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Thread: deluge guns

  1. #1
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    Default deluge guns

    just wandering what everybody has for deck guns? at this time our trucks do not have a deck gun so we were looking into getting a ground mounted gun? If anyone has some input to a good one to get that would be great?


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    We have Akron Apollo monitors that have one 5" LDH inlet. It is hard mounted on the engine, and can be taken off - placed on the ground.

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    MembersZone Subscriber ffmedcbk1's Avatar
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    I've worked with Stang Guns, Apollos, TFT Crossfires, and Elkhart Stingers.

    Personal chioces is the Stinger- very simple and easy setup. The others are fine to except if you want the detachable set up stay away from Stang (I don't even know if they have a good base system yet)

    Also add to the arsenal one minimonitor like the RAM or Blitzfire (BF is my choice) for quick, big hits and to allow you too max your pumper out.
    We have a system to get nearly 1850 gallons a minute with a 4 man crew, from a hydrant in approximately 3 minutes of being o/s.

    What is your set up? Are you rural, suburban, transitional to suburban, urban, are you on presurrized water systems, mainly tanker shuttle, or usally on relay. These all are important to know to advise you more.

    Also, NEVER let anyone use the excuse of "the need to conserve tank water". The basics are that fire demands a certain GPM to go out. Give it everyting you have if that is what it demands. However on a limited supply, there is a very small window of time that it will work... be very careful. Also study up on the "blitz attack"

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    MembersZone Subscriber KevinFFVFD's Avatar
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    right now our primary engine has a deck gun right above the pump panel and there is also a monitor that has a 2-1/2 inch hook up i think, lol. we can also with our 2nd due engine flow another 2 or 3 2-1/2 inch handline if we need to. we have to be carefull because we dont have access to a hydrant everywhere we go. so sometimes we have to rely on a water shuttle. so if we have an apartment complex catch fire like we did a year ago, we just may use this setup again. plus we are about to get a new engine so it will have deck gun and monitor capabilities as well.

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    My old department has TFT brand(I can't recall the model but they flow 1500gpm+ easily)on both the front line engines above the midships panel.The portable bases go into the engineer's compartment(#1 Driver side slide up door).
    In testing them when we got the variable stream tips,we found they'd strip pine bark at 40 yards at the aforementioned flow rate.
    The first time I ever saw one in real use,we had a delay getting through a fence to a burning mobile home.(Fortunately,everyone had evacuated but left the keys inside)To buy us time and cover the exposure(house and garage 3 feet from the trailer)the deck gun was used to knock the fire down some.Until we got the stream cranked down enough to go through the window,we managed to knock the 20X 60 trailer off its foundation on its side.
    That was novel enough that most of us stood for a second saying"Kewel" before turning to again and finally busting the gate lock and getting to the trailer with hoses to knock it the rest of the way down.
    We've practiced water shuttles with a neighboring county as our district is well hydranted but you never know when you're going to need it.Maybe one of the officers noticed a difference in the flow rates and set up times but I never heard of if we did one faster than the other.

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    MembersZone Subscriber mcaldwell's Avatar
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    Our engines TFT stack-tip deck gun is also removable, with a twin 2 1/2 inlet base.

    I believe it flows about 450-1500 or so, depending on the tip selected.


    For a dedicated ground gun, I haven't played with a ton, but I also think the Blitz Fire is a nice compact little unit that can be set up easily by one man.
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    TFT's "Blitzfire" is lightweight, portable and puts out a "lotta watta".

    My FD doesn't have it, but the Massachuestts Fire Academy does.
    ‎"The education of a firefighter and the continued education of a firefighter is what makes "real" firefighters. Continuous skill development is the core of progressive firefighting. We learn by doing and doing it again and again, both on the training ground and the fireground."
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    On a blitz attack (i.e. deliberately exceeding your sustained fire flow in order to control the fire) be ready as soon as it darkens down to swicth to handlines -- Class A foam is especially handy -- to hold it until water supply is established.

    =======
    Our main attack piece has an 1-1/2 smoothbore as the default tip. 600gpm @ 80 psi, 1200gwt booster tank = 2 minute supply.

    It also has a portable monitor with a 350-1000gpm fog tip. 5" storz connection, but kept with a 5"/4"/2.5" stack of adapters to be fed by a 3" for a rapid setup.
    Last edited by Dalmatian190; 02-27-2007 at 10:27 PM.

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    everyone of our trucks cept our ladder(ladder pipe which I believe is a TFT fog nozzle the same as our engines but I cant be sure) has a TFT Fog nozzle capable of flowing 1250 gpm. One of our trucks may have a smoothbore nozzle instead of a fog, but can be sure. I would like more smoothbores but I get out-voted.

    The possible smoothbore truck also has a blitz-fire attack monitor which I like alot

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    Nice post, ffmed.

    Quote Originally Posted by ffmedcbk1 View Post
    I've worked with Stang Guns, Apollos, TFT Crossfires, and Elkhart Stingers.

    Personal chioces is the Stinger- very simple and easy setup. The others are fine to except if you want the detachable set up stay away from Stang (I don't even know if they have a good base system yet)
    I agree - the Stinger is a great monitor - my choice in the 1,000 gpm portable category. Much lighter than some of the others, easy setup and operation, etc

    Also add to the arsenal one minimonitor like the RAM or Blitzfire (BF is my choice) for quick, big hits and to allow you too max your pumper out.
    Another valuable tool. I prefer the Blitzfire as well, due to the very low angles of operation without being tied (tying down a blitz monitor defeats the purpose of a blitz attack entirely - it takes too long), and the automatic safety shutoff.

