1. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by doughesson
    Having been arrested,charged and convicted of misdemeanor assault myself for aiming a shotgun at two people who tried hitting me with a claw hammer,I can relate to that.
    The judge said he wanted to make sure that I never pointed a weapon,loaded or unloaded as mine was,at anyone ever again.
    So,if I am ever faced with a decision like that again,will I freeze remembering Judge Craft's words and get killed or will I decide if I'm going to get hanged,might as well be as a goat instead of a sheep and start pulling the trigger even after my assailants change their minds about killing me and turn to run for their lives?
    Here's hoping I never again have to face that choice.
    So, what this judge was saying was "don't bring a gun to a hammer fight?" What a moron. What ever happened to self defense?

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    You are either a sheep or a sheep dog. I for one am a sheep dog and when I got on the job my father told me the same thing before my first deployment to an overseas "humanitarian" mission compliments of Bill Clinton. "Don't think, react first and I will spend my last dime defending you if they say it was wrong."

    Let's also not forget that France's best military unit is comprised mostly of foreigners...."The French Foreign Legion."


    France vs. Germany 0 - 2.
    Last edited by ALSfirefighter; 11-29-2006 at 09:56 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by wombat
    Looking from outside USA it looks like you guys are just practising the same kind of democracy you are forcing on the good folks of Iraq or Afganistan.
    Start acting like a third world country and you will soon be one.

    Downunder they would by in deep **** if they used a fire arm without being in direct threat from another fire arm just like any other civilised country.
    One of the local boys used his pistol to put down a kangaroo injured in a road accident. Paperwork was enough to get him from ever thinking of doing this again.

    Another mate was patrolling embassies and consulates in Canberra a couple of years ago. At the US ambasadors private residence in a rural area of Canberra the mate hears gunshots from the rear. Probably roo shooters.
    Calls for help, fits flack jacket and armed with a 9mm Glock pistol goes in search of roo shooters. Fortunately roo shooters disappear extra quick. In retrospect roo shooters were lucky US enforcement officers were not guarding the US ambassador.

    Jesus H christ - Steve Irwin really was all Australia had going for it! Guess their screwed now.

  4. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by STONEREMS
    Jesus H christ - Steve Irwin really was all Australia had going for it! Guess their screwed now.

    Basically it comes down to "Differ'nt Strokes for Differ'nt Folks". In Britain, most cops (unless things changed recently) dont even carry a firearm of any sort. Out this way (Canada included) we still have a bit of the Ol'e Wild West thing going on.

    So what I am basically getting at here, is that just because something works in Your Sandbox, doesn't neccessarily mean it will or does work in someone else's. Also, its not really cool to criticize another Country's domestic law enforcement policies, just because they differ from your own. There is an old saying that I am going to paraphrase slightly:

    (North) America was forged on Smith and Wesson. {Or something like that - been a long time since I heard it last.}
    Last edited by MalahatTwo7; 11-30-2006 at 10:15 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by MalahatTwo7
    Basically it comes down to "Differ'nt Strokes for Differ'nt Folks". In Britain, most cops (unless things changed recently) dont even carry a firearm of any sort. Out this way (Canada included) we still have a bit of the Ol'e Wild West thing going on.

    So what I am basically getting at here, is that just because something works in Your Sandbox, doesn't neccessarily mean it will or does work in someone else's. Also, its not really cool to criticize another Country's domestic law enforcement policies, just because they differ from your own. There is an old saying that I am going to paraphrase slightly:

    (North) America was forged on Smith and Wesson. {Or something like that - been a long time since I heard it last.}
    I think you should have quoted WOMBAT in your post....I dont beleive everything is says is accurate - I have never heard of nay Embassy personnel ever being protected by foreign nationals - its usually a detail the beloved Corp gets.

    Folks such as Wombat love to bash the USA - until they need us to save thier arse.

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    Internal protection is a wee bit different to external / perimiter protection in "friendly" countries Stonerems.

    Travel a wee bit and you would know this to be so.

