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Thread: Chris Simon

  1. #61
    Forum Member firefighterkid's Avatar
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    so what kind of abuse would Gretzky of taken as a young Oiler without Semenko there?

    There is a need for enforcers in this game, Crosby is there to score not to fight, although it would be easy for another team to cheap shot him and take him out of the game, or to lure him into a fight and possible mis-conduct, without Crosby the other teams chances of winning go WAY up. Now that Pittsburgh went out and got Georges Laraque, people will have to pay for any cheap shots they take on Crosby, and Crosby will not feel the need to fight for himself and risk getting thrown or injured a la Fetoruk.
    www.firehall.com - check it out


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    Forum Member ndvfdff33's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RspctFrmCalgary View Post
    Iggy does his own fighting!
    Iggy is the man though.
    If someone with multiple personalities threatens to kill himself, is it considered a hostage situation?

    Ryan

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    Quote Originally Posted by ndvfdff33 View Post
    Crosby...HAHAHAHA. Are you kidding me.That kid is the biggest cry baby on the face of the earth. I played against him when he played for the Dartmouth Midget AAA Subways. That kid had a guy looking after him in Midget for frig sakes. He's never had to fight his own battles nor will he ever. Crosby would just as soon sit there and jaw at you to get you going then skate away or slash you across the wrists than drop the gloves. If crosby dropped the gloves with Derek Boogard his face would be broken in about 16 spots. Sure he's strong as an ox,I know first hand, and he's fast but he doesn't even know the first thing about fighting. The season he came into the CHL he had Mark Tobin on his team and what was Tobins sole job. To protect him. Tobin didn't even deserve too play in the Q but he was there for that reason. So why do stars not fight? Simple they can't and they would be anihalted


    In your 40 years I don't know what sort of Hockey levels you played in but it's obviously not one where you were I'm going too say legally fight and get away with a 5 minute major and thats it. Theres many purposes too fighting than just two guys going out and chucking knuckles. You'd be surpsied too know the amount of respect hockey fighters have for each other. You can tell when someone isn't a known scrapper because if they both go down the non scrapper will keep hitting him even on the ice. A true fighter will stop. Same if you get injured in a fight i.e. pop out a shoulder, the other guy will know. If he's a true fighter he'll stop. Fights can be used for many things. I know if my team was down a few goals and having a crap game,if I went out and lined up with the other guy he'd know I was just looking too spark my team,surpsing how much a good fight will do that. He knows I would do the same. After the game we'd be chatting in the tunnel. Same as if there is a big brawl in a previous game between two teams for whatever reason the two scappers line up the first faceoff and do their thing. That sends a message too everyone else saying ok this crap is done and overwith,lets play hockey now. So its not just always two guys going out too bust each others faces in. These are all things from Junior ranks, so maybe the NHL'ers should take a bit of lessons from these guys because personally this is how the enforcer role should be. Not some little star player going out and fighting and trying too be the big hero. Leave it too them too take care of this stuff
    The answer to every scenario and problem you pose is to not fight. Enforcers are generally marginal hockey players. No fighting-they don't make the team. Your star might get a fighting penalty=don't fight. Your star might get hurt-don't fight. If the refs tighten up on the high-sticking and slashing instead of obsessing over the obstruction holding and goaltender interference, there would be a lot less to retaliate over.

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    Forum Member ndvfdff33's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GeorgeWendtCFI View Post
    If the refs tighten up on the high-sticking and slashing instead of obsessing over the obstruction holding and goaltender interference, there would be a lot less to retaliate over.

    I agree too that 110%
    If someone with multiple personalities threatens to kill himself, is it considered a hostage situation?

    Ryan

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    Me too.......
    www.firehall.com - check it out

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    Fighting has not been the same since my man Joey Kocur and his side kick Bob Probert left.

    I remember being in the stands when Kocur knocked Brad Delgrano of the Islanders out. To quote Cedric the Entertainer, "He got the most knocked out in the history of knockedoutedness"
    Co 11
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    Quote Originally Posted by DocVBFDE14 View Post
    Fighting has not been the same since my man Joey Kocur and his side kick Bob Probert left.

    I remember being in the stands when Kocur knocked Brad Delgrano of the Islanders out. To quote Cedric the Entertainer, "He got the most knocked out in the history of knockedoutedness"
    You must not see Derek Boogard fight. The guy is notorious for knockouts. I agree though Probert is always going too be the King
    If someone with multiple personalities threatens to kill himself, is it considered a hostage situation?

