Thread: Videos

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    BLEVE: lots of booms

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wcmmLvAYqkI

    Flashover/Smoke Explosion? Also shows good example of evacuation signal by the engine man.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=15VxYzzjpKM

    Really big Flashover: German Grocery Store

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Io15LR6XTJI&NR

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    Lots of idiots on the roof without airpacks.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fgG9C...elated&search=
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    how not to heel a ladder: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0cNIKEX9mmQ

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    after watching those videos, was just wondering how many people actually place there ladder between electric lines? or right underneath them? thought that was kind of a dangerous action

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    Yet more examples of why not to operate on a peaked roof. How a bout taking the windows in the attic? And yes, if you have a TL you use it under the wires, most likely they are telephone and cable that low on the pole 99% of the time they are. Atleast in Con Ed country i.e. NY State

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    Quote Originally Posted by dragonfyre View Post
    Lots of idiots on the roof without airpacks.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fgG9C...elated&search=
    Yeah those guys took quite the feed.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jonnyirons2 View Post
    Yet more examples of why not to operate on a peaked roof. How a bout taking the windows in the attic? And yes, if you have a TL you use it under the wires, most likely they are telephone and cable that low on the pole 99% of the time they are. Atleast in Con Ed country i.e. NY State
    I don't see why that's an example of why not to vent a peaked roof? I'm assuming it's not a truss roof, looks like an older house and they probably wouldn't have been up there if it was. However, that's a pretty large, open attic space. They opened the roof, limited the horizontal spread of fire, vented some heat and smoke, and made it much easier for the line inside.

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    Quote Originally Posted by HalliganHook111 View Post
    I'm assuming and they probably
    That's how people get hurt, with assumptions and probabilities.
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    111 youre not from 111 so Ill explain my answer. FDNY does not operate on peaked roof's because of the dangers involved in it. I never knew the reasons cause our books dont say why, so I asked one of the Chiefs who has 28 years on the job. Simply stated, its just not worth it. Our main job is to protect life, then property. OUR lives are always at stake, why risk it anymore than it has to be. That fire was burning for quite sometime, it doesnt get dark in 6 minutes anywhere in the world, that was edited for time obviously. We all love to save peoples possesions but a fire that ends up blowing through the roof when its vented is already in an advanced state, and it was plain to see to the viewer that cutting from the Aerial was not doing much, so switching to the ground ladder was the next move. All the surronding depts of NYC do this, why I have no idea. We vent roofs for top floor fires on FLAT or SLIGHTLY pitched roofs. If its done from a TL bucket on a peaked roof youre to be secured with the life saving rope, its in Ladders 6 if im not mistaken. Im as gung ho as the next guy, but its just not worth getting killed for nothing!

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    Also that house was a 1 and a half story cape, the attic may be long, but if it wasnt dormered you would have a tough time walking around unless you were 5 feet tall, kind of like every house in Nassau from the 40's and 50's

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    That second video was a flashover not a smoke explosion/backdraft. There was no rapid expansion of smoke. just my thoughts on that first post.
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    Quote Originally Posted by dragonfyre View Post
    Lots of idiots on the roof without airpacks.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fgG9C...elated&search=
    I guess that makes the entire Chicago Fire Department idiots. We walk peaked roofs and open them up all the time. The roofmen never wear airpacks. Just because you don't understand the reason for something or don't do it wherever you work at does not make it wrong. You need to get out more.

    One thing we don't do is use a saw on a peaked roof. Axe only.
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    I gave reasons for doing it, didnt say I never did. Either you get tough Enginemen like we have here in NY or you risk someones health and safety for minimal relief of conditions on the fire floor.

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    Quote Originally Posted by dragonfyre View Post
    Lots of idiots on the roof without airpacks.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fgG9C...elated&search=
    WTF!!!! I mean WTF!!!!

    It got dark, it got dark and they were still ****ing about with a house fire!!!