    Basically Wombat is on his own as far as his opinions go.

    Have you EVER seen a Wombat.

    This is from an Australian Government web site about Wombats.

    It is a fairly large, solidly built animal with a squat, round, bearlike body, small ears and eyes, and a large naked nose. Its thick, coarse fur varies in colour from sandy brown to grey and black, and is sometimes flecked with fawn. Often their true colour is obscured by the colour of the dirt or clay in which they have been digging.
    I rest my case.
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    Quote Originally Posted by FlyingKiwi
    Internal protection is a wee bit different to external / perimiter protection in "friendly" countries Stonerems.

    Travel a wee bit and you would know this to be so.

    Basically Wombat is on his own as far as his opinions go.

    Have you EVER seen a Wombat.

    This is from an Australian Government web site about Wombats.



    I rest my case.
    Fat little turds arent they.....its not the same as the wombat hat Kevin Costner wore in 3000 miles to Graceland - Go Wombats!

  8. #33
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    I have never heard of nay Embassy personnel ever being protected by foreign nationals - its usually a detail the beloved Corp gets.
    Around here anyhow, each Embassy has its own MP's (or equivilant) for building/internal security. However as has been noted by me on two or three occasions now, when some dork leaves his lunch bag in the Plaza next to the Embassy, or the construction site next door has a major gas leak, Secret Service Geeks just kinda "pop up" all around us. And they always seem mighty interested in whats going on. HOWEVER, I am not aware of any of them acutally entering the Embassy without invitation.

    Also, Canada has the distinction (if you want to use that word) of not having a Marine Corps, or equivilant. So for all external (out of country) security, we post MP's in.
    If you don't do it RIGHT today, when will you have time to do it over? (Hall of Fame basketball player/coach John Wooden)

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    Get it up. Get it on. Get it done!

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    Quote Originally Posted by MalahatTwo7
    Also, Canada has the distinction (if you want to use that word) of not having a Marine Corps, or equivilant. So for all external (out of country) security, we post MP's in.
    Not a distinction - just a lapse in judgement.


    You are right. In many nations, the Marines stationed at an embassy are responsible for internal security. There are usually guards from the guest nation's forces that secure the perimeter - witness the actions in Jordan earlier this Fall when access was attempted under fire to enter the United States Embassy. Jordanian military responded in kind to a hostile threat, losing at least one service member.
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    NY POST ARTICLE:

    December 1, 2006 -- EVER since he was a kid, this cop dreamed of joining the NYPD. Now, a burning building looks more inviting.

    "Whatever we do, we're damned," said the officer, who plans to apply to the Fire Department.

    At this critical moment in our city's history, when we need firm leadership and a level head, our clueless mayor has chosen to act like a rank amateur.

    He's handed the reins of this city to the likes of Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson, the dilettante civil-rights leader who parachutes in whenever a Hollywood star utters a racial slur or a New York City cop shoots his gun.

    Under the spell of these men, Mayor Bloomberg has already declared that the fatal police shooting of Sean Bell - still under investigation and with many questions unanswered - was no mistake.

    The city's chief executive has all but declared it a crime.

    "Excessive," Bloomberg termed the episode, a word that echoed from 1 Police Plaza to your local precinct.

    "There is no evidence that they [Bell and friends] were doing anything wrong," he also said - implying that all evidence has already been collected.

    And then, the city's de facto commander-in-chief - the man the police commissioner and all cops answer to - said his remarks were those of a "civilian." What?

    Now, an energized Mayor Sharpton is ramping up the rhetoric. He declared, "We will be shopping for justice while people go shopping for the holidays!"

    These cops don't stand a chance.

    The tragic death of Sean Bell, on the eve of his wedding, absolutely deserves a thorough review. Among the questions that should be answered in the coming days is - why were 50 shots fired at the car he was driving?

    Reports so far suggest the cops had reason to fear for their lives - rightly or wrongly. Maybe they panicked. Or perhaps their fear was justified. This is why we have investigations.

    But to call it a crime is premature at best. And reckless at worst.

