1. #1
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    Question Billing for extrication

    I need help with my paper. I read a few posts on here, but they are dated back in 2000. I have to write a paper for my fire admin class and I was thinking of writing it on collecting money from insurance companies when extrication is involved. What I need is to find out if some of your departments are billing ins companies for this. Or is any of you would have some good resourses I could look into regarding this. I would love to find ways of increasing revenue for depts. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks clk472

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    do a search .............and for the rest ..we dont bill for that.
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    http://www.firehouse.com/forums/show...60#post1137060post 115

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    We don't currently bill for extrication, but we have talked about it a considerable amount. With the last round, we ended up with following for a fee structure:

    Cars and Trucks under 5,000 lbs GVW --> $300
    Cars and Trucks over 5,000 lbs GVW --> $500
    Semi tractor/Commercial Trucks --> $1,000

    Again, our chief did not implement before he left he department, but this is only where we ended up. Administrativly the big push is to come up with extra money by spreading the costs of the service(s) equally among the potential users.

    There are a lot of different areas this could touch and a lot of different ideas on how to do this. I personally don't know that there s a fair and equitable way to ever spread the cost over the potenial users. I think the closest we will ever get is to charge for specialized services. We do this today with Haz Mat, which requires special schools, equipment and personnel. One theory is to charge for other specialized services such as extrication.

    I'm not sold one way or the other, it would be nice if the elected officals, both local and over on the East Coast, along with the average Joe would just realize that they need to pay an acceptable amount for these services. But when reality sets in, it'll probably easy to bill the insurance company and let them pass it on to the customer.

    Sorry I didn't help too much with your original question, but maybe it will give you few ideas for your paper.

    Good luck and stay safe,
    DPH

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    My old fire department used a company that billed the insurance companies. I don't remember the prices or the company's name.
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    Thanks, much appreciated..clk472

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    I work for an insurance company and we do not pay extrication charges- they basically dont fall under any of the coverages on an auto policy. We do hoever consider some haz mat clean up bills.

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    Per Illinois State Statue, We bill $125/hr a vehicle and $35/hr a firefighter for responding to incidents of non-district residents. The majority of our billings are for motor vehicle collisions and car fires.

    We generally have not had any problems with insurance companies paying these bills, except for the sub-par companies.

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    Its possible some states may have statutes for this but PA or SC do not as those are two states I have worked in. The states may say you can charge those amounts but not sure they can tell the companies that it has to be covered.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MIGCFR49
    Its possible some states may have statutes for this but PA or SC do not as those are two states I have worked in. The states may say you can charge those amounts but not sure they can tell the companies that it has to be covered.
    If the authorities call a tow truck to haul off the damaged auto you cover who gets the towing bill? How about for the ambulance that is called to carry your insured driver (or the other victims) to the hospital? To repair any incidental property damage caused by your customer?

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    Quote Originally Posted by ChristyK
    I need help with my paper. I read a few posts on here, but they are dated back in 2000. I have to write a paper for my fire admin class and I was thinking of writing it on collecting money from insurance companies when extrication is involved. What I need is to find out if some of your departments are billing ins companies for this. Or is any of you would have some good resourses I could look into regarding this. I would love to find ways of increasing revenue for depts. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks clk472
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChristyK
    I need help with my paper. I read a few posts on here, but they are dated back in 2000. I have to write a paper for my fire admin class and I was thinking of writing it on collecting money from insurance companies when extrication is involved. What I need is to find out if some of your departments are billing ins companies for this. Or is any of you would have some good resourses I could look into regarding this. I would love to find ways of increasing revenue for depts. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks clk472

    The last I heard Dayton (OH) Fire Dept. was charging for accidents. Goto www.iaff136.org and send a letter to one of the union board members. I'm sure they would be willing to help you out.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ChristyK
    I need help with my paper. I read a few posts on here, but they are dated back in 2000. I have to write a paper for my fire admin class and I was thinking of writing it on collecting money from insurance companies when extrication is involved. What I need is to find out if some of your departments are billing ins companies for this. Or is any of you would have some good resourses I could look into regarding this. I would love to find ways of increasing revenue for depts. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks clk472
    ChristyK:
    First off; don't make the mistake of billing insurance companies for extrication.
    You are billing for services rendered at a motor vehicle accident. You are billing people who pay no taxes for your services; in essence, non-residents.
    And you are billing the vehicle owner/occupant. You state very clearly in your letter that accompanies the bill that they are responsible for the payment of the bill and if they have insurance, to submit it immediately. And be prepared to take them to court for non-payment. When we turn a bill over to the attorney, his fee comes out of whatever he is able to get from them.
    In Illinois, if a DUI results in an accident, the driver can be assessed a fee of $1000 per responding agency and that is paid before anything else is. In other words, the vehicle is in impound until fee is paid. If he doesn't get his vehicle from impound, then he still owes through the court and will go to jail for non-payment.
    It isn't perfect, but it works.
    And yes; in Illinois, we are allowed to assess non-resident fees as set forth by state law.
    A search of Illinois Legal Compiled Statutes should find it for you.
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    Cool How one of my Departments does it.....

    Here is how my Paid-Call Department bills......
    If the T/C was caused by a Driver that was Under the Influence, we are able to "Cost Recover" for that incident.
    We charge per hour, per piece of equipment and for each position. I am sure that what we charge is not reasonable in your state, but on the Left Coast where the Cost of Living is a smig higher it's appropriate.
    Our Department is also a fairly large Department that has it's own Lawyers so that is not such a big hit we have to take.

    Hope this gives some light on this subject. Just like all the other subjects here, if it works for you then do it...... if not, then don't.
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    Thank you very much everyone for your input.

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    I know that Hartford, CT is now billing for extrications and also Haz-Mat runs. Not sure of the particulars.

    http://www.hartford.gov/fire/

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    Fill in the blanks.

    HI. My name is ______________

    From ______________ Fire Department.

    We see you have been in an nasty accident at _______ road and __________ road.

    Before we begin to extrictate you and ____ ( number of victims here), we would appreciate your signing of this consent form.

    I the undersigned agree that...

    1. ______________ Fire Department can scrape me and all the people out of this vehicle from the mess we are currently in.

    2. I agree, whether my insurance company does or will not pay, that I ________________ (X will do as you breath your last, or your full name) WILL pay your expense for this little oops I/We have had.

    3. In no way do I hold the ______________ fire department responsible for the truly valiant, heroic, sob, cry, efforts to rescue all of us ___ (insert victim number) from this vehicle.

    4. If I _____________ (you got it, name or X) should not make it. My family, pet goldfish, state or the Insurance Company should pay you full recompense for being out in this really naff weather.

    5. This form can be filled in by any Victim or Rescue person at the scene.
    Failure of the victim is not redemption from this form.

    Signature, or a gob of blood for forensics as appropriate.


    Signed.




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    Kiwi,

    That was great!

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