1. #1
    MembersZone Subscriber

    Join Date
    Dec 2000
    Posts
    933

    Default SCBA Mounting Brackets??

    Over the last year we have purchased some new rigs and the old way of monting the SCBA's in the brackets seem to be gone. Now the new rigs do not have the clips that hold the scba in place. They are now (I will call them half brackets) designed, in order for the scba to stay in the seat, so that they must be strapped in. Is this an NFPA thing or trend going on? Are your new rigs comming this way? Are you changing them back to the old way so that they do not have to be strapped in? BTW the new rigs include a Seagrave and a couple HME/Ferrara's.

  2. #2
    Forum Member
    MemphisE34a's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Memphis, TN - USA
    Posts
    2,526

    Default

    I have been told by our shop that these new brackets are mandated by NFPA. They designed a bracket that required a strap to hold the bottle because the straps were not being used with the clip style brackets like we are used to.

    They in a word------SUCK.

    Another example of NFPA claiming to make something better, but making it worse.

    Honestly, most companies with the new brackets here are still not using the strap. Now the bottle just barely rests in the bracket and is not being held in place by a strap or a bracket.
    RK
    cell #901-494-9437

    Management is making sure things are done right. Leadership is doing the right thing. The fire service needs alot more leaders and a lot less managers.

    "Everyone goes home" is the mantra for the pussification of the modern, American fire service.


    Comments made are my own. They do not represent the official position or opinion of the Fire Department or the City for which I am employed. In fact, they are normally exactly the opposite.

  3. #3
    MembersZone Subscriber

    Join Date
    May 1999
    Location
    Here, There, Everywhere
    Posts
    4,191

    Default

    Thank you Desk Commandos!

    EHS...tried going to the local large truck salvage lot and finding a few old fire appratus and take the old brackets out for a nominal fee and install them back in your rig?

    Hell if this agrivating situation is going to become more common...I'm going to find all the brackets I can and start selling them on ebay! $$$

    FTM-PTB

  4. #4
    Forum Member
    Bones42's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2001
    Location
    Pt. Beach, NJ
    Posts
    10,688

    Default

    Anyone interested, I have about a dozen of the old brackets sitting on my floor. We have no problems with the new style.
    "This thread is being closed as it is off-topic and not related to the fire industry." - Isn't that what the Off Duty forum was for?

  5. #5
    Forum Member
    Lewiston2FF's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2000
    Location
    Niagara Falls, NY, USA
    Posts
    1,924

    Default

    Try here: http://www.ziamatic.com/1000-springclip.html

    Just did some retrofitting in our older engine, had aluminum bottles, went to carbon fiber. The retrofit was quick and easy and relatively cheap.
    Shawn M. Cecula
    Firefighter
    IACOJ Division of Fire and EMS

  6. #6
    MembersZone Subscriber

    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    Pennsylvania
    Posts
    343

    Default

    If it keeps people from getting smashed in the face with them, whats the problem? Smarter than the equipment, people.......

  7. #7
    MembersZone Subscriber

    Join Date
    May 1999
    Location
    Here, There, Everywhere
    Posts
    4,191

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by quint1officer
    If it keeps people from getting smashed in the face with them, whats the problem? Smarter than the equipment, people.......
    How many men do you know have been smashed by these flying SCBAs?

    I work with guys who have 20-25-30 and even a few with 35+ years and most have been involved in an accident before and NONE can remember ever being hit by a flying SCBA or knowing anyone who has. And this comes from making 1000s of runs every year for all those years.

    By the same reasoning we should all be wearing 5 point harnesses and helmets with neck rolls just like in Nascar...if it keeps people from getting tossed around the cab, whats the problem?

    Some of you have really lost sight of the important issues of this job.

    Keep worshiping those dopes in the NFPA if you like.

    FTM-PTB

  8. #8
    MembersZone Subscriber

    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    Pennsylvania
    Posts
    343

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by FFFRED
    How many men do you know have been smashed by these flying SCBAs?

    I work with guys who have 20-25-30 and even a few with 35+ years and most have been involved in an accident before and NONE can remember ever being hit by a flying SCBA or knowing anyone who has. And this comes from making 1000s of runs every year for all those years.

    By the same reasoning we should all be wearing 5 point harnesses and helmets with neck rolls just like in Nascar...if it keeps people from getting tossed around the cab, whats the problem?

    Some of you have really lost sight of the important issues of this job.

    Keep worshiping those dopes in the NFPA if you like.

    FTM-PTB
    I know of 5 people, personally, who were tossed about a cab, and 2 people, again personally, who suffered life changing injuries due to being smacked with a scba. Good enough?

