1. #1
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    Default Can't do simple math...no problem...it's because your a victim!

    This would be funny if it weren't sad. I guess merit and fitness mean nothing anymore. The NAACP should be embarassed for even associating with this. Imgaine if a group that is suposed to fight stereotypes that blacks are dumb, lazy, ignorant...etc. actually futhers the notion through their own words and actions. If I was a member or a black I would be greatly insulted at the actions and words of the NAACP. I know a number of black firemen and not one of them was unable to pass a simple math test as the one described below. This is the same type of Bull sh*t which has gone on in regards to Fire department hirings.

    I don't care what color you are...if you can't pass the math section of the following test you barely quailfy for a ditch diggers job...but you certainly would not deserve a police officers job. It is no ones fault but your own that you didnt' apply yourself in school. No one wants to take responsiblity for their actions anymore.

    What a sad state of affairs this country finds itself in.


    Feds say Beach's math exam for police recruits is discriminatory
    By DUANE BOURNE, The Virginian-Pilot
    © February 9, 2006

    Take part in 5 questions here: 5 Discriminatory Math questions!

    VIRGINIA BEACH — The U.S. Justice Department has found that the math portion of the Virginia Beach Police Department’s entrance exam discriminates against black and Hispanic applicants.

    In a letter to the city released Wednesday, the Justice Department said its findings were based on results of a math test administered to all entry-level police officers.

    The Justice Department said it will sue the city if Virginia Beach does not take appropriate measures to end discrimination and provide “sufficient remedial relief” to previous job applicants.

    On Wednesday, city officials said they do not discriminate and the math portion of the exam assesses job-related skills.

    Police Chief A.M. “Jake” Jacocks Jr. said the city will cooperate with the Justice Department and will not act until it discusses the findings with federal officials. No date has been set.

    The hiring practices of the city’s police and fire departments were called into question in 2004 after a study showed a disparity between the racial composition of its population and its police and fire departments.

    About 20 percent of Virginia Beach’s population is black and about 5 percent is Hispanic, according to the Census Bureau.

    As of January, 15.9 percent of the city’s police officers were identified as minority. About 10.1 percent of the police force is black – an increase from 9 percent two years ago.

    The announcement in 2004 of the Justice Department inquiry prompted the

    Virginia Beach branch of the NAACP to chastise the city for what it said were unfair hiring practices.

    At the time, branch President Georgia F. Allen called on City Manager James K. Spore to resign because of the low number of black city employees.

    On Wednesday, Carl Wright, vice president of the Virginia Beach NAACP branch, said, “It is a shame that the Department of Justice had to come in here and say that we see discrimination. Ray Charles could have seen it.”

    Wright said the city should have taken action on its own long ago. He said the national office of the NAACP is prepared to take action against the city if the problem is not remedied.

    A separate Justice Department inquiry into possible discrimination in the hiring of Chesapeake police and fire employees has been pending since 2004. So far, there is no word on whether it has concluded.

    Since the Virginia Beach investigation began, the city has sought to attract a police force representative of the growing minority population.

    The city has reviewed the recruiting selection process and made several changes to address the pass-fail rate on the written exam, including adding 10 minutes to the math section and providing a study guide to all applicants.

    “We want to increase our minority representation,” Jacocks said Wednesday. “It is important for us to do that. I am not convinced that a simple math test is the cause of our problem.”

    The city requires all recruits to score at least 70 percent on all parts of the written exam – the National Police Officer Selection Test.

    Between 2002 and mid-2005, about 59 percent of black applicants and 66 percent of Hispanic applicants passed the math test, compared with 85 percent of white applicants, according to the Justice Department letter.

    First administered to Virginia Beach candidates in 1998, the test is designed to assess basic skills of a police officer. It is offered to prospective officers in 20 other states, according to the Virginia Association of Chiefs of Police.

    “This is not a test we developed,” Jacocks said. “We are not looking for rocket scientists. This is a basic math aptitude test.”

