Why register? ...To Enhance Your Experience
+ Reply to Thread
Results 1 to 18 of 18
  1. #1
    MembersZone Subscriber
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    19

    Default No Respect from officers

    Hey Guys I am in need of some advice: I am 27 years old training officer on Paid Volunteer Dept. and I have been given the opportunity to train my department, after two months of everything going smooth I am now hearing about resistance from other "officers". They are saying that I am too young to be training the dept. and that I don't have enough experiance also. I am trying to keep cool about this seeing that I am sure the ones who are complaining don't show up for training anyways. The compaints are coming on the heals of the first class I taught. Since the first one went really well I thought that I would start my next class. I am looking for advice.
    Thanks in advance,

    Tom F.


  2. #2
    Forum Member Dave1983's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    Gator Country
    Posts
    4,157

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by tfentress View Post
    Hey Guys I am in need of some advice: I am 27 years old training officer on Paid Volunteer Dept. and I have been given the opportunity to train my department, after two months of everything going smooth I am now hearing about resistance from other "officers". They are saying that I am too young to be training the dept. and that I don't have enough experiance also. I am trying to keep cool about this seeing that I am sure the ones who are complaining don't show up for training anyways. The compaints are coming on the heals of the first class I taught. Since the first one went really well I thought that I would start my next class. I am looking for advice.
    Thanks in advance,

    Tom F.
    Paid volunteer?????? Which is it, paid or volunteer?
    Fire Marshal/Safety Officer

    IAAI-NFPA-IAFC/VCOS-Retired IAFF

    "No his mind is not for rent, to any god or government"
    RUSH-Tom Sawyer

    Success is when skill meets opportunity
    Failure is when fantasy meets reality

  3. #3
    MembersZone Subscriber
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    19

    Default POC (vol status)

    We are paid on call but we a still consider volunteer.

  4. #4
    Forum Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Posts
    90

    Default

    At 27 your probably are to young to be a training officer. however with that being said, is it possible that the higher ups see something in you as far as dedication, and being squared away? This is an opportunity to let your "management" style show. Be the bigger man, as these guys what thier problem is, and try to work out an understanding. How are you placed into the training officer position, is it appointed? is it elected by the members (popularity)

    Jon
    Jon
    FF/EMT
    Communications Trainer
    IACOJ

  5. #5
    MembersZone Subscriber
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    19

    Default Appointment

    I was appointed to the position by my chief, after showing dedication to the position. That was the advice I was getting from other Dept around me was to continue to do what I was doing and that it probably isn't the thought of all the members. I am just looking for advice from firefighters who really don't know me.

    Thanks for the advice
    Tom

  6. #6
    MembersZone Subscriber
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Posts
    25

    Angry Forget them

    Your probably in the wrong thread, but as an AC and training officer here is my two cents. Who appointed you? If the chief did, he should back you up.

    In regards to the whiners, move on without them. You have to develop a good program and sell it to the department. If you are doing what is right and justified, stay the course. Those that do not buy into the program - forget them. If you yield to them, you will fail and the department will fail also. What they are resisting is change. I think every dept deals with this issue.

    If members don't show up for practice, do you really want them on a attack line? 10 trained firefighters are better than 30 untrained.

    That's how I feel!

  7. #7
    MembersZone Subscriber
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    19

    Default Thank you

    I really appriciate that comments.

    Tom

  8. #8
    MembersZone Subscriber
    Join Date
    May 2000
    Location
    SW MO
    Posts
    4,249

    Default

    Mind you this is coming from a guy that was appointed to Chief at 25, but there's no reason 27 is too young to be a training officer, unless someone is better qualified and experienced and wants the position.

    A couple of ideas. First, if you're teaching something that is out of the norm for your department (we've always done it this way), be prepared to back it up with why. What standards, who else is doing it that way, etc.

    Second is to utilize instructors from other departments. Get them to come in and back up what you're saying. If it's guys that are well respected, then it's going to give the impression you know what you're talking about and will grant a little more trust in what you're saying.

    As far as those opposing you, don't worry about them. Keep doing what you're doing and when they're on a fire where guys are doing what you've taught them and it's working, it's going to prove something. Besides, you're job is to keep the chief happy, not the other officers.