    "We go out there every day and we make a difference," another city cop said to me. His stress was evident - this man should not have to protest so much. Deep in their hearts, Sharpton and Bloomberg know it is true.

    But with Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson in charge, the truth doesn't stand a chance. And neither does this city.

    andrea.peyser@nypost.com

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    MIKE PLAYS RIGHT INTO THE HANDS OF RACE-BAITER AL

    NY POST ARTICLE:

    November 28, 2006 -- YESTERDAY, a Latino reporter asked Mayor Bloomberg why he had surrounded himself solely with African-Americans at a press conference to discuss the horrible police shooting incident in Queens. Why were there no Latinos present?

    The question elicited a gasp-inducing explanation from the mayor: There were no Latinos on the stage with him, Bloomberg said, because he had only "invited elected officials and clergy from that community" in Queens - the community near the site of the shooting.

    Oh? Perhaps my eyes deceived me, but hadn't he, only a few minutes earlier, walked into the press conference with the Rev. Al Sharpton - whose church is in Harlem, in Manhattan, far away from the South Jamaica "community?"

    Al is from one kind of "community," all right - the community of race-baiting cop haters who emerge whenever a tragic incident allows them to pick up a megaphone and seek to promote racial discord for fun, profit and media attention.

    And here is the mayor, treating this vicious miscreant who has done more to inflame tensions between the races in this city than anyone in modern history as a credible participant in a dialogue intended to reduce racial tensions.

    And lest you think Sharpton has changed and grown and matured, consider what he was doing only hours after the shooting - commandeering press attention, screaming through a megaphone, doing his best to take a potentially explosive situation and pour kerosene on it in hopes that he might get some light flashed on him from the resulting fire.

    That's Sharpton. He can lose weight and wear a nicer suit, but he's still the same rabble-rouser he always was.

    The question is, just what the hell is Bloomberg doing?

    The mayor said one astounding thing after another during his press conference yesterday. At one moment he waxed embarrassingly philosophical, opining that "no one can imagine what it would be like to be of a different ethnicity."

    Oh, really, Mr. Mayor? I imagine that people of a different ethnicity from mine might, for example, bleed when they are shot just as I would, or love their children just as much as I love mine, or would feel grief-stricken to have a family member shot to death on the day of his wedding.

