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  1. #1
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    Default Proper pumping pressure

    Anyone know what the correct pumping pressure is for 1 inch(rubber) booster line? Big dispute after a trash fire today?


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    depends on the nossle type. you need enough pump pressure to overcome the friction loss in the line and still have the propper operating psi at the nossle.

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    It has a fog tip, and is approx. 200ft. but only about 30ft was deployed. At 100psi, the water just dripped out, at 300psi it was normal. It just seemed a bit much for a booster line.

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    Forum Member explr985's Avatar
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    Regardless of how much you pulled off the truck, the line is still 200ft. long.
    No longer an explorer, but I didn't wanna lose my posts.

    IACOJ 2003

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    Quote Originally Posted by Muttly92094
    Anyone know what the correct pumping pressure is for 1 inch(rubber) booster line? Big dispute after a trash fire today?
    A good fire stream is one that reaches the target, retains in characteristics (solid, straight, fog, etc) and has the desired effect on the target ... if the above are met, pressure and nozzle selection are OK, if not re-evaluate.

    How many GPM's were you trying to flow. What is that fog nozzle rated at?

    Just as an example 60 GPM through 200ft of 1" hose = 108 psi friction loss. If your FOG nozzle is designed for 100psi nozzle pressure you need 208 psi of engine pressure (plus compensation for any friction loss you may have in your discharge manifold and booster reel plumbing) call it 220 psi or so to get the nozzle pressure your fog nozzle was designed for.

  6. #6
    EuroFirefighter.com PaulGRIMWOOD's Avatar
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    Depends on the working pressure of your booster line. If it is rated for low pressure then probably only 100psi. If it is rated for high pressure then work according to that. We run 400psi plus through 150' of one inch booster lines to get a flow of 50gpm or more. The boosters we use are pressure rated to 800 psi.

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    Cool What I was taught.....

    I was initially taught that 1" booster lines are pumped at 200 p.s.i.
    Our State curriculum is now saying that 1" booster lines should be pumped at 150 p.s.i. which is what I was re-taught a few months after I started pumping. I pump my booster lines at 150 p.s.i.
    "Be LOUD, Be PROUD..... It just might save your can someday when goin' through an intersection!!!!!"

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  8. #8
    Forum Member allineedisu's Avatar
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    Exclamation Booster lines

    Hey pal, very simple for booster lines, using a standard 23 Ė 35 gpm fog nozzle.

    1. All fog nozzles require a 100 psi nozzle pressure.

    2. The fiction loss in the 1 inch booster hose is 15 psi per 100 feet of hose

    3. The friction loss in the reel makeup and plumbing is a flat 25 psi


    Formula would be:

    100 + 15 + 25 = PDP

    So if you had 300 feet of hose you would pump 170 psi.


    This isnít rocket science. It is just works this way. You also can add or subtract elevation loss to this for every 10 feet above or below the pump. It really makes no difference.

    But for taking a test it does!!
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    Hose reels cause additional friction loss due to the coiled hose.

    I don't have the specifics for 1" high pressure rubber hose since we don't use it, but as an example 3/4" HPR hose is shown as 42 psi / 100 feet @ 20 gpm, when coiled on a reel it increases to 53 psi / 100 feet, almost a 25% increase.

    This feature of coiled hose has been used successfully to "reduce" the pressure at the bottom of long steep hoselays, throwing a couple of loops into the first section of hose does seem to reduce the frequency of burst hoses (long uphill hoselays often reach pressures of 300-350 psi, our pumps are rated to 400 psi).

    I don't use 1" rubber hose, but I have it listed as
    9 psi / 100 @ 20 gpm
    21 psi / 100 @ 30 gpm
    37 psi / 100 @ 40 gpm
    56 psi / 100 @ 50 gpm
    71 psi / 100 @ 60 gpm

    These # are from the NWCG Water Handling Guide and are the results of actual flow tests, not theoretcial calculations so they may vary a bit due to brand of hose, style of nozzle etc. This is for straignt hose, not coiled on a reel so assuming 1" and 3/4" have similar characteristics I would assume you could add 20-25% to the friction loss.

    We only use the booster line for mop up and cleaning equipment, we have 250 feet of 3/4" rubber hose and I usually start off around 200 psi with a 10/20 gpm fog nozzle and adjust from there.

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    Thumbs up Easy memory aid for 1" booster

    The guy who instructed me when I started to pump had a nice memory aid which I've remembered, and works real well.

