View Poll Results: Do you see UK/European Ff's as external defensive Ff's

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  • Yes:

    6 35.29%
  • No

    11 64.71%
  1. #1
    MembersZone Subscriber
    SteveDude's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2002
    London, England

    Default UK/EU Firefighting

    Prompted by a shocking revalation on another thread in Fireground Tactics...
    Do the majority of US members here think that European Firefighing is largely defensive...i.e we don't go into Buildings to carry out rescue and fight fire offensively.

    If that is the case...where in the World did you get that idea???

    By Europe I mean major modern Nations such as UK, Germany, Sweden, Fance etc
    Steve Dude
    IACOJ member

    London Fire Brigade...."Can Do"

    'Irony'... It's a British thing.

  2. #2
    PaulGRIMWOOD's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 1999


    Think he was returning some good 'ole' sarcasm Steve

    Hey .... a fog pattern can't reach as far as a straight stream right?

  3. #3
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    sconfire's Avatar
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    Jun 2001
    Summerville, SC


    I cannot speak for the rest of the EU but I can speak for Britian.

    The Brits are very offensive! Their whole way of firefighting is different on a regular basis because of compartment fires. Their construction is very thick and heavy and very stable. This lends its hand towards fogging or using the pulse and then closing the door.

    This construction is quickly become NOT THE NORM in the UK. Ordinary wood frame construction is the name of the game now.

    Now if you are judging the lack of LODD's due to them not being interior firefighters... you need to look back and do some math. The numbers of firefighters do not compare and the lifestyles are very different.

    Plain and simple...

    I have been to the Essex training facility, Moreton-in-Marsh, and have ridden with the boys from Chelsea in London and Swindon in Wiltshire... and have seen first hand their firefighting capabilities.

    I met many fine people and would gladly attack the gates of hell knowing those fellows had my back. No worries here!
    Always remember the CHARLESTON 9

    Captain Grant Mishoe, Curator of History
    North Charleston and American LaFrance Fire Museum
    "You'll never know where you're going until you remember where you came from"

  4. #4
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    EFD840's Avatar
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    Jun 2000
    Eclectic (no, NOT electric), Alabama


    Steve, I wouldn't put too much stock into that statement but if anyone does have that idea, a quick read of Dave Wilson's Stories should set them straight.

    Then again, it may be a language thing. Information on firefighting outside the use can be hard to follow without a translator - even when we speak the same language. Us Americans can't even decide what to call the big truck that hauls water (tanker or tender) so how can you expect us on the fly translate BAR/PSI, Apparatus/Appliance, Nozzle/Jet, 38mm/Inch and a half, etc. It is much easier to take one look at all those messed up terms and decide y'all have no idea what you're doing.

  5. #5
    Forum Member
    VinnieB's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    On the couch in my skivvies


    I was in London in 1998.....I smelled that "smell" walked a block or two, and watched a job go down.....LFB pulled up and went into out 2 window on the 3d or 4th floor......they went in.....and put it out, looked pretty damned aggressive and offensive to me....I have a picture...but no I can't share it........yet.
    IACOJ Member

  6. #6
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Nov 2005


    You're absolutly right about the compartments and the thick walls.
    God help the fire that tried to get through the terrace I lived in, the walls of those 170 year old houses were stone and very thick.
    Slate roofs make it interesting too.

  7. #7
    MembersZone Subscriber

    Join Date
    Feb 2000
    Oakland Fire Department, CA


    Steve, to answer your question, YES, I think that most American Fire Fighters think that European firefighters do not go inside in the same way "we do".

    I hate this statement "we do" because in America, many many departments operate poorly and/or defensively quite often, and the word aggressive is used so easily and improperly.....

    What I found amusing, is that in European countries, they often think that WE are the defensive firefighters!!
    "An aggressive interior attack does not mean just going inside to put out a fire. THAT'S just doing our job...."
    IAFF Local 55

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