    www.nypost.com/seven/1128...horetz.htm

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    A Recap of Shooting Rhetoric So Far
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    A sampling from the media so far...
    --------------------------------------------------------------
    "These cops need to go to jail for the rest of their lives," Councilman Charles Barron said at rally today. "This is murder."
    --------------------------------------------------------------
    "They didn't kill him because they knew his name. They killed him because he was black," a man at the rally said.
    --------------------------------------------------------------
    "All those brothers in the NYC police department, they need to look at this here and say, 'Hey, that could have been my son,'" one man at the rally today said.
    --------------------------------------------------------------
    "I have a feeling that this case is going to be a watershed case like Diallo and Louima," Sharpton said. "This is going to be a watershed on the vice squad and undercover policing."
    --------------------------------------------------------------
    "I'm going to keep this in the street," Sharpton said.
    --------------------------------------------------------------
    "It's still Giuliani time," said Barron, who called for Police Commissioner Ray Kelly's removal. "The mayor will say he's sorry. He'll show up to funerals. But he doesn't change policy. Don't ask me to be peaceful when they are the ones being murderers."
    --------------------------------------------------------------
    "We cannot allow this to continue to happen," Sharpton said at the gathering outside Mary Immaculate Hospital, where one of the wounded men was in critical condition. "We've got to understand that all of us were in that car."
    --------------------------------------------------------------
    The police officers' group 100 Blacks in Law Enforcement Who Care said it was issuing a vote of no confidence in Kelly over the shooting.
    --------------------------------------------------------------
    On Sunday, the group 100 Blacks in Law Enforcement joined that outcry...The head of the group, Noel Leader, said the organization accuses Kelly of “turning a blind eye to what they call a rising wave of police brutality in black communities.”
    --------------------------------------------------------------
    "I am fed up. I am not asking my people to do anything passive anymore," said Brooklyn City Councilman Charles Barron. "We're going to sit here and we're going to go in there. We're going to pray. We're going to march. We're going to do all of that stuff and then we're going to sit down. And then if they don't respond to none of that, then don't ask us to ask our people to be peaceful while they are being murdered. We are not the only ones that can bleed."
    --------------------------------------------------------------
    Surrounded by supporters, Sharpton said, "The city must show moral outrage." He alleged that some of the undercover officers at the scene were drinking.
    --------------------------------------------------------------
    Mayor Michael Bloomberg emerged from a meeting with the police commissioner and community leaders Monday and said that it seemed like "excessive force was used"
    --------------------------------------------------------------
    "I can tell you that it is to me unacceptable or inexplicable how you can have 50-odd shots fired, but that's up to the investigation to find out what really happened," Bloomberg said at a news conference after the meeting.
    --------------------------------------------------------------
    Of the victims, Bloomberg said Monday: "There is no evidence that they were doing anything wrong."
    --------------------------------------------------------------
    Rangel said this weekend's shooting "reminds me of a tragedy that took place with Mr. Diallo. And we can't have that. We can't have that."
    --------------------------------------------------------------
    At Jamaica Hospital, where Bell died, Sharpton declared, "Police do not have the right to be the judge, jury and executioners."
    --------------------------------------------------------------
    And the fiancée's mom, Laura Harper-Paultre, accused cops of killing Bell "in cold blood," adding, "Cops are very comfortable killing black men."
    --------------------------------------------------------------
    Bell's mom, Valerie, said cops hadn't told her anything about the shooting. "They're covering up, because they know the police did wrong," she charged. "You know how society works. They label all African-American men the same.
    --------------------------------------------------------------
    Charles Barron: "this is like a powder keg out here and our community is about to explode."
    --------------------------------------------------------------
    Charles Barron: "if there is no justice there is going to be an explosion in this town."
    --------------------------------------------------------------
    Charles Barron: "they (NYPD) don't kill white people."
    --------------------------------------------------------------
    Edward Williams (NAACP): "We don't expect to allow this to be another Amadou Diallo case and just move the venue and just let folks walk. We don't expect that, but if they do, they will hear from all over the city like they've never heard before."
    --------------------------------------------------------------
    ROCCO PARASCANDOLA of Newsday: The shots were fired within 10 to 15 seconds, police sources said, adding that it would appear to be a violation of the training police officers received.
    --------------------------------------------------------------
    Newsday: Having the mayor acknowledge yesterday that firing 50 shots was "excessive and unacceptable" probably also helped diffuse some of the anger from community leaders.
    --------------------------------------------------------------
    "This mayor has better manners than his predecessors," Sharpton said. "Let's see if we have better policy."
    --------------------------------------------------------------
    NT Times by DIANE CARDWELL and SEWELL CHAN: Some policies appear to have been violated in the shooting, which occurred when, according to the police, undercover officers fired 50 bullets at Mr. Bell’s car after he drove into one of the officers and an unmarked police van.
    --------------------------------------------------------------
    NT Times by DIANE CARDWELL and SEWELL CHAN: Officers are trained to shoot no more than three bullets before pausing to reassess the situation, Mr. Kelly said in his most detailed assessment of the shooting yet. Department policy also largely prohibits officers from firing at vehicles, even when they are being used as weapons.
    --------------------------------------------------------------
    “There were some heated exchanges,” said the Rev. Herbert Daughtry, an influential Pentecostal minister in Brooklyn. “We all agree that there is a pattern of police abuse of power, and this abuse of power ranges from police killing to police brutal behavior to disrespect.
    --------------------------------------------------------------
    Mr. Daughtry warned the mayor not to confuse patience with complacency. “There is a temperature in our communities that is rising, and the tension is intensifying,” he said. “While we don’t want to try to ignite anything, we’d be blind to overlook what’s happening and not to sound the alarm.”
    --------------------------------------------------------------
    Saying there was a “grave crisis” of confidence in his southeast Queens community, Bishop Lester Williams, who was to have performed Mr. Bell’s wedding, said there had been no improvement in police-community relations since the height of tensions under Mayor Giuliani. “It’s Little Iraq, I’m sorry, especially toward the blacks in the community,” he said before attending the meeting. “We don’t feel protected.”
    --------------------------------------------------------------
    Mr. Claxton is a spokesman for the group 100 Blacks in Law Enforcement Who Care, which has criticized the shooting and raised questions about alcohol consumption on the job, suggesting that officers involved in shootings should undergo medical evaluations to test alcohol levels.
    --------------------------------------------------------------
    NY Times Editorial: The first bullet came from an officer with five years on the job, and the detective who fired the 31 rounds had 12. But it is hard to explain their actions as anything but panic.
    --------------------------------------------------------------
    NY Times Editorial: Police rules mandate that an officer pause after firing three rounds to assess the situation. If the shooters had followed procedures, they might have seen there was no threat before it was too late. Mayor Bloomberg has rightly called for a quick and impartial investigation. The officers must be held accountable for what has happened.
    --------------------------------------------------------------
    Newday Editorial: Here we go again. New York City police unleashed a barrage of 50 shots Saturday, killing an unarmed black man on his wedding day.
    --------------------------------------------------------------
    Newday Editorial: But something is horribly wrong when police kill unarmed people. That's just not supposed to happen. And when it does, the victims are too often racial minorities.
    --------------------------------------------------------------
    Newday Editorial: As Bloomberg said yesterday, it's "inexplicable and unacceptable" for cops to fire 50 rounds at unarmed men.
    --------------------------------------------------------------
    Bell's fiancee, Nicole Paultre, told hip-hop radio station Power 105.1 on Monday that the people who shot him shouldn't be called officers. ``They were murderers, murderers,'' she said. ``They were not officers.
    --------------------------------------------------------------
    NY Daily News Editorial: As the evidence is now known, the shooting was a marked aberration from the professionalism and restraint displayed daily by the NYPD - and one based on an unusual confluence of misapprehensions.
    --------------------------------------------------------------
    NY Daily News Editorial: In the first instance, the NYPD patrol guide generally forbids firing on a moving vehicle, and in the second instance, it is inconceivable that the officer who fired 31 times had a solid grasp of whom or what he was shooting at. A cardinal rule of the department says cops should reassess their targets after firing three rounds.
    --------------------------------------------------------------