    Get in there, get into the loft, put the fire out, remove a few tiles if you need to, check it is cool and go home. Christ. I've seen Factory Fires put out quicker than that!!!!
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    Quote Originally Posted by jonnyirons2 View Post
    I gave reasons for doing it, didnt say I never did. Either you get tough Enginemen like we have here in NY or you risk someones health and safety for minimal relief of conditions on the fire floor.
    I guess the appropriate answer to this would be for you to grow a pair and get on the roof - sissy. But I wasn't talking to you. You have given me the reasons you don't work peaked roofs in the past. I was responding to Dragonfyre - so you can ignore the sissy comment.
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    Quote Originally Posted by fire0099881 View Post
    after watching those videos, was just wondering how many people actually place there ladder between electric lines? or right underneath them? thought that was kind of a dangerous action
    Which video are you talking about?

    The video from Germany did you see the ff's gear smoking at the end?Thats no good!

    The video with the guy falling off the ladder the officer holding the ladder ( thats what it appeared to me) needs to have his *** kicked! WTF OVER!?
    Way to look out for your people! BE SAFE
    Last edited by dday05; 12-24-2006 at 05:47 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jonnyirons2 View Post
    111 youre not from 111 so Ill explain my answer. FDNY does not operate on peaked roof's because of the dangers involved in it. I never knew the reasons cause our books dont say why, so I asked one of the Chiefs who has 28 years on the job. Simply stated, its just not worth it. Our main job is to protect life, then property. OUR lives are always at stake, why risk it anymore than it has to be. That fire was burning for quite sometime, it doesnt get dark in 6 minutes anywhere in the world, that was edited for time obviously. We all love to save peoples possesions but a fire that ends up blowing through the roof when its vented is already in an advanced state, and it was plain to see to the viewer that cutting from the Aerial was not doing much, so switching to the ground ladder was the next move. All the surronding depts of NYC do this, why I have no idea. We vent roofs for top floor fires on FLAT or SLIGHTLY pitched roofs. If its done from a TL bucket on a peaked roof youre to be secured with the life saving rope, its in Ladders 6 if im not mistaken. Im as gung ho as the next guy, but its just not worth getting killed for nothing!
    No Jonny, I'm not from the Nut House or FDNY nor have I ever claimed to be. I disagree with not cutting peaked roofs IF the fire condition warrants in the attic or a victorian type ballon type home with fire in the walls/attic. Of course I would never cut a lightweight truss roof without the support of a bucket or aerial ladder. By the way, the late (and great) Tom Brennan was all for cutting peaked roofs of ballon framed buildings when conditions warranted.

    BTW, your posts almost make it seem like the FDNY does not operate in an aggressive manner. Although I DO know that the FDNY is very aggressive that's why it's suprising why the whole "safety" factor gets thrown at cutting peaked roofs. If you lose the attic of a dwelling, you will probably lose the whole house by the time it's all said and done.

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    Good Videos...... On the truck, We take the roof only if we have to. We dont vent above the fire unless we have to. We have seen what can go wronge on top of buildings. In are old city we have some buildings that we have said "NO WAY", about getting on the roofs. Below is one of the have too times, at a roof fire. Could not raise the ladder on the truck, due to lines and trees.
    Attached Images Attached Images  

