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  1. #1
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    Default West Paterson In need of gear

    Excuse me if im wrong but shouldnt this be investigated by peosha?
    http://cms.firehouse.com/content/art...Id=12&id=51326


  2. #2
    Forum Member Bones42's Avatar
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    Only if someone calls them and asks for it. PEOSHA doesn't just go running around looking for things to investigate, they have to be invited...by a Public Employee.

    And as with almost everything, I'm sure there are multiple sides to this story.
    "This thread is being closed as it is off-topic and not related to the fire industry." - Isn't that what the Off Duty forum was for?

  3. #3
    Forum Member Engine305's Avatar
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    Default Gear

    Millions of dollars in the finest apparatus doesnt mean much if the guys riding them dont have what they need. I'd rather have junk apparatus and the latest and greatest gear for my members.
    Last edited by Engine305; 09-26-2006 at 06:38 PM. Reason: more thoughts.

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    3 firehouses to cover a borough that does 337 runs a year? Perhaps consider closing one or two of the firehouses, centralizing apparatus etc., thus lowering the costs of operating. Another option, how many of the 75 firefighters are active firefighters? If it's like most places, probably 30 of them (and that's a high estimate) so you only truly need 30 sets of new gear, the remaining 45 could be pieced together with the best of the old stuff until funds can be secured for more up to date equipment.

    The borough of West Patterson is 3 Square Miles with 11,298 people. The 3 firehouses in the borough have a combined apparatus total of 4 Engines 1 Ladder and a Rescue. No wonder there is no money for gear! They're too busy attempting to maintain 3 buildings (1 firehouse per square mile??) 4 Engines a Ladder and a Rescue.

    The other side of the story here is common sense. In this day and age, consider using more mutual aid and not being so self reliant. Consider what is needed vs. what is wanted. There are many ways that money could be saved and used more wisely.

  5. #5
    Forum Member Bones42's Avatar
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    Interesting. FF's recommending the closure of firehouses.
    "This thread is being closed as it is off-topic and not related to the fire industry." - Isn't that what the Off Duty forum was for?

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    I know it's not "mainstream" or anything like that, but I really believe that people need to re-evaluate the way the fire services are set up in certain areas.

    I live in suburban Philadelphia where there are an excessive amount of firehouses and people often cry $$ woes and whatnot. There is a few extreme cases where the firehouses are so over populated you can see one firehouse from the ramp of another. This dates back to the early 1900's when there was some type of a fued and one fueding faction split off and opened their own firehouse and for the better part of the last 100 or so years, it's remained the same. That day and age is over and done with.

    In this case, a borough that does 337 runs, 3 square miles with less than 12,000 people. Does it truly need 3 firehouses and 4 engines a ladder and a rescue.

    Perhaps if they combined into one central firehouse with 2 engines a ladder and a rescue, or even 3 engines, they might save money and be able to put it towards properly equipping themselves. Maintaining three buildings is an expensive unneccessary cost in my opinion.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bones42
    Interesting. FF's recommending the closure of firehouses.
    Yea...that only shows that we, too, have some common sense at times. I've witnessed several consolidations and closings over the past few years. My own West Central Berks District has gone from 18 stations 15 years ago to 15 stations today, and I expect a few more consolidations and mergers over the next 10 or 15 years. Most of these simply eliminated redundancies and left the areas in question with better equipped (quality, not quantity) and staffed operations with lower operating costs in the long run.

    One particular case...I can remember when there were two stations with a total of four engines, two heavy rescues and two or three support units four blocks apart (but on opposite sides of a municipal line). They simply weren't both needed...and all the apparatus and equipment certainly weren't needed. I'd be willing to bet the same thing is true here, and this backs it up...

    Quote Originally Posted by FORTff
    The borough of West Patterson is 3 Square Miles with 11,298 people. The 3 firehouses in the borough have a combined apparatus total of 4 Engines 1 Ladder and a Rescue. No wonder there is no money for gear! They're too busy attempting to maintain 3 buildings (1 firehouse per square mile??) 4 Engines a Ladder and a Rescue.
    Last edited by bobsnyder; 09-27-2006 at 10:26 AM.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by FORTff
    I live in suburban Philadelphia where there are an excessive amount of firehouses and people often cry $$ woes and whatnot. There is a few extreme cases where the firehouses are so over populated you can see one firehouse from the ramp of another.
    I bet you could strategically cut the combined number of fire stations in Berks, Montgomery, Chester, Delaware and Bucks counties by something like 10 or 15 percent tomorrow and not see one bit of difference in coverage. The apparatus fleets could probably be cut by as much as 15 or 20 percent with no appreciable effect. The cuts would only be in certain areas densely populated by firehouses, not everywhere across the landscape, but it would be big numbers nevertheless. Parts of Pennsylvania are so overinvested in equipment and buildings and underinvested in personnel and training that it's just pathetic.

    I used to work near Philly in a township (which will remain nameless) that had five fire companies, none of which were more than 2 miles apart and each of which had an aerial, minimum two engines, heavy rescue and multiple squads and support units...and they were surrounded by townships that were the same way. They were so clogged with apparatus that for years each station that had the "newest" of something (newest engine, newest truck) got to hold it in reserve for a couple years and use it as a parade piece until it wasn't the "newest" anymore. I don't think this continues today, but they still have huge fleets for their tiny little run areas. Asinine, is what that is...

  9. #9
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    I'd be willing to go even further than 20% and imagine that there would be no deficit in protection.

    If, what you said happened, cutting many of the excess firehouses, selling much of the excess apparatus, using the money towards upgrading the necessary items such as training and equipment and staffing key areas with paid personnel, the quality of service would increase dramatically. This all happening with less firehouses and less apparatus.

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