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    December 1, 2006 -- Hypocrisy, thy name is Sharpton.

    And Barron.

    Jackson, too.

    There they were this week, the Ubiquitous Three, comforting the grieving family of Sean Bell - a black man shot dead in Queens by police - for at least as long as the TV cameras lingered.

    What a contrast to the scene in Brooklyn Federal Court, where one Ronell Wilson is on trial in the 2003 murders of NYPD Detectives James Nemorin and Rodney Andrews.

    No Al Sharpton there.

    No Charles Barron.

    No Jesse Jackson.

    The two detectives had been working undercover to break up a gun-running gang operating out of a Staten Island housing project. Then a gun-buy went disastrously bad, their cover blown - and they were shot dead on the spot.

    Nemorin and Andrews, as it happened, were black.

    They died heroes in an effort to keep illegal guns out of a virtually all-black Staten Island housing project.

    That is to say, to save black lives.

    Nemorin left a wife and three children.

    Andrews, a wife and two kids.

    Their families grieved no less than the survivors of Sean Bell.

    But without Sharpton.

    Without Barron.

    Without Jackson.

    No visit paid.

    Not a word of condolence.

    Nor has any of the three attended the Wilson trial.

    This is not surprising, for two reasons:

    * To do so would show a modicum of derivative respect for the NYPD.

    * And there are no media cameras in that particular courtroom.

    So what would be the point?

    Sharpton and Barron and Jackson care only about certain dead black people.

    They care only about tragedies that present opportunities to sow rancor, and to advance their personal agendas.

