1. #1
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    Default Flordia Vs. NYC Police Shootings

    Interesting article from Snopes.com. Imangine if the Police Commissioner in NYC had the b***s this sheriff had after the recent shooting.

    http://www.snopes.com/crime/cops/judd.asp

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    A dirtbag who got pulled over in a routine traffic stop in Florida ended up "executing" the deputy who stopped him. The deputy was shot eight times, including once behind his right ear at close range. Another deputy was wounded and a police dog killed.

    A statewide manhunt ensued. The low-life piece of human garbage was found hiding in a wooded area with his gun. SWAT team officers fired and hit said low-life 68 times.

    Now here's the kicker: Asked why they shot the guy 68 times, Polk County Sheriff Grady Judd told the Orlando Sentinel "That's all the bullets we had."

    Origins: Just before noon on 28 September 2006, Polk County Deputy Doug Speirs pulled over a speeding rental car bearing Kentucky tags. That vehicle was being driven by Angilo Freeland, a 27-year-old who had been arrested on various charges in 1999 but had skipped bail. Freeland offered Speirs a fraudulently obtained drivers license in another man's name; something about the proffered I.D. bothered Speirs, so he called for backup. Deputy Matt Williams and his police dog, DiOGi, were dispatched to the
    scene.

    Likely sensing things weren't going well, Freeland broke from the officers and ran into the woods. He took cover in the densely forested area near a fallen oak tree that made him all but impossible to see. The two officers and the dog went into the woods after him, Williams and DiOGi working one area, and Speirs another.

    As DiOGi closed on the suspect's hiding place, Freeland shot the dog in the chest from close range at an upward angle, killing it. He then fired on nearby Deputy Williams, wounding him in the right wrist, left bicep, rear left thigh, right leg, right buttock, and upper right arm. One of the shots penetrated to the officer's spine. Freeland then approached the immobilized man and delivered two shots to Williams' head at point-blank range, finishing him off.

    Deputy Speirs heard the shots from a nearby ridge, moved towards the sounds of the gunfire, and was shot at by Freeland. The two exchanged fire, and the deputy was wounded in the leg. He radioed for help and made his way out of the woods.

    Every available unit and canine team descended on the area. Freeland briefly appeared at the perimeter of the woods to fire at the officers but then took cover again. He dug in under another fallen oak tree and hid there. Later that afternoon the body of 39-year-old Deputy Williams, a father of three, was found and carried from the wooded area. Officers noted that the slain man's gun and ammo were missing.

    Freeland remained under the oak tree overnight, where a 10-member SWAT team found him the next morning. When they saw Freeland raise his right hand clutching a gun (one they would later learn belonged to the slain deputy), nine of the ten officers fired, hitting him with 68 of 110 shots. Freeland was dead at the scene.

    Afterwards, when called upon by the media to make a statement about the manhunt and its outcome, Polk County Sheriff Grady Judd told various reporters, "That's all the bullets we had or we would have shot him more. Quite frankly, we weren't taking any chances."

    In response to the Florida Civil Rights Association's complaint that the police had shown disregard for human life when they shot Angilo Freeland after an all-night manhunt, the Justice Department asked the FBI to look into the matter. In November 2006, the latter agency announced they would investigate whether authorities used excessive force in the incident.

    Ironically, the traffic stop that escalated into Freeland's hightailing it into the bush could conceivably have gone another way if Freeland had been in possession of a key piece of information. In 1999 he had been arrested by the Florida Highway Patrol on charges of not having a valid drivers license, reckless driving, aggravated fleeing to elude, resisting arrest without violence, and carrying a concealed weapon. Freeland, who had been released on bail, disappeared before trial. An arrest warrant was issued, but it sat unserved until March 2005, when the state attorney's office deemed it (along with 14 other warrants) "stale." Would Freeland have run if he'd known that his 1999 case had been dropped and there was no longer a warrant out for his arrest?

    -----------------
    RIP Deputy Williams
    Last edited by KenNFD1219; 12-31-2006 at 07:50 PM.
    -------------------
    "The most mediocre man or woman can suddenly seem dynamic, forceful, and decisive if he or she is mean enough." from "Crazy Bosses"
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    And here you thought all the storys about cops in the south were made up. Welcome to Dixie.
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    Quote Originally Posted by KenNFD1219 View Post
    In response to the Florida Civil Rights Association's complaint that the police had shown disregard for human life when they shot Angilo Freeland after an all-night manhunt, the Justice Department asked the FBI to look into the matter. In November 2006, the latter agency announced they would investigate whether authorities used excessive force in the incident.
    The FCRA can kiss my *****. That guy got what he deserved. I hope the FBI hasn't lost it's mind too.

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    Default Flordia Vs. NYC Police Shootings

    I donít see how you can compare Fla. Uniformed police searching the woods for a known armed killer & NYPD shooting on a city street in late November. Moments after the three men left a bachelor party at a local strip club in Queens, the plan clothes officers fired a total of 50 shots in the mistaken belief, police say, that one of the young men had a gun. Stray shots also entered the Airport monorail station across the street narrowly missing innocent bystanders. Apples & Oranges

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    The FCRA can kiss my *****. That guy got what he deserved. I hope the FBI hasn't lost it's mind too.
    Even if the guy was a worthless murdering sleazeball, the police should not allow themselves to become revenge-driven, enraged death squads.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ThNozzleman View Post
    Even if the guy was a worthless murdering sleazeball, the police should not allow themselves to become revenge-driven, enraged death squads.
    I'm sure they were more than revenge-driven and enraged. I couldn't have shown any less restraint, so I've no right to criticize the actions of the SWAT team.