  9. #9
    MembersZone Subscriber dday05's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Posts
    1,330

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by tfentress View Post
    I was appointed to the position by my chief, after showing dedication to the position. Tom
    How long have you been on your dept? I do know how you feel though. I started out young and been there done that. I was a Capt for several years and became the Asst Chief at 27. I also do our training. And I've had what you've been going through. "All he's just a dumb young kid" and so on. Well after you prove yourself they'll respect you for that so keep doing what you're doing and anyone thinks otherwise on your dept can F/O. RotoRay02 & Catch22 have some good statements as well and I agree with both of them.

  10. #10
    MembersZone Subscriber LVFD301's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Posts
    3,904

    Default

    Ok, some of this will come across as harsh... It is not meant to.

    1. pet peeve time. You are either paid, or volunteer. Not both. Paid on call is paid. It is a part time job.

    2. No respect from officers. Make sure you are giving that respect to the officers in the first place. Don't do things to make them ridicule you, like posting a question about training and advancement in a forum about grants and funding. It can be tough sometimes.

    3. With that said, my training officer is 24. Hell of a guy. He is also one of my two assistant chiefs. Wants to change the world. I want to help him. He
    is presently in Emmitsburg at the NFA. He will be Chief. He has his state training instructor ticket. He got to be highly respected in the county, not only for his training skill, but for his ideas, as well as his experience. (while
    at college he ran with a VERY busy department, getting more runs than many of our long term volunteers here locally.)

    You will get there, it takes time though

    He does have to be tempered every once and a while, but that is part of his trainging that I provide. TRAIN YOUR REPLACEMENT!!!!
    Last edited by LVFD301; 03-02-2007 at 12:42 AM. Reason: too harsh.

  11. #11
    Forum Member Frmboybuck's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Cornfields
    Posts
    524

    Default

    Im a paid volunteer......I get paid on call but I volunteer my time for training 4 times a month, 1 meeting a month and several hours per month doing odd jobs around the station. Pet Peeve or not, Im a POC Volunteer!

  12. #12
    MembersZone Subscriber
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    Outside Philadelphia
    Posts
    519

    Default

    tfentress, I'm in a similar situation as yourslef, but I'm also an Asst. Chief. The best and only advice to give you is this:

    Do your job as a training officer! Do it the best you can. Do it for the best of the entire company. Do what's right, not popular. Don't let "management's ignorance" get in the way of your job. As a training officer, your only job is to take care of your people--plain and simple!! And lastly, when faced with other officer's ignorance, stand up for what is right--don't back down for the sake of pleasing them!!!
    Last edited by JTFIRE80; 03-02-2007 at 10:52 AM. Reason: spelling

  13. #13
    MembersZone Subscriber
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    Pacific Northwest
    Posts
    517

    Default

    I became training officer at 33, and some of your story rings familiar.

    I encourage you to do as an earlier poster wrote: get outside help. Being the training officer does not make you the default instructor. Teach what you KNOW, and get others to come in and teach what you don't.

    The troops respond well to hands-on, outside stuff. Tours, timed drills, anything that involves wrecking something (good to get it safely out of their system once in a while), bringing in interesting visitors (air ambulance, law enforcement drug lab experts, etc).

    Ignore the rumblings of malcontent. You are only hearing the squeaky wheels. The Chief appointed you, and should support you in public. Continue doing what you're doing, if you are not fulfilling expectations, you will be advised accordingly and eventually replaced if you don't improve. Until the advisory or replacement happen, you're the man. Do your job. Don't be over sensitive and you'll be fine.
    You only have to be stupid once to be dead permanently
    IACOJ Power Company Liason
    When trouble arises and things look bad, there is always one individual who perceives a solution
    and is willing to take command. Very often, that individual is crazy. - Dave Barry.

  14. #14
    Forum Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    Somewhere
    Posts
    478

    Default

    Your story sounds familiar to me. I am older, but in a similiar situation.

    I am 40 years old, and came late to the fire service. I joined my volunteer department 3 years ago. I was a Navy firefighter in my youth for 6 years (late 80s). While in the Navy I was the Training Petty Officer for my Department. I was the Leading Petty Officer my last year on my ship.

    I have always been aggressive about getting the training I want. I have always been anxious to share knowledge and helping others get the training they want. Because, I am good with computers and paperwork, I volunteered to help the Training Officer do the paperwork and update everyones training records.

