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    Default Can a non U.S. citizen be hired by a Fire Department in the USA

    Can a non U.S. citizen be hired by a Fire Department that tests under Civil Service rules in the Untied State? The City I tested for about 4 years ago finely hired off their hiring list in April. 9 out of 16 new recruits are non U.S citizens. Can a City change their Civil Service rules after their Civil service exam was given?


    The City Civil Service Charter states the following

    Such tests shall be public, competitive and open to all persons who may be lawfully appointed to any position within the class for which such examinations are held with limitations specified in the rules of the commission as to residence, age, health, habits, moral character and prerequisite qualifications to perform the duties of such position, provided applicants shall be citizens of the United States

    Please help any one?

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    I am a non-citizen and a career firefighter here in the us.
    [FONT=Garamond]Asst. Chief Chris Jennings

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    I am a non-citizen and a career firefighter here in the US (And proud of that fact - Canada is just too damn cold!!!). I know some cities specify you have to be, others do not. Mostly, it is more important in Law Enforcement from what I have seen, but then again allot of places out west have changed that requirement as well, LAPD comes to mind.

    Now, as for if they posted you had to be a US citizen from the outset of the process. I would be worried that changing it halfway could be problematic. I would think I could protest, saying I am a non citizen and wanted to apply, but did not due to the hiring restrictions, yet the city hired people regardless. I would think that the city would repost the requirements and reopen the process. Now of course, it could be argued, not by me however, that when they say citizen, they mean resident. I think the way my job description was written it was "US Citizen or Permanent Resident".

    Sounds to me like the city might be on shaky ground should someone try to push the issue. Not in the fact of who they hired, but how the process was handled.

    Quality People are Quality People.
    Last edited by cjennings; 05-10-2006 at 04:00 PM.
    [FONT=Garamond]Asst. Chief Chris Jennings

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    Probably going to start a flame war somewhere but if you're on a government job,shouldn't you be a citizen of that country?Any thoughts on why or why not?

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    Applications currently being given out on my job state in the "Requirements" section,

    " Applicants must be citizens of the United States as of August 31, 2006"

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    Quote Originally Posted by doughesson
    Probably going to start a flame war somewhere but if you're on a government job,shouldn't you be a citizen of that country?Any thoughts on why or why not?
    I think you should be a citizen, or working on it. And I do know you don't need to be a citizen to join the military. If it's not specified in the appliation process, what can you do?


    Andy

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    The City canít repost the requirements and reopen the process because the exam was given Sept 14 2002 and they finely hired off the hiring list in April. There are 600 candidates on the list waiting to be hired. The Civil Service Charter and Notice rule went from you must be citizens of the United States, No candidate will be considered for appointment that has been convicted of a felony, or is bad moral character to non U.S citizens and convicted felons can be hired. The Civil Service Commission and the City lawyers change every rules every second because there being sued by 19 white candidates that will not give up. The candidates who are U.S. citizen should have more rights then the non U.S. citizens the rule are the rule they should not be changed half way though the hiring process. Why should non U.S citizens have more rights then U.S citizens? When they canít even vote?

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    Even as a non-citizen...

    I firmly believe that the government bodies should firstly protect the interest and jobs of its citizens. (hence my firm belief in locking down the borders and starting a new immigration process and enforce the laws already on the books, it is SO frustrating having gone through all the right channels for years to get here...errr). However where it can get a little murky is with perm residents. Myself for instance, I have been living in the US since 1998 or so, I am the father of a US born citizen and both myself and my wife have continued our educations here. I will be a US citizen shortly, it is simply a waiting game till I can test. For those of you born here, to many of you take your citizenship for granted.. Hell I come from Canada, a great country and I love living in the US, it is my home now.

    Oh... and by the way, I was at work last Monday, proudly paying my taxes and serving my community.
    Last edited by cjennings; 05-11-2006 at 07:45 PM.
    [FONT=Garamond]Asst. Chief Chris Jennings

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    Not sure if this helps your question any, ffgoldman65, but I am also a Canadian, employed by Canada to be in the US for the next 3yrs - been here almost a year now. And am also "employed" by Fairfax County Fire & Rescue, Virginia. As a volunteer firefighter, but employed none the less.

    To be fair, my Company did a review of their by-laws and checked with the County and both made slight amendments (as I am lead to understand) which allow me to be in the Dept. And for which I am grateful, and proud to serve.

    Therefore it would seem situational as to whether an non-resident can be employed. It may take a few extra hoops to jump through, but it can be done in most places. Just keep trying.

    However, on the point of taxes.... well I have fringe benefits due to my employment in the DC area. Whether I choose to exercise those benefits, is my choice of course.

    ** just a small suggestion though... make sure you do a spell check before posting, especially when writing the name of your prospective new Country.....
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