    R.I.P. Deputy Williams
    R.I.P. DiOGi
    "Yeah, but as I've always said, this country has A.D.D." - Denis Leary

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    I'm sure they were more than revenge-driven and enraged. I couldn't have shown any less restraint, so I've no right to criticize the actions of the SWAT team.
    I understand the rage...I'm not sure what I would have done, either...but I'm not a cop. We have laws in this nation for a reason. Not speaking to this particular case, but the lynch-mob mentality must be resisted. It's what makes us different from the criminals. If a police officer allows his/herself to become judge, jury, and executioner in a fit of rage, that is wrong. Making the statement "that's all the bullets we had or we would have shot him more" certainly could be seen as lending itself to that concept. More than one innocent person has suffered because of this in the past.

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    Hit him with 68 out of 110 shots, their range instructor needs to be fired for not doing their job!!!!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by ThNozzleman View Post
    Even if the guy was a worthless murdering sleazeball, the police should not allow themselves to become revenge-driven, enraged death squads.
    At least they didn't shoot him in the back.

    I mean, it's a simple latter of mathmatics, and the Florida suspect came up short.

    Think about it- all police officers are allowed to use deadly force to protect themselves, other officers, and the public if presented with a lethal threat.

    This waste of oxygen points a gun at what, a dozen officers? They all feel threatened, they all respond to the threat, and pretty soon the suspect is setting off metal detectors three miles away. I can live with it.

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    Since I work in Law Enforcement as a proffesion all I will state is this ........... Untill you wear the shoes of those officers at those moments then don't judge them. Thats what jurys do when they have all the facts.
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    Quote Originally Posted by emt161 View Post
    I mean, it's a simple latter of mathematics, and the Florida suspect came up short.

    Think about it- all police officers are allowed to use deadly force to protect themselves, other officers, and the public if presented with a lethal threat.

    This waste of oxygen points a gun at what, a dozen officers? They all feel threatened, they all respond to the threat, and pretty soon the suspect is setting off metal detectors three miles away. I can live with it.
    EXACTLY. The number of shots is irrelevant. Every officer that gun is pointed in the general direction of is going to open fire. They aren't going to just sit there and say "maybe the other guy will shoot him, I'll save my ammo".

    Plus lets think about this. If he was shot 4 times or 10 times or 20 times, would he be any less dead? No. He was probably dead after the first shot hit him. The rest were just instinct and training.

    Frankly, they could have re-loaded and kept firing for all I care.
    Even the burger-flippers at McDonald's probably have some McWackers.

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    Quote Originally Posted by KenNFD1219 View Post
    Now here's the kicker: Asked why they shot the guy 68 times, Polk County Sheriff Grady Judd told the Orlando Sentinel "That's all the bullets we had."
    They really need to start carrying more ammo with them so they don't run out again in the future.
    I am a complacent liability to the fire service

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    I have to imagine they had more ammo... 10 officers, 110 shots? 11 bullets each? Assuming they have a loaded gun, don't they carry clips also?

    Anyway, that doesn't really matter.

    Im going to go on a different extreme, and say this is why our country should have Torture. *******s like this guy.

    This guy didn't seserve to be shot 68 times, no no, he deserves much more. Tie this ******* up, and shoot him in a non leathal spot once a day and just let it bleed, let the wound heal, and repeat. Feed him garbage, and make him drink sewer water.

    Nobody fears anything in this country because even the people rapeing and killing people can be out of jail in 10 years. Pathetic. 3 meals per day in prison, cable TV? visits? weight lifting? Ha. These a-holes should sit in the damn cell for the rest of their lives suffering.

    What ever happened to the prisons where the guards just beat the **** out of you like in Shawshank Redemption?

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    Quote Originally Posted by ARH176 View Post
    Hit him with 68 out of 110 shots, their range instructor needs to be fired for not doing their job!!!!!
    That's a better shot/hit ratio then a lot of shootings recently.
    "This thread is being closed as it is off-topic and not related to the fire industry." - Isn't that what the Off Duty forum was for?

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    Frankly, they could have re-loaded and kept firing for all I care.
    Hey, I know...they could tie his body behind a police car and drag it through the streets for about an hour or two. I mean, why not?

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    Default Your right.

    Bones, unfortunately you are right, while I understand the effect of stress on shooting (buck fever), the shot to hit ratio reported in most stories is at best inexcusable. These stats go for both sides of the law, gang bangers fire 50+ shots at 10 yards and, and the only one hit is the 8 year old down the block.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ThNozzleman View Post
    Hey, I know...they could tie his body behind a police car and drag it through the streets for about an hour or two. I mean, why not?
    Only if he's still alive. It's no fun dragging a corpse.
    I am a complacent liability to the fire service

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