  9. #9
    MembersZone Subscriber

    Join Date
    May 1999
    Location
    Here, There, Everywhere
    Posts
    4,191

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by quint1officer
    I know of 5 people, personally, who were tossed about a cab, and 2 people, again personally, who suffered life changing injuries due to being smacked with a scba. Good enough?
    Then if you choose you should be able to choose this option. Having a mandate forced on the rest of us seems a bit much don't you think?

    FTM-PTB

  10. #10
    Forum Member
    jlcooke3's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Aiken, SC
    Posts
    438

    Default

    Ah another fine example of legislation over discipline. If your dept has a policy that all scba's must be secured then secure them. If your ff's don't follow policy then discipline them. Don't create legislation (or in this case a NFPA standard) because you can't do your job and enforce your own dept's rules.

  11. #11
    Forum Member
    Steeda83's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Little Rhody
    Posts
    226

    Default

    you can still order the full bracket as long as the straps are still there..when we ordered new brackets they came in with the "half" brackets and we called back anded changed out the 2 pieces which made them that way with the older style yet we still use the straps

  12. #12
    Forum Member
    Bones42's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2001
    Location
    Pt. Beach, NJ
    Posts
    10,688

    Default

    We had to switch to the "half" bracket when we went down to Scott's. Their big regulator block on the side makes it so they can't sit in the full bracket well. The straps then became required because the packs would fall out of the half bracket setup. In our recessed seats, there was not enough room on top of the bracket for the "top flap" that helps hold them in. Not worried about NFPA standards for this so that is NOT why we got the straps.

    And I'll agree, I don't like getting things "mandated" for me either. Fill all your seats with seat belted FF's and there is no room for the SCBA's to come loose.
    "This thread is being closed as it is off-topic and not related to the fire industry." - Isn't that what the Off Duty forum was for?

  13. #13
    Forum Member
    Steeda83's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Little Rhody
    Posts
    226

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Bones42
    We had to switch to the "half" bracket when we went down to Scott's. Their big regulator block on the side makes it so they can't sit in the full bracket well. The straps then became required because the packs would fall out of the half bracket setup. In our recessed seats, there was not enough room on top of the bracket for the "top flap" that helps hold them in. Not worried about NFPA standards for this so that is NOT why we got the straps.

    And I'll agree, I don't like getting things "mandated" for me either. Fill all your seats with seat belted FF's and there is no room for the SCBA's to come loose.

    what kind of scott's? we've got the NxG2's in them and they're working fine

  14. #14
    Forum Member
    FyredUp's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 1999
    Location
    Rural Wisconsin, Retired from the burbs of Milwaukee
    Posts
    10,108

    Default

    We recently received a new engine with these "safety" scba brackets installed. Almost immediately plans were made to modify the brackets. We took one of the goofy brackets off and put an older style bracket in it's place. THEN, we followed it up with an SOG that says anytime an scba seat is unoccupied the safety strap will be in place. Guess what? 2 months later and no problems with following the SOG.

    Yet another example of a standard having to be written to inconvvenience the masses because FD's and line officers neither have the will nor the knowledge to enforce the rule about safety straps on the old brackets. IF your FD chose to use them.

    Like Vinnie I have NEVER heard of anyone having been involved in an accident where an scba flew around the cab after coming out of the bracket. I have just shy of 30 years on the job and instruct as well so it is not like I haven't been around and seen some things. It would seem to me that if this was an issue the answer would be to use the safety strap that has come with the scba brackets for years instead of forcing another piece of crap down on the rest of us.

    Bones I am curious as to the brand of bracket you were using that your Scotts would work in. We have had Scott 2.2's and now AP-50's and never had a problem.

    FyredUp[

  15. #15
    MembersZone Subscriber
    grains's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    Salem, Oregon
    Posts
    59

    Default

    We have an engine that was purchased new about 2 years ago. It came with the ZICO brand SCBA Bracket as seen above. We also retro fit two of our ladder trucks with them. We have found that although they are easy to deploy, restoring them can be quite a chore.

    For our new fleet we are looking at a mechanical style SCBA bracket offered by Bostrom seen here:

    http://www.hobostrom.com/en/addition...s.htm#acc_mid2

    Anybody used these? Do you like/hate them, and if so, why?
    What if the hokey pokey IS what it's all about?

    Apparatus Operator
    Salem Fire Department
    IAFF Local 314

  16. #16
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Posts
    23

    Default

    I don't know if this a little off subject, but some of the posts in this thread reminded me of a realization I had while chaperoning my son's school field trip the other day. We worry about being killed by a flying SCBA while nearly every kid in America riding a school bus is doing so with no seat belt available. That's a hell of a lot of potential little projectiles. Interesting priorities sometimes.

