Thread: FEMA negligence

  1. #26
    Forum Member
    Frmboybuck's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Cornfields
    Posts
    524

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Riversong View Post
    You didn't ask a question. You threw out a hook, and I'm not biting.
    No, it was a legitimate question and you dont have to reply. I already know your answer and prooved my point. What makes you think, if the local government couldnt get the rest of the people out of NO, that FEMA could??

  2. #27
    Forum Member
    Riversong's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Vermont
    Posts
    135

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Frmboybuck View Post
    No, it was a legitimate question
    The only "question" you kept asking was:
    Quote Originally Posted by Frmboybuck View Post
    Let me ask you a question. What are your thoughts on the Saadam hanging?
    Start another thread, if you find the right category, and I'll be glad to tear you apart on this one, too.

    - Robert
    aVERT - a Vertical Emergency Response Training
    To Avert Disaster in the Vertical Environment

  3. #28
    Forum Member
    Frmboybuck's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Cornfields
    Posts
    524

    Default

    Ive yet to see you tear anyone apart on the FEMA issue...............

  4. #29
    MembersZone Subscriber

    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Posts
    74

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Frmboybuck View Post
    Ive yet to see you tear anyone apart on the FEMA issue...............
    I have not seen him tear anyone apart either, but accoring to Robert, I read with blinders on. =)

    Robert,
    Thank you for your limited point of view on what happened in New Orleans. I completely disagree with you. You have picked out several phrases from document (s) and contorted them to your limited point of view.

    What I can determine from your writings is that you expect that FEMA should preplan for every type of emergency known and unknown. I propose that you start making these plans and submitting them to FEMA for review, as you apparently know what is going to happen before it does. I say this, because you hold such blame over FEMA for failing to respond appropriately. It is true that the year before a table top scenario was done that predicted a levee failure in New Orleans. They learned from that scenario, they were ill-prepared to handle it. They were unable to fix their plans prior to that.

    A disaster on this scale can not be completely planned for. It is the same as the horrific disaster that occurred at the World Trade Center, Oklahoma City or even the Loma Preita Earthquake. I run emergencies, as an Incident Commander. I run table top scenarios, and even have SOP's/guidelines that tell me how to run certain types of incidents. For the most part, those plans are great for taking notes, cause to this day, I have never had an incident as described in my table top scenarios.

    Since things can not be completely planned, people take charge and do what they can do with what they have. I don't know if you have ever been short-handed in an operation, but I have. You learn to work with what you have, and go from there. Sometimes, you get more help, other times, you don't.

    I don't know your background, as you don't know mine. However, I find you very naive about how things should work.

    Anthony

    P.S. I am still enjoying this 'conversation'. And I think I left my blinders off ... hope it helps you.

  5. #30
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Posts
    2,053

    Default

    Buddy you said MOST didnt leave because they didnt have vehicles --- so I guess all the flooded cars in the 9th ward floated in from the Gulf

  6. #31
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Posts
    15

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Riversong View Post
    State and local officials certainly could have done more and better, but the whole purpose of FEMA is to pick up where states and localities become overwhelmed....
    ....While it does require an acknowledgement from local and state authorities that they are overwhelmed, the National Response Plan is executed from the top down
    From what I've learned regarding the corruption and incompetence of the NO politicians, I'd interpret this quote as your belief that FEMA should've been in charge of every structure fire, medical emergency and criminal investigation in the city prior to Katrina. I believe Nagin is overwhelmed when he has to decide between taking a **** and unzipping his pants first.

    For crying out loud, man...Nagin and Blanco were publicly arguing in the 2 days prior to landfall who had the authority to order a mandatory evacuation!! With nearly a hundred thousand people evacuating, he wanted people from outside of NO to drive Greyhounds INTO the city to help evacuate instead of recruiting residents (who were already there and preparing to leave) to drive school buses full of evaucees out of the city. What an idiot!! "We need to get everyone out of the city....to do that, I propose bringing in a thousand Greyhounds and a few thousand more people. To accomplish this, we must reduce the evacuation capacity of the highway system by half (inbound lanes must remain open for inbound traffic). Oh yeah...by doing this, we will be adding to the number of people who must ultimately be evacuated...." Frickin' brilliant, Mr. "Willy Wonka" Nagin.

