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    Default 75' quints weight question

    For those of you with single rear axle 75' quints, with all your tools (including hyrdraulics) are you under GVW?

    We are looking at a specing a 75' platform with 500 gallons/pump set up as a truck company...

    Everyone is worried about turning radius of a dual axle. I just am concerned that the single would be overloaded, or very close to it...

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    Content deleted by author.
    Last edited by Firefighter807; 07-08-2009 at 07:15 PM.

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    We built a Pierce 75' single axle quint as an engine co. We had to reduce the tank to 450 gals to maintain our 2000lb equipment allowance.

    If you are going to place that much gear on the rig, go double axle. Our single went through brakes in 11k miles.

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    Quote Originally Posted by chtucker
    For those of you with single rear axle 75' quints, with all your tools (including hyrdraulics) are you under GVW?

    We are looking at a specing a 75' platform with 500 gallons/pump set up as a truck company...

    Everyone is worried about turning radius of a dual axle. I just am concerned that the single would be overloaded, or very close to it...
    What make & model 75' platform are you interested in, the only builders are American Lafrance , Sutphen , Seagrave , Rosenbaur , and most will only build on a tandem rear axle !!
    Last edited by NewJerseyFFII; 03-12-2006 at 01:16 PM.

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    The manufacturuer should be able to provide you with turning radius. Be sure to ask for left AND right turn. Also look at both turning radius of the tires and the radius with the front bumper, which given the size of your bumper extension could really added to the radius.

    We have found that the wheelbase does not play as important part in turning radius as the cramp angle of the front wheels do. Tire sizes and sometime front suctions will affect the cramp angle. Also some cramp angles can be different when turning left or right.

    Hope this helps.

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    Thanks for the in sight everyone.

    We are not set on any one manufacturer. We love our suthphen pumper, but are not set in stone.

    It won't have a bumper extension and it will have big horsepower (500+) as we are located at 10,000 feet above sea level.

    Interesting comment about the brakes though.... kinda makes me think about some of the mountain passes in our response area.

    We don't have committment from anyone for money so this has been just tossed around at the table.... our 1982 Eone 55' telesquirt has been OOS for about 2 years now...

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    Go with a dual rear axle for the extra load capacity and, more importantly, more stopping power. We have a Pierce HD75 with 500 water on an OAL of 37.5' and a WB of 226". So a short, dual rear rig is possible.
    Fire Marshal/Safety Officer

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    So my next question is... and obviously only one the manufacturers could answer is

    Short wheelbase 75' platform dual rears with 1000 gallons of water. 90% of our first due area (but not concenctration of risk) is off the hydrant grid.... Plus we never know what is coming behind us.

    Our first due is a 2001 Sutphen Short wheelbase single rear rescue pumper with 1000 gallons it works really well for us.

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    75' tower and 1000 gallons of water???

    That may be a little much man!!!

    You might want to consider cutting that back to possibly around 500 gallons. I'm a firm believer in that if you need more water buy a tanker, if you need more ladders buy a truck.
    I can't believe they actually pay me to do this!!!

    One friend noted yesterday that a fire officer only carries a flashlight, sometimes prompting grumbling from firefighters who have to lug tools and hoses.
    "The old saying is you never know how heavy that flashlight can become," the friend said.
    -from a tragic story posted on firefighterclosecalls.com

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    400 sq miles and 3 people on duty No paid on call, just a hope and prayer tha someone is around. I thought about it after I wrote it and it is a little nuts, just trying to think outside the box ( in this case a bit to far)

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    Quote Originally Posted by chtucker
    Short wheelbase 75' platform dual rears with 1000 gallons of water.
    And absolutly no compartment space.
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    Quote Originally Posted by chtucker
    400 sq miles and 3 people on duty No paid on call, just a hope and prayer tha someone is around. I thought about it after I wrote it and it is a little nuts, just trying to think outside the box ( in this case a bit to far)
    Then my question would be do you REALLY need a platform? Or are you looking for an elevated master stream or quick access to a roof? I would think you would have better luck with a short WB, 1000 gallon tank with a telesquirt. You wouldnt need the dual rear then.
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    The platform because of the freezing temps that we endure. We have found that the ladder gets slick as snot at our temps (6 months of winter at least here) It has snowed a foot of snow on July 4...

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    chtucker-

    Check out these rigs if you haven't already-

    http://www.geocities.com/ecburtblue33//iindex.html

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    Somebody always has to whip out Fallon Churchill's trucks. Note that they only run 400 calls/yr. I doubt that all 4 of those monsters respond on every call, so each one rolls out a couple times a week. Try taking those things on EMS 2000+ times a year. Monster trucks are not the answer to every FD deficiency.

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    Smile

    [QUOTE=chtucker]For those of you with single rear axle 75' quints, with all your tools (including hyrdraulics) are you under GVW?