    This is not news, of course, but it is worth pointing out that the fatherless children of hero cops need a hug, too.

    Not that Sharpton or Barron or Jackson gives a damn.

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    Jesus Wombat.... didn't you ever learn not to pour scorn on the Americans over their Country.... I have had to scan this thread for any hint of Anti British sentiment that may be linked to the close ties we have...thankfully there was none. So we can all exist in peace. Becuase no one moans like a ****ed off Brit!!

    As for the story.....

    I Have every sympathy with the Cops....almost every god forsaekn Town and City in the UK is plagued with crime and lawlessness.... and no although our Cops still don't 'officially' carry guns, there are now a hell of a lot of armed undercover cops and 'Trojan' units....Marked Gun cars.

    People think they can treat my Country like the f*****g dustbin of Europe.... make a fortune from the vast wealth that is available in the UK, pay nothing into the system and treat the law and customs of this Great Nation as if they were something they trod in.

    But.....as soon as one of the scum gets arrested or worse, is fool enough to pull a gun on an armed cop....the whole Liberal world is screaming 'Foul play' and trying to bash us, bash the system, bash the cops.... that is bullsh1t.

    I Have fought fires in the Ghettos of East London for 20 years...I know what it is REALLY like, I know how the slimey unbelly of life really operates...these people think nothing of killing each other or innocent passers-by. My own Station is in a stretch of road known as 'Murder Mile' due to the shootings and in my Office there is a newspaper clip on the noticeboard proclaiming;
    OFFICAIL: HACKNEY IS MORE DANGEROUS THAN SOWETO!!

    My Point, lots of us Brits want to head to Australia for the better life, my Brother-in law lives there and you all say how wonderful it is...I belive it all. Life in Australia sounds great...you don't have the issues we have to deal with in the inner cities of the UK and USA...it is easy for you to make comments on the mistakes made by the NYPD, but unfair. Sitting at your PC reading the story is one thing....how would you have reacted had you have been one of the Cops? I can guess I would have been shooting fairly rapidlu once it came on top.

    We have the same every time a cop draws a gun here...OK, the prro KId from Brazil got shot last year as a suspected Suicide Bomber... a tragedy, even though he did run. But now, becuase the same Armed Police team were involved in another shooting...of an armed robber...all the liberals, and the Brazilian's family are calling for their heads. WTF has it got to do with them...and exactly how good is their own Countries record on Human rights???

    As for the attack on the Yanks...I think they have had 'two cents worth' with you....I don't need say anymore.
    Steve Dude
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    'Irony'... It's a British thing.

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    FFRED--Thanks for kicking up my BP this morning

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    Quote Originally Posted by SteveDude
    People think they can treat my Country like the f*****g dustbin of Europe.... make a fortune from the vast wealth that is available in the UK, pay nothing into the system and treat the law and customs of this Great Nation as if they were something they trod in.
    Such is the lot when a nation chooses to become Socialist. It will only get worse with the EU gaining more power and destroying individual nation's sovereignty.

    As the old saying (and a damned good song) goes: You ain't seen nothing yet.
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    Quote Originally Posted by wombat
    One of the local boys used his pistol to put down a kangaroo injured in a road accident. Paperwork was enough to get him from ever thinking of doing this again.
    This got me courious on when you can shoot a roo. Seems farmers dont like em very much.

    Shooting a Kangaroo - Code Compliance

    http://www.deh.gov.au/biodeversity/t...eport/cop.html

    So is kangaroo Harvesting for population control or for the grill?

