1. #1
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    Default Tools to the roof?

    Hi All!

    I was looking over our truck the other day and got to thinking about a way to have a all the basic tools you need to take to the roof bundled together. I'm sure alot of depts. do this so I have 2 questions; what tools do you need and how do you keep them together?
    Our response area is mostly residential. all types 2.5 story wf, bungalows, new construction etc. we also have industrial and 3 story ordinary const.
    I was thinking about having:
    universal hook 6-8'
    sledge or maul
    rope bag
    halligan
    We already have a soft tool bag that we take to the roof of industrial bldgs (HVAC etc.)
    any input is appreciated

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    Standard Tool Set here:

    Residental (2-3 man crew):
    Chainsaw, Pickhead Axe, 3' Pike, handlight for each member

    Commercial (minimum 3 man crew):
    Partner Saw, Halligan, Pickhead Axe, 6' Pike, handlight for each member

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    Our Roofman.....
    -Halligan Hook
    -Halligan
    -150' Life Saving Rope or Saw (depending on fire location and 1st or 2nd Due Truck, and size/type of building)

    Our Roofmen DO NOT go to roof in peaked -roof private dwellings.
    Last edited by MattyJ; 12-31-2006 at 11:43 AM.

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    Matty ...

    Out of curiousity, why do you not vent private-dwelling peaked-roofs?

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    Quote Originally Posted by LaFireEducator View Post
    Matty ...

    Out of curiousity, why do you not vent private-dwelling peaked-roofs?

    We do vent peaked roof PDs. We just don't get on the roof to do so.
    IACOJ Member

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    Vinnie is this done from the tower bucket ?
    IAFF-IACOJ PROUD

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    Quote Originally Posted by MIKEYLIKESIT View Post
    Vinnie is this done from the tower bucket ?

    If the roof needs to be cut yes. But it would have to be real good attic fire that is preventing the engine from making a push, but in my area, it is non-existant to rare. Most of the time, venting windows, pulling the louvers and soffets are enough and a good aggressive engine company getting water on the fire is all that is needed.
    IACOJ Member

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    Let me clairify. We do not routinly vent peaked roof private dwellings. I've only been to one job in a "Queen Anne" where the roof was vented (and thats only because the fire was under the roof itself). If we do need to vent a peaked roof, it is done from a Tower Ladder bucket.

    As for why we dont routinly vent peaked roof private dwellings, it isnt necessary unless there is fire directly under it. The vast majority of jobs in NYC that occur in peaked roof PD's, are handled with simple horizontal ventilation and quick knock down. The procedures were developed years ago and it was felt the roofman could be put to better use (at these types of buildings) if he was used to search the bedrooms on the upper floor from the outside, so this is how he is used. The time to vent a peaked roof was seen as a waste in relation to the benefits it produced, when the fire was not directly under it.

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    Default peaked roofs

    and in ny city bye the time the brothers get that roof vented the brothers in the engine usualy have the fire knocked down.fact.

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    anyone interested in reading why we (FDNY)do not vent peaked roofs, see my numerous posts in the firefighting forum under videos. I explained it sixteen ways to Sunday.

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    Why doesn't FDNY cut peaked roofs???
    I am a complacent liability to the fire service

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    Quote Originally Posted by FireMedic7 View Post
    Hi All!

    I was looking over our truck the other day and got to thinking about a way to have a all the basic tools you need to take to the roof bundled together. I'm sure alot of depts. do this so I have 2 questions; what tools do you need and how do you keep them together?
    Our response area is mostly residential. all types 2.5 story wf, bungalows, new construction etc. we also have industrial and 3 story ordinary const.
    I was thinking about having:
    universal hook 6-8'
    sledge or maul
    rope bag
    halligan
    We already have a soft tool bag that we take to the roof of industrial bldgs (HVAC etc.)
    any input is appreciated

    You tool selection should be determined by the type of building your operating on top of. If I am thinking correctly your department is a pretty small career FD. How many guys are you sending to the roof?

