They ALL fell at near free fall speed ... whereas the laws of physics regarding momentum and structural mass resistance would show the collapse should have been slower and/or even partial.

    Also Silverstein(owner of WTC's) stated in a documentary in 2002 that they 'pulled it' and watched WTC7 fall in the same context as demolition. And again WTC collapsed at free fall speed which could only happen if ALL support superstructures failed at the exact same time.

    Why all the secrecy behind releasing all the confiscated Pentagon videos of the 'crash' ?

    The secrecy only breeds further conspiracy theories.
    High heat from burning Jet A fuel and combustible furnishings weakened the structural steel over a period of time. Fireproof coatings came off on impact.

    Structural steel is not designed to handle impact loads, such as one floor collapsing on another.

    You want to believe in conspiracy theories... that is your perogative.
    ‎"The education of a firefighter and the continued education of a firefighter is what makes "real" firefighters. Continuous skill development is the core of progressive firefighting. We learn by doing and doing it again and again, both on the training ground and the fireground."
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    This is what happened. Brother and sisters died that day in a heroic way. Someone died for us 2005 years ago and for most of us we remember why!! Our brothers and sisters died that day 09/11/01 for the people of New York City. Did we ever get a head count of how many lives that was saved that day???

    Think about it love you all and be safe.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zamboni

    The secrecy only breeds further conspiracy theories.
    No. Morons like you breed conspiracy theories.

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    Angry

    They ALL fell at near free fall speed ... whereas the laws of physics regarding momentum and structural mass resistance would show the collapse should have been slower and/or even partial.
    Ask a professionalbuilding engineer, the forces acting on the building were far greater than what it was designed for, something like 30 times greater minimum iirc, nothing was going to slow the building down. Dont listen to the conspiracy nuts, I have seen these same arguments, they are crap & they are sick and insulting to those that died, IMHO.

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    Default A couple of sources about buildings

    Two books have been re-issued in paperback by Mario Salvadori and are available on amazon.com: Why buildings stand up and Why Buildings fall down. Mario was a professor at Columbia, worked on the Manhattan Project, was a real curmudgeon, and really knew his stuff; and maybe it's better to learn about how buildings are constructed than wallow in conspiracy theories. Unfortunately he died at age 90 in 1997, so the section about September 11 in Why Buildings fall down was not written by him.

    Any explosions heard prior could have been any of the following: pressurized cannisters/hydraulic systems/collapsing floors/molten steel/falling souls/etc.etc.

    Anyone who attacks fires needs to know the potentialities of each building...which is why FDs everywhere have maps of major/commercial buildings in their coverage areas to study and use at the command site.

    WTC7 simply burned to the ground; WTC1 and 2 were ignited by thousands of gallons of jet fuel.
    Last edited by Guidance1; 01-12-2006 at 03:34 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zamboni
    I've noticed that many sites all around cyberspace claim that WTC1,2,7 were brought down by bombs/demolition charges. Does anyone here agree ?

    Is there any validity to claims that many NYFD firemen making claims they heard bombs exploding before the collapses ?

    I have no intention of flaming the forum or such, but many others claim that many NYFD firemen have been gagged about talking anything WTC related so I thought I'd directly come to this forum and ask... Is this true.

    Any other opinions are also welcome from a professional perspective.

    Sincerely,

    John
    RUBBER is that you?
    "Training doesn't make you a good fireman, fighting fire makes you a good fireman"
    http://thedarksideof911.blogspot.com/
    FTM-PTB-EGH
    IACOJ

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by jmitchell
    RUBBER is that you?
    Nah, this guy's just a conspiracy theorist who hasn't been heard from since he first posted this thread, it definitely isn't TH/CDV.
    September 11th - Never Forget

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  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by RspctFrmCalgary
    Nah, this guy's just a conspiracy theorist who hasn't been heard from since he first posted this thread, it definitely isn't TH/CDV.
    He only has 2 posts is why I was wondering. Can't be too careful these days.
    "Training doesn't make you a good fireman, fighting fire makes you a good fireman"
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    FTM-PTB-EGH
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  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Guidance1

    WTC7 simply burned to the ground; WTC1 and 2 were ignited by thousands of gallons of jet fuel.
    No. 7 collapsed as well.

  20. #20
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    Default Thanks I stand corrected

    Quote Originally Posted by GeorgeWendtCFI
    No. 7 collapsed as well.

    Yes, you're right...7WTC collapsed in the afternoon. I simply meant that it had been allowed to burn itself out.

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