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    Thanks for the updates Fred. I offer best wishes to all involved up there on this one. What a suck way to spend the holdiays - looking over your shoulder wondering if your "Elected Politicians" (if I may use that phrase?) are going to cover your back when you need it most. Gotta love it when the "Boss" says Ya, go out there and do your jobs, men. Just dont arrest or shoot anyone. Ok? {Ya right, thanks Chief.}
    If you don't do it RIGHT today, when will you have time to do it over? (Hall of Fame basketball player/coach John Wooden)

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  19. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Catch22
    So, what this judge was saying was "don't bring a gun to a hammer fight?" What a moron. What ever happened to self defense?
    The one waving the hammer around was my female roommate and the persecutor wanted to be the first on his block to get a conviction under the new domestic violence acts which as of 3-31-95 still hadn't been signed into law by then President Clinton.
    As to the Judge,he's sawed off little runt that has no concept of self defense or anything pertaining to firearms.Thus,he is beneath my contempt.

  20. #45
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    In a way,I cannot wait until the Democrats take their newly ordained offices and learn the truth about whether or not the US has been running secret prisons in other countries to torture POWs from Afghanistan and Iraq.
    Somehow I doubt that we are unless there's a lot of intelligence services too stupid to find out about it.
    Another wonder is would they bray it to the Heavens if they did learn we were or would they keep it a secret for later revelation?

  21. #46
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    An article from Sun. NY Post by,

    Adam Brodsky
    City Councilwoman Heleh Foster says, point blank, that Sean Bell's death was a "racist act." Councilman Al Vann bemoans "institutional racism." Councilman Barron, taking the prize for recklessness, insists blacks "are being murdered," by cops. What repugnant lies.
    Racism almost certainly was not a factor in the tragic gunfire that left the 23-year old groom dead. But race definitely was.
    Start with the fact that every cop surely knows; While the victim of an accidental police shooting is likely to be black, so too is the perp when cops are killed.
    Of 21 NYPD officers shot to death in the line of duty since 19914, police records show that 14 (67%) were killed by African Americans, four (19( percent by Hispanics and three ( 14 percent by whites. (In one other case the killers included one Black and five Hispanics.)
    And yes NY cops do confront blacks more than they do whites. But thats because blacks are disproportionately involved in crime- both as perps and victims.
    Even the Rev. Jesse Jackson admitted that in walking city streets, he worries more about groups of black youths than white ones.
    Two decades ago, then Police Comm. Ben Ward- who was black- made the point more bluntly(even citing the very area where Bell was killed): Young , black men,Ward said are ripping off the neighborhoods. They are doing the shooting out in southeast Queens and killing innocent people.
    Crime's way down since then but the racial breakdowns haven't changed much. African Americans, about 25% ofNew Yorkers, account for 60 % of the city's crime victims so far this year, an NYPD analysis last month. And more than 60% pf perpetrators in murder cases were black (93% were male.)
    For each of the past three years, NYPD records show, nine of every 10 crime victims citywide were either African Americans or Hispanic.
    So were a similar percentage of perps.
    With police responding to more crimes involving blacks, there are more opportunities for police abuse of blacks-including (rare) accidental shootings.
    (Again, blacks also benefit disproportionately when cops do their jobs; the vast drop in New York City homicides over the past decade has saved the lives of mostlt blacks and minotities.)
    Lets face it: To fight crime,cops must go to the areas where it occurs. A disproportionate number of police operations, like responding to calls, take place in minority communities.
    The Kalua Cabaret, for instance, where the Bell tragedy started, is in a largely black neighborhood,- and is heavily patronized by blacks. NYPD officials note that cops were called to the scene 26 times in the past 12 months.
    Persumably, most of the calls were black.
    The point is that if cops are going to protect the city- if they are going to respond to calls from blacks as well as whites-then inevitably they are going to come into contact with more African Americans than with other folks
    And greater contact breeds greater potential for conflict- and for tragedies, like that of Sean Bell-even as blacks also gain from the crime averted.
    How unfortunate that racial activists mislead folks about the resons for confrontations-insisting that police actions are often not just ill-motivated, but illegal.
    If black leaders really want to cut down on wrongful killings in their community, one idea might be to focus more on stanching crime.
    Steering more young black men into legal, productive lives would not only give these youths more hopeful futures, it would also reduce the number of interactions with cops and, thus, the opportunities for disaster.
    Of course, curbing crime means helping cops- not attacking them.
    A first step mighht be to stop calling them "murderers."

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