    We are looking at a specing a 75' platform with 500 gallons/pump set up as a truck company...

    Everyone is worried about turning radius of a dual axle. I just am concerned that the single would be overloaded, or very close to it] Len heling at elite fire appuratus built our 75' quint for our department. call him @ 715-787-4448 ext 101. len will be straight with you, he alwys has brought new ideas to the table

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    bdaenterprises...

    Do you get a commission check for each time you mention Elite?

    FyredUp

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    Default 75' quints weight question

    Contact your local E-One dealer. We just bought an HP75 at our place. It's great! It screams with the 450HP engine and it turns and stops on a dime. Even fully loaded.

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    Thumbs up

    We recieved an E-ONE 75' quint. Its got a 500 gallon tank and we took tools from pretty much every truck to equip it.

    I don't know if this is overall or not, but our E-one rides very low to the ground in the front. It is fully loaded, but it turns, goes and stops on a dime.

    Many of the engineers like the truck because it rides smoother and better than our other 3 engines, rescue, 2 tankers, and brush truck.

    I like the truck alot!

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    gunnyv- I just want to clarify here that I think Fallon Churchill's trucks are a little ridiculous. They were built simply to obtain an ISO class 1 rating... at least that is my understanding of it. Although they purpose built them for their needs just the same as our trucks are built to our needs. I've never had to drive 45+ minutes to get to a fire where there is no hydrant. I was simply pointing out that you can get someone out there to build you just about anything you can dream of, so if you want 1000 gallons on a 75' aerial, I'm sure someone would be happy to bid.
    Last edited by Ladder27; 03-31-2006 at 09:44 AM.

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    Ladder27-Roger that. As was said, they built trucks to accomplish their mission. The folly is in all the "wackers" -many of whom are city administrators-out there thinking the monster truck is the answer. That truck with every gizmo in the world will not put out a fire or save a life without a crew-and no rig compares to a properly staffed company.

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    Gunny- all I can say to that is Amen.

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    The best thing you can do is find a neighboring department with a tandem axle truck. Take a test ride, and you will find that a tandem will turn as tight, if not tighter, than a single axle. The front axle of the tandem is where the truck will pivot for the turn, and it's a shorter wheelbase than most single axle trucks. We have a Pierce 75HD ladder, 500 gallon tank, Dash cab. We carry 1,200 ft. of 4" hose, 500' 2 1/2" hose, and 3 cross lays of 1 3/4" hose, 10K hydraulic generator. Overall height is 11' 1.5". It turns on a dime with a straight axle in the front, the TAK4 didn't make the cut when we bought it. We did not have any weight restriction for equipment as you may encounter with a single axle. And as mentioned before, you have another set of tires on the ground to make the vehicle more stable, and more importantly, another set of brakes. I encourage you to consider the advantages of the tandem axle.

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    For some reason some people often have a hard time grasping this concept, but on any given apparatus, adding a tandem axle will actually shorten your wheelbase and/or increase your angle of departure - so it is actually a good thing in terms of maneuverability.

    In nearly all situations, I would definitely recommend a tandem for increased capacity, weight distribution, and braking power, rather than pushing a single axle to its absolute limits.


    Bettendorf, IA runs a 2002 HME/Alexis/RK with an 85 aerial and a 1,000 gallon water/20 gallon foam tank. It is a very long wheelbase (254"), so I'm not necessarily recommending it, but it's out there.

    However, there are definitely ways to get larger tank capacities on 60-85' aerials without having a monstrosity - you just have to know what you're doing and have a manufacturer that is on the ball. I would guess that Rosenbauer, Crimson, and a couple of others might be up to the challenge.

    And a note on the Fallon rigs: they were designed to achieve a great ISO rating, but also for superior functionality. They work just fine for the department, and last time I checked, they had plenty of crewmembers to staff them with.

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    Default 75 Ft. Weight ?

    I also agree and know that a Tandem 75 ft. will actually turn better than a Single Axle even with a longer WB but I think some people feel a tandem looks bigger when in fact one of the determining factors is the OAL of the aerial device itself...

    A tandem is going to give you a better ride, braking performance and more compartmentation BUT it does come at a price and that's where I think that some FD's go with the Single Axle and I'd estimate that probably 80% of the 75 ft. models sold are Single Axle.

    There are FD's with both such as St. Louis with 30 Smeal 75 ft. Single Axles and Riverside County with 3 Smeal 75 ft. and Toronto runs some 75 ft. Tandems as well. Also West Metro in St. Louis Co. MO have recently taken delivery of 2 Tandem Spartan LFD 75 ft. Smeal Quints and so take a look at the Smeal website www.smeal.com and see the photos of them in their Calendar section.

    My opinion is if you can afford it and want the maximum water tank size then definitely go with a Tandem.

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