    Then, the day after, when the Red Cross was there and wanted to enter the city to provide relief and supplies, Nagin wouldn't let them in!

    Did FEMA do the best job they could've done? I don't think so. However, I suspect it is likely that, maybe, FEMA quickly became overwhelmed because they are set up to assist, provide resources and manpower, and coordinate multi-agency efforts in disasters. In NO, the local agencies had no integrated command structure or political leadership. Instead of "executing the NRP from the top down", FEMA had to build the operation from the ground up.

    I wonder....did Nagin or Blanco request the Coast Guard initiate rescue operations that were hailed by the media? I don't think there is a snowball's chance in hell that they did. They were too busy trying to project thier incompetance on anyone else but themselves.

    As most participants on this thread have opined, FEMA is not free from blame. However, the heads of the local agencies and the local political leaders are primarily responsible for most of the problems.

    Why don't any of the journalists harrass Nagin or Blanco with questions like "Do you acknowledge that you made mistakes in the lead up to the Iraq War....oops...I mean, in the days immediately before and after Katrina made landfall??"

  7. #32
    MembersZone Subscriber

    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Bay St. Louis MS
    Posts
    7

    Default

    Being in one of the hardest hit areas, I have a bit more insight than any journalist. I was there before, during and after the storm. The "Mandatory evacuation was announced at 9 am on the 28th. That just wasn't enough time. There were assets that could have been mobilized, such as the school buses that were later lost after the levees broke, but the "lack of drivers" was cited for that screw up. I'm certain there would have been plenty of volunteers to drive if the call had been put out. Louisiana, unlike Mississippi was under a federal emergency declaration for 72 hours prior to the storm's landfall. Even such assets as AMTRACK could have been utilized, and supposedly were offered to the New Orleans government, but were turned down. As were the offers of many school buses from all over the state.

    No such offers were available in Mississippi. The brunt of Katrina missed New Orleans, and that's fact. Mississippi, as well as St. Bernard and Placquemines Parishes took the full category 5 effects of this storm. New Orleans received category 3 effects. Also, fact.

    The inability to deal with a disaster of this magnitude can't be blamed on any one system. It was a failure of all systems that we had. We have shifted so much of our response initiative to "terrorism", that we've forgotten the lessons of HUGO, CAMILLE and the California earthquakes. Centralized Command doesn't exist, and excessive red tape choked off the immediate responses from our neighbors. I saw this first hand... Supplies, medical personnel, food and water turned away by FEMA because THEY didn't coordinate it...

    Once the Federal response was placed under the present Commandant of the Coast Guard, Admiral Cochran and General Honore, a local fellow with the determination of a Bulldog, things took off and started rolling. FEMA Director Brown was a failure in every meaning of the word.

    I know all too well what that storm did, I live here. I serve here. I still live with the damage, the losses and the very vivid memories of what life was like during those horrific days afterwards. I don't need a documentary to tell me about them. The images are permanently burned into my psyche.

    Instead of hashing through the blame game, as Blanco and Nagin still are, all levels of government need to ensure that an adequate response plan is in place and workable. We already have seen first hand what doesn't...

  8. #33
    Forum Member
    Frmboybuck's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Cornfields
    Posts
    524

    Default

    Still no one has given a valid point as to why this is FEMAs problem and not that of the local government..........

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Similar Threads

  1. To ALL the FireFighters who responded to Katrina...
    By Rescuepimp in forum Hurricane Katrina & Rita Forums
    Replies: 14
    Last Post: 10-03-2006, 10:17 PM
  2. 'Can I quit now?' FEMA chief wrote as Katrina raged
    By HeavyRescueTech in forum Hurricane Katrina & Rita Forums
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: 11-17-2005, 08:25 PM
  3. We're going to give these people $200 Billion?
    By GeorgeWendtCFI in forum Hurricane Katrina & Rita Forums
    Replies: 30
    Last Post: 09-26-2005, 06:57 PM
  4. FEMA Leadership - Informational
    By StLRes2cue in forum Firefighters Forum
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 09-10-2005, 12:19 AM
  5. Members of local FEMA team upset with response
    By stm4710 in forum Hurricane Katrina & Rita Forums
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 09-07-2005, 10:34 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts

Log in

Click here to log in or register