    Six months later I became the only state certified instructor in my department. I followed that up by attending the Training Officers course at the NFA.

    Prior to going to Emmitsburg, my Chief told me that the old Training Officer wanted to resign and asked me if I would take over. I spent a lot of time debating it and mulling over in my mind if it would be appropriate. I finally accepted the position, but I had a meeting with my department.

    I outlined my feelings and philosophy about the training position. The meeting went well. Occassionally, I still get a little grief, but not as much as I could. My title is Training Officer, not "Know it All". My job is to direct the training efforts of my department. In conjunction with my Chief, other officers, and input from the membership, to develop and implement a training plan for our department.

    I teach classes occassionaly, but primarily assign training classes to other members of the department. I help them develop training plans and develop their teaching skills. I want everyone to feel like they can teach and have the ability to share their knowledge with others.

    Always acknowledge that you are young and inexperianced. Go to these officers and make them your instructors. Have them help you develop a training plan. If they dont want to instruct, ask them to be evaluators on practical excercises. If they are like my officers, it wont take long before they are in the middle of the excercise "showing the kids how it should be done"

    Within a year, if you are good, they will forget you are young and will be your biggest supporters.

  15. #15
    Forum Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Johnstown , Pa
    Posts
    366

    Default

    No offense, but can we move this thread to where it belongs. I dont see any grant info here...and Im always jonesin for grant info.

  16. #16
    Forum Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Posts
    312

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by sfdffemt17 View Post
    At 27 your probably are to young to be a training officer.

    Jon

    Sorry Jon I have to disagree. My first Chief was I believe 24 or 25. e was excellent and I learned a great deal from him. Even the other veteran firefighters and officers thought so. He gained his knowledge from being under a Chief that was older and very wise.

    After a few years I became a LT. and I am now a Capt. I beleive there is some animosity towards me from other members as well. But I just try my best to do a good job.

    I am sure your Chief knows what he is doing. It probably is a good thing to have a young training officer in some cases. they tend to know some of the new methods. But be sure to listen to the more veteran members because they know a lot as well.

  17. #17
    MembersZone Subscriber
    Join Date
    Dec 2002
    Location
    Rural Iowa
    Posts
    3,106

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by sfdffemt17 View Post
    At 27 your probably are to young .....
    Jon
    Nonsense

    A US Army infantry company typically only has one officer that is older than 25 (the company commander is usually around 8yr in service = 29-30). Platoon Leader/Lts are typically 22-25. A few NCOs are older. Every officer and NCO in a line company is a trainer and they have a heck of a lot more going on/training for that a fire co.

    The point - If your forced into the position, it's your responsibility, and you're competent you rise to the occassion and perform.

  18. #18
    MembersZone Subscriber ktb9780's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Auburndale, FL
    Posts
    5,933

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by neiowa View Post
    Nonsense

    A US Army infantry company typically only has one officer that is older than 25 (the company commander is usually around 8yr in service = 29-30). Platoon Leader/Lts are typically 22-25. A few NCOs are older. Every officer and NCO in a line company is a trainer and they have a heck of a lot more going on/training for that a fire co.

    The point - If your forced into the position, it's your responsibility, and you're competent you rise to the occassion and perform.
    AH, finally a voice of reason and experience. The US military has been doing this since the days of George Washington. Age has absolutely nothing to do with ability! At the ripe old age of 20 I was assigned ot do the job of what should have been a E-8 ( and I was only and E-4). 6 career NCO's under my direction. Respect is a two edged swrod that swings both ways. You get, what you give! The assignment was given to YOU, not them.So do your job, do it better than anyone else and eventually those that oppose you will join you. Hang in there troop; the mantle of command is sometimes a heavy burden to bear at times.
    Kurt Bradley
    Public Safety Grants Consultant

    "Never Trade Skill for Luck"

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Similar Threads

  1. CT Police officers save suicial woman from own car fire
    By nmfire in forum Firefighters Forum
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: 04-06-2005, 01:23 PM
  2. Freeze! I Just Had My Nails Done!
    By FFFRED in forum The Off Duty Forums
    Replies: 70
    Last Post: 04-05-2005, 07:22 PM
  3. Level of training for officers
    By Tech236 in forum Volunteer Forum
    Replies: 7
    Last Post: 05-15-2001, 10:44 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts