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Thread: Single person extension ladder raise??

  1. #21
    the 4-1-4 Jasper 45's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SPFDRum View Post
    Same here in St. Paul. A basic skill.
    Same here. In fact, I don't think I've ever put up a 24 with another person.


  2. #22
    Forum Member BKDRAFT's Avatar
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    I'm suprised by how many think raising and extending a 24' ladder is dangerous with one person. This should be practiced and mastered by all.

    Remember you won't always be able to put the ladder against the building and extend the fly. For example if you have to reach an overhanging balcony or the eaves of the roof come out too far.

    Everyone should be comftorable with this basic FF skill.

    I perform my ladder extensions EXACTLY like NonSurfinCAFF but I am also from CA so it's almost universal.

  3. #23
    Forum Member fireman4949's Avatar
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    It was a basic skill in my academy. It still is today.
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    Quote Originally Posted by SFDE37 View Post
    Once up, your (right) knee is on the outside of beam with your (right) foot on the inside. Other (left) foot is back providing stability and your hands are on the halyard.
    This is not a correct statement. The leg that foots the ladder should be the one opposite the direction that the pulley is pulling the halyard. For example, all of our ladders pulleys are locked so the halyard pulls to the right side, with that we have to foot the ladder with our left leg, that keeps the left foot of the ladder from coming off the ground because you're pulling to the right side because of the pulley. I have a hard time teaching newbies that until the foot comes off the ground on them and the ladder turns on them.

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    Our department also make it a standard for a one person 24' ladder raise. Granted if possible on the fireground I prefer to use two people to try and prevent any injuries. When working with someone else raising it we determine while we're walking to our location if we'll raise it flat or on the beam. When raising it by ourselves we try and spot it where it'll be needed for the correct placement and climbing angle prior to raising it. We never raise it using a building or other object.

  6. #26
    makes good girls go bad BLSboy's Avatar
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    To graduate (in Florida) the recruit MUST me proficient in rasing the 24 ft ground ladder solo, WITHOUT touching the building AT ALL.
    Dont argue with me, I had to do it
    AJ, MICP, FireMedic
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  7. #27
    MembersZone Subscriber Firefighter1219's Avatar
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    That's right BLSboy.

    In the FFII practicals in the Great State of Florida, one must be able to safely and effectively raise a 24' extension ladder by yourself.

    1) Carry the ladder, fly section against the body, to the building.
    2) Stop 6" from the building, place the ladder flat on the ground.
    3) Go to the tip, place hand on rung, push the ladder into the building, lift and walk the ladder vertical with fly section against the building.
    4) Bring the butt out 6" from the building.
    5) Bring the tip away from the building and balance the beam against your leg and thigh (prevents the fly section from hanging up on building materials).
    6) Raise the fly to the desired height (at any time a safety issue arises the recruit can push the ladder back into the building).
    7) Push tip into building and rotate the ladder into position.
    8) Pull the butt out to the desired climbing angle.
    Sounds very similar to what's done in Florida. There are some things that are different though. It's an extremely methodical evolution that must be completed almost flawlessly in 2.5 minutes if I remember correctly. There are a few things that will make you fail very quickly like not checking for overhead obstructions before raising, losing control of the ladder, or not keeping contact with it at all times. This must be done after your airpack evolution and hose drag to make sure you are nice and tired.
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  8. #28
    makes good girls go bad BLSboy's Avatar
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    2.5 min, automatic failures are, (from what I can remember)
    Over the time
    Loss of control of the ladder
    Not Keeping 3 points of contact with the ladder at all times (1 warning)
    Not checking for obstructions (overhead and ground)

    And this is after putting on your airpack in a certain amount of time ( a REAL piece of cake), and the Minuteman load drill (a real BIG piece of cake)
    We had to shout out the commands out loud, so our evaluator could hear them....standing 50 feet away after he removed his hearing aid!
    Its no joke to become a career FF in Fla!


    Ill see if I can find the directions for this evolution.
    I know I had them on my desktop on Fla, but Im on a laptop in Jersey, so the do me no good there!
    AJ, MICP, FireMedic
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  9. #29
    makes good girls go bad BLSboy's Avatar
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    2.5 min, automatic failures are, (from what I can remember)
    Over the time
    Loss of control of the ladder
    Not Keeping 3 points of contact with the ladder at all times (1 warning)
    Not checking for obstructions (overhead and ground)
    And less then a 70% scoring on it for minor infractions (knot wrong, not raised 9 rungs, not shouting out commands loud enough, etc)

    And this is after putting on your airpack in a certain amount of time ( a REAL piece of cake), and the Minuteman load drill (a real BIG piece of cake)
    We had to shout out the commands out loud, so our evaluator could hear them....standing 50 feet away after he removed his hearing aid!
    Its no joke to become a career FF in Fla!


    Ill see if I can find the directions for this evolution.
    I know I had them on my desktop on Fla, but Im on a laptop in Jersey, so the do me no good there!
    AJ, MICP, FireMedic
    Member, IACOJ.
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    This message has been made longer, in part from a grant from the You Are a Freaking Moron Foundation.

  10. #30
    jl
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    Thanks for all the responses and help. Great info.
    As far as FL is concerned, but I think you can use the bldg to raise the ladder upright, then have to move it away from the bldg for the extension raise portion. Yes or no??

  11. #31
    makes good girls go bad BLSboy's Avatar
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    you can use the building to RAISE the ladder itself, NOT the fly section, eg; place ladder down, check for overhead obstacles, butt ladder on building, raise to 90 degrees, then pull away from building, before extending it
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  12. #32
    Forum Member engine13A's Avatar
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    24' extension ladder raise is taught as a single person evolution here in Portland. All the recruits must meet a time standard. SCBA, hydrant-single and double header, 24' ext. ladder are all basic personal skills at the beginning of your academy. All members perform these personal skills for time at company evaluations.