    One sample question framed a problem in the context of police work: “On Tuesday, Officer Jones worked the 3 p.m. to 11 p.m. shift. At 10:55 p.m. he was called to the scene of an accident where he remained until 1:30 a.m. How long past his regular shift did Officer Jones work?”

    Charles W. Meyer, the city’s chief operating officer, said it will be easy to address the Justice Department’s findings because they are focused on one specific area.

    “We will do whatever we can to eliminate whatever barriers there may be,” Meyer said. “We also want to make sure that we are not discriminating against minority groups to achieve the balance of high standards and recruit qualified police officers.”

    The Justice Department said it will delay filing a lawsuit against Virginia Beach until March 7 to give the city time to negotiate a settlement.


    Staff writer Jon Frank contributed to this report.


    Reach Duane Bourne at (757) 222-5150 or duane.bourne@pilotonline.com.

    FTM-PTB

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    Default

    Maybe I'm stupid, but HOW can addition, subtraction, multiplication, or division be "discriminatory"?
    "This thread is being closed as it is off-topic and not related to the fire industry." - Isn't that what the Off Duty forum was for?

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    Post Qualified???

    I'm sorry but I'm sick of this. This is happening everywhere. It is not discrimination, it is about getting qualified people. A line has to be drawn somewhere, and if these people want underqualified people protecting them just so they have a certain percentage of minorities then let them have it. If I was a member of that community I would be upset. I have nothing against them, I have worked along side quite a few, but they need to be qualified to do the job period. There are qualified people of minority out there, find them. I don't know what else to say. This can't be good for the fire service.

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    Insane!

    This is how unqualified, unmotivated people get city jobs.

    Nothing about those questions discriminate, I hate the NAACP for the shams they pull off in the courtroom and for the fact that they operate on pulling the "race card" on everyone.

    Also, I think they are still the only organization in the world that openly uses the term "colored people", whats up with that?

    Stories like this make me despise the NAACP and all that support them, and I have no problem saying that, to anyone.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bones42
    Maybe I'm stupid, but HOW can addition, subtraction, multiplication, or division be "discriminatory"?
    *They should get rid of the math and have questions about gangsta rap and hip hop, foshizzle!


    *sarcasm, for those who can't recognize it
    ‎"The education of a firefighter and the continued education of a firefighter is what makes "real" firefighters. Continuous skill development is the core of progressive firefighting. We learn by doing and doing it again and again, both on the training ground and the fireground."
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    Another example of the bleeding heart librals and their allies in the NAACP and civil liberty unions on reducing everything down to the least common denominator.
    Could you imagine the back-lash a white male where to state; "blacks are stupid and can't do math, or read, or do the job required." You would be strung up. But everyday, that's exactly what the NAACP is saying.
    Who is perpetuating stereo types here?
    My posts reflect my views and opinions, not the organization I work for or my IAFF local. Some of which they may not agree. I.A.C.O.J. member
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    I took the 5 sample questions and got all of them correct, must be because I'm white. Are they (NAACP, ACLU, Etc.) crying that the tests are discriminitory because less minorities pass them than majorities? Maybe I just don't understand how a math test could be discriminitory. Are numbers racist? Does SIMPLE math hate minorities?
    The views expressed by me are my opinions and do not reflect the opinions of any of my affiliations.

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    So NAACP is complaining that a lower percentage of colored people pass the test than uncolored people?

    I don't see a problem with hiring less minorities if they cannot pass the same test as other people.

    I say the city should fight this!
    FTM - PTB

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    Quote Originally Posted by BVFD1983
    So NAACP is complaining that a lower percentage of colored people pass the test than uncolored people?

    I don't see a problem with hiring less minorities if they cannot pass the same test as other people.

    I say the city should fight this!
    Uncolored people: Are they transparent? Clear is the absence of color!
    ‎"The education of a firefighter and the continued education of a firefighter is what makes "real" firefighters. Continuous skill development is the core of progressive firefighting. We learn by doing and doing it again and again, both on the training ground and the fireground."
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    I also took the 5 question test and if you can read and do simple math, then your fine.
    This has always been a spur under my saddle when someone trys to make an excuse for someone elses pitfalls.
    Your a daisy if you do.