  17. #17
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    May 2006
    Posts
    47

    Default

    Received our KME platform a few months ago that is equipped with Ziamatic safety latches. They are poorly designed and its' hard to release the latch. We've broke the piece that attaches the rope to the latch four times. I thought I had a genious idea and replaced this piece with a round key ring that is heavily constructed. It worked great for one week until it broke the damn rope. I hope the engineer's that design the platform are better than the ones that design the safety latch. If not I predict my fat ***** will fall as a result of ladder failure.

  18. #18
    MembersZone Subscriber
    BurnCMSFD's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    Wasilla, Alaska
    Posts
    114

    Default Brackets

    We just acquired a couple of new Pierce's with these brackets. From what I understand after doing a little research one of the main reasons for the change was that people were putting there SCBA on and thinking they were secure, and not wearing there seat belt (false sense of security). And it is somewhat a valid point, as I am sure some of you would agree. We were informed we could put one clamp on to hold the pack in place, yet we havent accomplished this task yet. And the other valid point is that the cylinders are secured from dislodging which is mentioned above.

    We have only pulled a few of the ropes out so far.

    One thing that I believe are a great improvement are the seat belts, they are easier to fasten, the reciever is stiff and visible. This is the one thing that is lacking in almost all the apparatus we have, we all know we need to wear seat belts, but the majority of them are not user friendly. I believe someone could make a killing installing the new style seat belts in older apparatus.

    Its all about Safety, and 'Everbody going home'. Dont think the NFPA is just picking on us everyone who works in a craft trade are being introduced to new safety challenges everyday, safety is something that will continue to make our daily task change throughout our future, some we will agree with and somethings we wont, But when one persons life was saved because of this it was well worth it! Agree?

    Burn
    Burn<br />LT/EMT/Inst />Central Mat-Su FD<br />Wasilla Alaska

  19. #19
    Forum Member
    Bones42's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2001
    Location
    Pt. Beach, NJ
    Posts
    10,688

    Default

    45 minute AP50's. Block kept hitting the bracket and twisting the pack around. The brackets are Zicomatic's. We were able to purchase the half clamps and remove the full clamps from the existing brackets.
    "This thread is being closed as it is off-topic and not related to the fire industry." - Isn't that what the Off Duty forum was for?

  20. #20
    former FH.com member

    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    860

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by grains
    For our new fleet we are looking at a mechanical style SCBA bracket offered by Bostrom seen here:

    http://www.hobostrom.com/en/addition...s.htm#acc_mid2

    Anybody used these? Do you like/hate them, and if so, why?
    I hate to say it but the mechanical ones are even MORE of a pain in the *** than the halfbracket/strap design. It's a struggle to get the damn things to clamp right, and even then they sometimes work themselves open when the apparatus is in motion. I miss the old brackets.

  21. #21
    MembersZone Subscriber
    grains's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    Salem, Oregon
    Posts
    59

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by SAFD46Truck
    I hate to say it but the mechanical ones are even MORE of a pain in the *** than the halfbracket/strap design. It's a struggle to get the damn things to clamp right, and even then they sometimes work themselves open when the apparatus is in motion. I miss the old brackets.
    OK, great information.

    What model of SCBA are you using? We have ISI Vikings, so I'm curious if there are problems like I've been reading with specific brands, or if it is across the board.

    Thanks,

    Greg
    What if the hokey pokey IS what it's all about?

    Apparatus Operator
    Salem Fire Department
    IAFF Local 314

  22. #22
    former FH.com member

    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    860

    Default

    Scott AP-50's with the 45 min bottle.

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Similar Threads

  1. Stokes Mounting Brackets
    By FORTff in forum Firefighters Forum
    Replies: 10
    Last Post: 06-09-2006, 10:13 AM
  2. Ziamatic Walkaway SCBA brackets
    By StamSO in forum Apparatus Innovation
    Replies: 7
    Last Post: 01-23-2006, 09:34 AM
  3. Zico "Quic-Hold" SCBA Brackets
    By BlitzfireSolo in forum Apparatus Innovation
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: 07-26-2005, 03:25 AM
  4. SCBA Brackets and Corn-Binder Cabs
    By jaybird210 in forum Apparatus Innovation
    Replies: 11
    Last Post: 11-15-2003, 01:33 PM
  5. Civilian Fire Fatalities
    By DCFF in forum Firefighters Forum
    Replies: 38
    Last Post: 02-08-2002, 08:18 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts

Log in

Click here to log in or register