    We flow 30 gpm with 200' of 1" booster. (fog nozzle)

    GPM minus 10 = friction loss per 100 feet of hose. So we pump @ 140psi, which seems to do a good job. Not super worried about exact GPM, of course the booster isn't going in the front door, VERY minor car fires, brush and that sort of stuff. It has a good pattern/ reach with 140psi.

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    Wow, 300psi I bet the nozzle reaction was pretty good. My expierence has been with 150ft booster lines and rarely pumped more than 100psi EP. My first check would be the nozzle. Is something messed up with it? Is is clogged up or something like that? Is it the correct nozzle? If I am not mistaken there are some nozzles intended for crash rescue apparatus that use 1 inch hard lines to flow foam for cutting rescue paths to the aircraft. They would require more gpm's than what a normal booster line is intended for. Correct me if I am wrong gang. Other than that I can not add to the suggestions already given in here.
    Vintage Firefighter: The older I get, the braver I was.

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    MembersZone Subscriber npfd801's Avatar
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    Just be careful that you aren't flowing a booster line intended to flow 100 gpm, which ours is. The older style booster reel you can get away with at 150-200psi, but we pump ours much higher to get the rated flow.

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    MembersZone Subscriber JHR1985's Avatar
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    in my hydraulics class.... correct me if I'm wrong guys BUT

    FL constant for a 1 3/4 would be 15.5
    1 1/2 would be 24
    and One inch would be 100

    so FL=Constant*Gpm/100*length of hose in 100 ft

    Take... 100ft at 60 gpm=60 PSI friction lose + fog nozzle=Pump Pressure of 160 but there is the issue of it being rolled up so some might add 15 PSI for appliance issues

    100Ft at 100 GPM would be... 100 PSI friction loss

    Its pretty easy with 100 ft increments. Take the GPM and thats your friction loss

    But, this is all by the book.

    Remember the fire ground pump op rule: Thumb up means more pressure
    Thumb down means less



    You gotta remember: Your pumping a very small line

    That pump is not having to put out that much effort to get that PSI up.

    Now, for a 2.5 inch line.... your gonna kill that pump. Thats why you dont use TFT tips for a 2.5 for a foam application. That pump will be screaming.

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    Most of these answers could be correct, depending on whose assumptions are correct about the setup you're actually using. There are two morals to this story...

    1. Know your equipment.

    2. Set your equipment up so that it can be used to its best advantage.

    For example, our 1 3/4" and 2" attack lines are currently outfitted with TFT automatics, but will soon be switched over to adjustable gallonage POKs (they're on order). The 1 3/4" lines will have 100 psi/95-200 gpm nozzles and the 2" lines will have 100 psi/100-250 gpm nozzles. Trash lines (which sometimes get pulled off for extensions) and hi-rise packs will have 1 3/4" hose, but have 75 psi/125 gpm nozzles, thereby reducing the required pressures when working with extended lays and standpipes. The 2 1/2" and one additional 1 3/4" have smooth bores on them. We have a booster line, too, but nobody ever uses it for firefighting anymore.

    So, if you ask me what my discharge pressure should be, my answer will be "it depends" - on which line you have & what nozzle is on it, what flow you want, what floor you're on, etc. Ultimately, pump operations are less about "rules of thumb" and more about understanding hydraulics. Do we have "baseline" settings for each line type? Sure...but I would expect my operators to be able to work well outside of the baseline scenario.

    I'm not trying to come down on anyone...I'm just pointing out that there really is a body of knowledge pump operators should understand before they go out on the street.

  15. #15
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    Wow, this is a thread resurrected from the dead!

    1) What I didn't see anyone mention...

    Check for obstructions. Do you have trash at the nozzle? Do you have a valve that isn't opening fully? Has part of the liner delaminated...ok, that's more a collapsible hose problem, but I suppose you could have a similiar problem with a "flap" of lose rubber in traditional booster hose.

    The nice thing about the math above gives you a starting point. If the math is way off from what you observe, it's time to look for a problem.

    Also, how trustworthy are the guages? If the guages, equipment, and math are making no sense and you've double checked your math and equipment...check you calibration on the guages.

    2) Wow, 300psi I bet the nozzle reaction was pretty good.

    Remember that was the Pump Discharge Pressure. I'd assume the nozzle pressure was substantially less. Although the hose would get awful rigid when the nozzle is closed!

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