    Also, if your not using a power saw to vent with, the engine is going to take a beating pushing in, while you're trying to accomplish sufficent ventilation. If most of your jobs are in PD's. They will probably knock the fire down before you even get the hole opened up. With limited manpower you're going to have a greater effect on the outcome with proper horizontal ventilation at most fires.

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    Get Nate on this one. He can explain it from both sides.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 37truck View Post
    Get Nate on this one. He can explain it from both sides.

    My explaination was'nt good enough for you?? Sheesh!

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    Quote Originally Posted by ChicagoFF View Post
    Why doesn't FDNY cut peaked roofs???

    Because it's a waste of manpower

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    Quote Originally Posted by MattyJ View Post
    Because it's a waste of manpower
    pssssst.... it was a joke - hence the .
    I am a complacent liability to the fire service

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    Talking peaked roofs

    nate? he still has to get some time on the job hes a johnny

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    Quote Originally Posted by 37truck View Post
    Get Nate on this one. He can explain it from both sides.
    nate who...not the FDNY Nate is it???

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    Chain saw, axe, 6' NY hook, which is kinda like a two-sided standard pike pole (not sure the proper name, thats what we call it). If its a peaked roof and we cant get to it with the aerial, add a roof ladder (to work off of).

    Although with our extensive use of PPV, I cant recall the last time we cut a roof (other then a trench cut on a multi-unit building).

    Maybe the NYFD bros know what the proper name for that 2-sided pike-like pole is called? Wish I had a photo...
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    Default fireground

    hey fireground hows the retirement thing going.

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    Default tools

    Pitch roof ( residential, apartments, wood or light metal) 2 to 3 men

    Chain saw
    Roof ladder ( depending on pitch )
    Halligan bar (breach, secure tools, footing, ect.)
    Hook ( 8 + dont waste time with 6 many times not long enough without getting into vent opening.)
    Radio
    Light.

    Commercial ( Flat ) 2 to 4
    K-1200 ( 2 plus saws depending on man power and trucks committed)
    halligan
    hooks
    radio
    light
    Rope ( depending on building)

    Posted good video on pge 3 of Video forum mentioned earlier.

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    http://fe.pennnet.com/articles/artic...of%20pack&p=25

    This was an article from Fire Engineering a few years back. Not sure if you have to subscribe or not to read online.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LaFireEducator View Post
    Standard Tool Set here:

    Residental (2-3 man crew):
    Chainsaw, Pickhead Axe, 3' Pike, handlight for each member
    Just curious, why a 3' pike pole and not one longer? I can't think of anything you could accomplish on the roof with a 3' pike. The only 2 things I can think of that you would even try to do with a pike pole on a peaked roof private dwelling would be to pull the section of roof that you cut or go through the hole to push any ceiling down below.

    A 3' pole would make it difficult to reach the far side of your hole and have any handle left to pull on, assuming your cutting a 4' x 4' and your not going to be able to reach far enough to knock down any ceiling.

    It would seem a 6' or 8' hook would be a much better choice.
    Last edited by MemphisE34a; 01-01-2007 at 06:20 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave1983 View Post
    Chain saw, axe, 6' NY hook, which is kinda like a two-sided standard pike pole (not sure the proper name, thats what we call it). If its a peaked roof and we cant get to it with the aerial, add a roof ladder (to work off of).

    Although with our extensive use of PPV, I cant recall the last time we cut a roof (other then a trench cut on a multi-unit building).

    Maybe the NYFD bros know what the proper name for that 2-sided pike-like pole is called? Wish I had a photo...

    http://www.firehooksunlimited.net/hooks.html

    Is this it?

    The other hook carried typically besides the specialty hooks is the New Yorker Hook usually refered to as the wooden hook because it has a wood handle, carried by every Can Man on the job.

    It is the top two hooks, the bottom one looks like some cheap garbage.



    FTM-PTB

    PS- What is a "pike pole"?
    Last edited by FFFRED; 01-01-2007 at 09:35 PM.

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    Come on Fred. You know what a Pike Pole is.
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