  13. #33
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    Default Not using the building

    Quote Originally Posted by NonSurfinCaFF View Post
    Sounds like you are descibing the technique I was taught, the ladder is raised free standing then lowered into the building.

    The knee holds it away from the body while the foot "hooks" the foot to keep it from skidding away from you. The 3rd point of contact is the halyard and the forearms, the halyard can be used to pull the ladder towards you and the ofrearms push it away. Kind of hard to describe but its actually pretty easy to do and is much safer and controlled than it sounds.
    All of our folks are also required to raise the 24 footer by themselves, without footing against the building. Seems to be a mostly west coast thing from the comments I'm seeing above. The key is getting the butt firmly tucked into the arch of your foot and the knee of the same leg on the rail of the ladder. Keep your weight low. Push the ladder away from you maybe five degrees with your knee to counter the back force of your pull on the halyard. Note that the fly will be towards the building and counter to IFSTA specs. Some raise the ladder and flip it to be "more correct".

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    EngineCo16- I'm curious as to why you think Seattle's method is incorrect? Could you please direct me to the page in SFD's basic skills manual that you are referencing.

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    Hey man if you haven't found the correct info on this yet I suggest you listen. If you are trying to get certification in FL it is very inportant that you know all about "The Big 3". This includes donning your SCBA and checking it out, doing the minute man load deploy and the one man 24' extension ladder carry and raise. These are the biggest parts of the test and this is where you will fail if you don't know what you are doing. I suggest that you get with an instructor from one of the many fire academies in the state and get all of the steps before you even start to practice.

    The one man ladder raise is very detailed. You must call out all commands as you do them. You must raise the ladder a certain way and you must raise it alone without touching the building as you extend the fly. There are certain things allowed and certain auto fails. So far none of the posts on here have told you the correct "State Way" to do it. I won't try because I can't remember it step by step.

    Good luck buddy, it's not that hard if you know what you are doing.

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    Quote Originally Posted by RidinBackwards View Post
    Hey man if you haven't found the correct info on this yet I suggest you listen. If you are trying to get certification in FL it is very inportant that you know all about "The Big 3". This includes donning your SCBA and checking it out, doing the minute man load deploy and the one man 24' extension ladder carry and raise. These are the biggest parts of the test and this is where you will fail if you don't know what you are doing. I suggest that you get with an instructor from one of the many fire academies in the state and get all of the steps before you even start to practice.

    The one man ladder raise is very detailed. You must call out all commands as you do them. You must raise the ladder a certain way and you must raise it alone without touching the building as you extend the fly. There are certain things allowed and certain auto fails. So far none of the posts on here have told you the correct "State Way" to do it. I won't try because I can't remember it step by step.

    Good luck buddy, it's not that hard if you know what you are doing.
    According to their profile, the original poster is in Nevada, I doubt they are that concerned with doing it the Florida way.

  17. #37
    makes good girls go bad BLSboy's Avatar
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    Lets see if I can remember it....
    me....SIR, THIS RECRUIT REQUESTS PERMISSION TO CHECK OVER MY LADDER, SIR!?
    State dude...Permission granted
    (this is where you try to catch your breath after the minuteman)

    SIR, THIS RECRUIT IS NOW READY TO BEGIN!

    Test starts when you first touch the equiptment

    PREPARING TO BEAM LADDER, BEAMING LADDER
    PREPARING TO CARRY LADDER, CARRYING LADDER
    NO GROUND OBSTRUCTIONS, NO OVERHEAD OBSTRUCTIONS, LADDER COMING
    LADDER LEFT, LADDER COMING
    LADDER RIGHT, LADDER COMING
    NO GROUND OBSTRUCTIONS, NO OVERHEAD OBSTRUCTIONS, LADDER COMING
    PREPARING TO STOP, STOPPING
    PREPARING TO LOWER LADDER, LOWERING LADDER
    PREPARING TO BED LADDER, BEDDING LADDER
    PREPARING TO RAISE LADDER, RAISING LADDER
    now you raise, and extend ladder, set to proper climbing angle, tie your clove hitch, stand behind ladder as to butt ladder and state
    SIR, LADDER AT PROPER CLIMBING ANGLE, HALYARD SECURED, BUTTED, AND READY TO CLIMB!
    Do NOT let go until the to safetys have taken the ladder from you

    Any of my Fla Brothers care to make any changes?
    AJ, MICP, FireMedic
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  18. #38

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    Quote Originally Posted by jl View Post
    Thanks for all the responses and help. Great info.
    As far as FL is concerned, but I think you can use the bldg to raise the ladder upright, then have to move it away from the bldg for the extension raise portion. Yes or no??
    Excuse me nonsurfin, this post must have thrown me off as to where he was testing.

  19. #39
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    Here in Alaska I had to be able to perform this skill to get hired. Throwing a 24ft ext ladder is a basic FF1 skill. You should not however bring it down by yourself. If the fire is over you got lots of help. We do it just like the guy from Canada does it. It is IFSTA aproved! Not hard to learn unless your weak!

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    "Wires, Obstructions, Other Firefighters!"

    In Montgomery Co. (MD), similar deal, throwing a 24 or 28 (I don't remember) by yourself and a 35 with others, in the academy (same FF training for career and volunteers, except vollies don't get yelled at quite as much as the recruits).

    We also had to do the 45' (can't remember its name either) with the "tormentor poles", but that was a six-person evolution. I've only met one or two FFs who ever recall using the heavy sumb**ch for real.

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