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    I still don't see what the big stinkin deal is! Get on the roof, go above the fire, chop a hole, and thats it. What is so hard to understand or so dangerous?
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChicagoFF View Post
    I still don't see what the big stinkin deal is! Get on the roof, go above the fire, chop a hole, and thats it. What is so hard to understand or so dangerous?
    I agree! After all, that's what roof ladders are for...Pitched roofs.
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    First off, how did you know that 111 was the nut house (buff) :-) Secondly, most of the PD's in NYC are constructed one on top of another, so access from the rear or front is about all you get, ever try and set up a 35ft'er in a 15 foot ally to a 30 ft roof? Its not fun, safe or practical. Yet another reason our roofs dont get cut, also our buildings are fairly narrow, most lots in nyc arent wider than 50ft at best. Where I live houses are on a min. 3 acres, you can put portables up anywhere you want. How many pd's have you been in that have stairs to the attic, let alone continous stairs from the 1st floor to the attic that would allow for venting? Not many if any at all. 2 1/2 story pd's in the City usually contain an attic that has brow windows up top, that when taken do as much good as possible at venting with out endangering anyone. Like I said before, our Enginemen are trained to take a beating with PD fires, that why most of them go to a 2nd alarm because of the rapid spread and the punishing enviroment they create. Unless youve been in a PD fire here in NYC I wouldnt try and say its the same as any other city, cause our architects sucked! With the exclusion of Staten Island which in comparison is fairly modern in its construction designs, the rest of NY is from the early 20th Century (thats the 1900's for those that are trying to figure it out) to the 30's in most places, as that was when they became populated and the Subways grew in size. Where I volunteer at home we cut roofs on PD's but then again all we have are PD's, but even then, the benefit does not outweigh the risks to the usually casual user of ladders in civilian clothes let alone bunker gear scba etc.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jonnyirons2 View Post
    our buildings are fairly narrow, most lots in nyc arent wider than 50ft at best.
    Standard Chicago lot = 25' x 125'. Whats your point?

    Like I said before, our Enginemen are trained to take a beating with PD fires, that why most of them go to a 2nd alarm because of the rapid spread and the punishing enviroment they create. Unless youve been in a PD fire here in NYC I wouldnt try and say its the same as any other city, cause our architects sucked!
    We probably don't take as bad a beating because we cut the roof. And we hold it to the first alarm most of the time. Yeah, I guess your houses are unique in the world.

    With the exclusion of Staten Island which in comparison is fairly modern in its construction designs, the rest of NY is from the early 20th Century (thats the 1900's for those that are trying to figure it out) to the 30's in most places, as that was when they became populated and the Subways grew in size.
    Yeah, that is weird! my house was built in 1904 (thats early 20th century in case you were trying to figure it out.) along with the rest of my neighborhood between 1880 and 1920. Yeah, you are right. Your situation sounds unique. My fire house neighborhood is the same age. Same with my old neighborhood. And the one before that. I guess I just happened to hit all the old ones. When do you think cities east of the Mississippi were built??? 1990? 2001? You need to get out more.

    Secondly, most of the PD's in NYC are constructed one on top of another, so access from the rear or front is about all you get, ever try and set up a 35ft'er in a 15 foot ally to a 30 ft roof? Its not fun, safe or practical.
    Why would you need access from more than the front and the rear? Thats all we do and it seems to work pretty good.

    Where I volunteer at home we cut roofs on PD's but then again all we have are PD's, but even then, the benefit does not outweigh the risks to the usually casual user of ladders in civilian clothes let alone bunker gear scba etc.
    Maybe your volunteers need more training then. I'd start by ditching the tanks for roofmen.

    If you don't want to work on roofs, thats fine. But I think you need a little better understanding of the process before you argue against it. Or just say you don't want to and leave it at that. Whatever.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChicagoFF View Post
    I still don't see what the big stinkin deal is! Get on the roof, go above the fire, chop a hole, and thats it. What is so hard to understand or so dangerous?
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChicagoFF View Post
    I still don't see what the big stinkin deal is! Get on the roof, go above the fire, chop a hole, and thats it. What is so hard to understand or so dangerous?
    Hmmmm...we don't get a lot of opportunity around here, but I agree, it seems so Firefighting 101 to me. I am surprised to hear someone from FDNY argue against it.

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    I will agree that it is surprising the FDNY doesn't ventilate peaked roofs.......

    Yes, there are times when people have no business being up there, but there are many more when it's deserving to have someone up there to cut a quick whole and get down....... No need to keep the shepards up there standing around. Get up and get down..........
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