    Ryan

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    Forum Member ndvfdff33's Avatar
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    I forgot all about this until today. Ever hear of the LNAH??? Probably not if your an american. Its a Semi-Pro league in Quebec and it's pretty much games of hockey that are filled with scraps. And guess what. The seats are NEVER empty in any arena for these games. So you can tell me that fans don't enjoy fighting and fighting doesn't sell


    Listen too the fans in this vid. Two good big boys,solid tilt,mutually ended and the players love it and fans are just nuts about it.

    http://www.gongshowhockey.com/main.p...le=play&id=258
    If someone with multiple personalities threatens to kill himself, is it considered a hostage situation?

    Ryan

  9. #69
    Forum Member RspctFrmCalgary's Avatar
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    Update ... well a few days late but an update nonetheless.

    Bettman: Fighting part of the game
    Gary Bettman

    Canadian Press

    3/26/2007 6:51:39 PM

    TORONTO (CP) - Gary Bettman says fighting is part of hockey and believes that some people have been "running off a little too fast on this topic" in recent days.

    "My view on fighting hasn't changed," the NHL commissioner said Monday. "We've never taken active steps or considered eliminating fighting from the game.

    "I've always taken the view that it's a part of the game and it rises and lowers based on what the game dictates."

    While Bettman seemed OK with the game's current stand on fighting, he is concerned about the larger safety issues that may be involved.

    "The discussion that we've been having is about player safety and injuries," said Bettman. "We've had a number of injuries resulting from fighting recently.



    "The question is whether or not that's an aberration or whether or not it's something we need to be concerned about."

    He's not convinced anything needs to change.

    "I think it's premature for anybody to reach any conclusions," Bettman said. "I think the first (thing) is for us to decide whether or not it's an issue, whether or not there needs to be an adjustment. Because there may not be.

    "I think people are running off a little too fast on this topic. I know it's an emotional one for a lot of people and it gets a lot of attention, but to have a discussion about whether or not this is an issue is a long way from saying, `Here are the 10 things we need to do."'

    The recent touchpoint for debate started with Philadelphia Flyers tough guy Todd Fedoruk being taken off the ice on a stretcher last Wednesday after a fight with Colton Orr of the New York Rangers.

    The following day league disciplinarian Colin Campbell told The Canadian Press that it was time to look at fighting in the game.

    "I think it's time to ask the question," said Campbell.

    That simple comment immediately sent shockwaves through the hockey world, with players, coaches and general managers weighing in on the issue.

    Bettman offered his opinion Monday at CBC headquarters after announcing a six-year contract extension on the league's broadcast deal with the network.

    He expressed concern over the increasing size of players, citing the example of players who have led the league in fighting majors.

    Garry Howatt held that distinction 30 years ago and was five-foot-nine, 175 pounds. Twenty years ago, it was Chris Nilan of the Montreal Canadiens, who was six foot and weighed about 200 pounds.

    Ottawa Senators tough guy Brian McGrattan had the most majors last season. He's six-foot-five, 250 pounds.

    "Players have gotten bigger," said Bettman. "As a result, we at least have to take a look to see what is the consequence of that on player safety."

    Suggestions about ways to increase safety have been wide ranging. While some have called for fighting to be eliminated completely, Fedoruk said he'd like to see tough guys wear protective gloves like mixed martial arts fighters.

    Don Cherry, the host of Coach's Corner on Hockey Night in Canada, doesn't believe fighting will ever be banned.

    "Gary Bettman and I are great friends," he said. "And we both know that fighting has always been part of the game."

    Bettman thinks all relevant parties should be included in the discussion of whether fighting seriously jeopardizes the health of players.

    "The PA (players' association) obviously is going to have to be involved," he said. "This is something that's going to have to be discussed with the managers, with the competition committee .. and ultimately the board of governors."

    The popularity of fighting is not something that influences Bettman's opinion on its place in the sport.

    In fact, the commissioner doesn't think fighting has helped sell the game in non-traditional U.S. hockey markets.

    "I've never looked at it that way," said Bettman. "I think fighting has always reached whatever level is appropriate in the game and has been a part of the game. And I don't have a problem with that."

    The only thing he's concerned about is the players who make the game what it is.

    If fighting is a threat to their safety, that's the only reason he wants to talk about it.