    One thing to remember - a blitz monitor is not a replacement for a 1,000+ gpm portable monitor - it is a replacement for a 2 1/2" blitz nozzle. I see a lot of departments that are specifying fixed 1,250+ gpm monitors (many remote) and then simply buying a 500gpm blitz monitor as their portable - it is a blitz monitor, not a master stream (I know, according to IFSTA, blah blah blah).

    A blitz monitor is great for a blitz attack - attached garage well-off, well-involved house, storefront, etc - or a supporting stream on a defensive operation. But do yourself a favor: when you need 1,000gpm, put a 1,000gpm monitor into service.

    We have a system to get nearly 1850 gallons a minute with a 4 man crew, from a hydrant in approximately 3 minutes of being o/s
    Very good drill to practice - good work!

    Also, NEVER let anyone use the excuse of "the need to conserve tank water". The basics are that fire demands a certain GPM to go out. Give it everyting you have if that is what it demands. However on a limited supply, there is a very small window of time that it will work... be very careful. Also study up on the "blitz attack"
    Good point! Dal also lends some good points on blitz attack.


    Our new engine has a 2,000gpm remote TFT Monsoon, a 500gpm remote TFT Tordado, a 1,250gpm portable Elkhart Stinger 2.0 with 5" Stortz base, and a 500gpm TFT Blitzfire. While some might argue that that's too many masterstreams and we can't supply all of them to capacity, that's not the point - they are each different tools for different jobs:

    -The 2,000gpm Monsoon is our main deck gun, for packing a big punch on big fires.

    -The Tornado is our bumper turret for knocking down car fires, mounting a blitz attack without exiting the cab, or throwing a 500gpm stream through a first floor window (impossible with a deck-mounted gun).

    -The Stinger is for the times that you need a true master stream away from the vehicle (at the back of a building, etc), and to help the Monsoon deliver the full capacity of the pump (3,000+ gpm).

    -And lastly, the Blitzfire is for blitz attacks and supplemental defensive attack, as noted above. We also carry a 500gpm Big Paulie nozzle (see other thread) that is used similar to the Blitzfire.

    All that having been said - if we had a really big fire (they do happen, from time to time) and we wanted to make full use of the apparatus, we could place all 4,750 gpm worth of heavy streams in service - the pump and hoseload will supply it.

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    Forum Member MemphisE34a's Avatar
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    [QUOTE=SRFD8575;777785]just wandering what everybody has for deck guns?QUOTE]
    Does that mean that you though t about this as you were walking around aimlessly?
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    Comments made are my own. They do not represent the official position or opinion of the Fire Department or the City for which I am employed. In fact, they are normally exactly the opposite.

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    my dept is going to get a portable deck gun and i was just wandering. what difference is it of yours?

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    Quote Originally Posted by SRFD8575 View Post
    my dept is going to get a portable deck gun and i was just wandering. what difference is it of yours?

    Ummmm, this depends on what you all are buying. If I knew that answer I could compare it with what we have.

    We use the Elkhart Stingers. Plus we have some Stangs still being used as well on older apparatus.

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    We've run a few different guns, and personnaly I don't care what the brand is as long as it fits the bill. A few questions:

    1. Is it only going to be fix mounted on the truck or should it also go protable? Portable is probably better on versatility. Of course hard mounts like the Stang and other similar manual stick controlled guns are easier to work the stream quickly vs. the manual hand wheel controls or electric guns. Given enough compartment or mounting space I'd prefer both, a hard mounted "Stang" and a portable deluge set. As Blitzfiresolo notes the RAM and TFT Blitzfire are not portable deluge sets.

    2. Since it looks like you're going the portable mount route, what will you feed it with? 1,2,3, 2.5 or 3"? 1 4" or 5" LDH? What's you target flow rate? Most gun manufacturers offer different ground mounts based on the inlets. Some are more protable than others, but thay all seem to fold up much better than the ones we used to have to strap to the roof.

    3. If the unit is topside of your truck how easy and better yet, how safe is it to remove it in the heat of battle? Many engines are way tall and make passing a gun down a problem. Not to mention the lack of decent footing. Not huge factors, but something to consider nonetheless.

    Once you answer a few questions of what you want from your gun, there are plenty of them to choose from, but for the most part they all are quite similar. My only note on brands is that we seen to have poor luck with any of the Korean stuff we gotte, so stick to Akron, Stang, TFT, or Elkhart.

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    Forum Member Weruj1's Avatar
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    Arrow well IIRC this HASNT been discussed before.............

    On the first out engine we have a 1000 gpm pre-piped extenda-gun (dont know who makes it) it is removeable to a base with a 5" inlet.

    Rescue Engine has a 21/2 prepiped gun also removeable to a base (weighs 900000 lbs) to a base with 3 2.5" inlets.

    Last .................large truck with 2 750 gpm guns that go up to 85' ....non-removeable .........
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    Note to self: Don't screw with Weruj1's bunch.They tote "900000 lb"monitor bases.



    Quote Originally Posted by Weruj1 View Post
    Rescue Engine has a 21/2 prepiped gun also removeable to a base (weighs 900000 lbs) to a base with 3 2.5" inlets.

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