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    ----------
    Last edited by firefighter7160; 11-15-2007 at 11:02 PM.

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    Only 10 out of 33 passed?!? Either your town is full of waterheads or it was a "challenging" test.
    The views expressed by me are my opinions and do not reflect the opinions of any of my affiliations.

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    I don't know about any of the other questions, but, anyone who can't keep track of their own overtime is not meant for a career in the fire service, 'cause I can gauantee you, at some point the job is going to screw you on O.T. Its a law of nature.
    A'int No Rocket Scientist's in The Firehall

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    All this "stuff" just makes me sick...First it was the public schools. Seperate schools were the reason minorities scored lower then whites, so let de-segregate the schools. Fine, but here we are 30+ years later and guess what. Yup, minorities are still scoring lower. Hmmm, maybe its the person, not the "system". So now lets "dumb down" everything else just so "they" can get jobs. Whatever.

    I just dont understand why we all cant grasp the fact that different groups of people have different "talents". For example, Reggie White was correct when he said Asians are good at makeing watches. He got blasted for it, but he was right. The same thing applies to thoese of African heratige. Look at most of the major sports and whos the majority? Certain people are better at athletics then say business. So what? I dont see what the problem is. Do what you do best and be good at it. If you have certian "gifts", use them, but dont come crying when you decided to do a job your not really fit for.

    And BTW, this goes for everyone. White, black, blue or green. If you really have your heart set on something else, work and work hard and you will get there. Nothing should be handed to anybody.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bones42
    Maybe I'm stupid, but HOW can addition, subtraction, multiplication, or division be "discriminatory"?
    Thats what I was thinking - I mean if these people have a HS Diploma or GED - then a basic math test should be a no brainer.

    NAACP, ACLU - they should reconsider backing this arguement - but then again its par for them I guess.

    *They should get rid of the math and have questions about gangsta rap and hip hop, foshizzle!


    *sarcasm, for those who can't recognize it
    Now that's funny no matter what!
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    http://cms.firehouse.com/content/art...Id=46&id=48716



    lowering standards to hire new firefighters

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    This is not new. We have had this problem and the FDNY is again about to go thru this problem. The one that make these decisions have either never crawled the halls or forgotten what its like.
    Just another one of the 99%ers looking up.

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    Well you have to figure that the CPAT is next. We cant single out those who do not possess the physcial strength to do the job. (sarcasim is very thick in that sentance). I feel bad for those departments that have to deal with this BS and are forced to hire those that are not qualified for the job because a quota has to be met. Skin color, sexual oreintation, religion, etc.. do not matter when it comes to hiring someone qualified for a public safety job. Now that im all worked up im gonna go hit the weights. Stay safe everybody!

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    Don't joke SPFTMEDIC!

    The State of Massachusetts is currently in a little bit of a hubba ballou with several large city police chiefs (like Boston & Worcester) complaining that the state's equivelant of the CPAT for police candidates is to tough for women.

    Indeed, last year roughly only 30% of the females passed.

    Clearly discriminatory!

    Except...8 years ago, something like 70% of the females who took the excact same test passed. And the percentage has declined each and every year.

    Granted the specific part the women are failing on is an upper-body strength one (going over the wall). But it hasn't changed, the candidates have.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SPFTMEDIC
    Well you have to figure that the CPAT is next. We cant single out those who do not possess the physcial strength to do the job. (sarcasim is very thick in that sentance). I feel bad for those departments that have to deal with this BS and are forced to hire those that are not qualified for the job because a quota has to be met. Skin color, sexual oreintation, religion, etc.. do not matter when it comes to hiring someone qualified for a public safety job. Now that im all worked up im gonna go hit the weights. Stay safe everybody!
    Philly got rid of its physical test years and years ago. Push ups and stuff apparently are racist and sexist.
    Just another one of the 99%ers looking up.

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