    "Nobody wants to see our players injured on a regular basis," said Bettman. "That's the concern."
    September 11th - Never Forget

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    Forum Member ndvfdff33's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RspctFrmCalgary View Post
    Update ... well a few days late but an update nonetheless.

    And thats comin from the head cheeeeeeeese
    If someone with multiple personalities threatens to kill himself, is it considered a hostage situation?

    Ryan

  11. #71
    Forum Member RspctFrmCalgary's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ndvfdff33 View Post
    And thats comin from the head cheeeeeeeese
    Are you commenting on the article, or the "few days late" comment? LOL
    September 11th - Never Forget

    I respect firefighters and emergency workers worldwide. Thank you for what you do.

    Sheri
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    RAY WAS HERE FIRST

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    Forum Member ndvfdff33's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RspctFrmCalgary View Post
    Are you commenting on the article, or the "few days late" comment? LOL
    LOL. The Article. I read it in the Toronto Sun the other morning you just beat me too finding it
    If someone with multiple personalities threatens to kill himself, is it considered a hostage situation?

    Ryan

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    The stands are usually full at a professional wrestling match, too. The International Fighting League is a popular TV show down here. I fail to see how the people who like to go watch low grade hockey filled with fighting relates to violence in the NHL.

    Secondly, if you go back a few posts, someone from up there was talking about what a jerk Bettman was. Now, he condones fighting (because he is desperate for a US TV deal) and all of a sudden he's a hero. Makes sense to me.

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    Quote Originally Posted by GeorgeWendtCFI View Post
    The stands are usually full at a professional wrestling match, too. The International Fighting League is a popular TV show down here. I fail to see how the people who like to go watch low grade hockey filled with fighting relates to violence in the NHL.

    Secondly, if you go back a few posts, someone from up there was talking about what a jerk Bettman was. Now, he condones fighting (because he is desperate for a US TV deal) and all of a sudden he's a hero. Makes sense to me.

    Good point, I was waiting to see if someone picked up on that.

    The bottom line for me is that I don't want to see guys like Crosby, Heatley and others fighting. If you remove the enforcer, you have teams putting the tomato cans on the ice with the sole purpose of dragging the stars into the penalty box with them. If you want to see the return of the Broadstreet Bullies era just get rid of the enforcers.

    I personally don't want to see Sidney Crosby assaulted by guys like Colton Orr every time he hits the ice. If the refs can't give him space to show his talent then I'm all for George Laroque making that room for him.

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    Quote Originally Posted by manofire2 View Post
    Good point, I was waiting to see if someone picked up on that.

    The bottom line for me is that I don't want to see guys like Crosby, Heatley and others fighting. If you remove the enforcer, you have teams putting the tomato cans on the ice with the sole purpose of dragging the stars into the penalty box with them. If you want to see the return of the Broadstreet Bullies era just get rid of the enforcers.

    I personally don't want to see Sidney Crosby assaulted by guys like Colton Orr every time he hits the ice. If the refs can't give him space to show his talent then I'm all for George Laroque making that room for him.
    Several good points. Maybe a possible answer is, along with dumping the enforcers, strenghtening the instigator rule (instead of weakening it) and putting in a major for intentional penalties (kind of like the NBA).

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    Quote Originally Posted by GeorgeWendtCFI View Post
    Several good points. Maybe a possible answer is, along with dumping the enforcers, strenghtening the instigator rule (instead of weakening it) and putting in a major for intentional penalties (kind of like the NBA).

    I like the thought of increasing the penalty for intentional penalties. That would be the only way you could strenthen the instigator rule. Fred Shero took full advantage of the original instigator rule by having his players take liberties against the stars of other teams, knowing that if the enforcers retaliated they would be booted, giving the Flyers more room to assault the skilled players. In that era the instigator rule actually resulted in a more violent league.

    Look at Russian hockey from the early 70's (Shero by the way modeled the Broadstreet Bullies on Russian hockey) Fighting was forbidden yet it was probably the dirtiest hockey ever.

    I was lucky enough to witness first hand, arguably the greatest hockey team ever, the late 70's early 80's Edmonton Oilers. Like it or not, Dave Semenko bought room for Wayne Gretzky to show his stuff. Without the enforcer you would have seen every punk in hockey trying to make a name for himself by taking a shot at #99.

    No matter what, I think we both agree that hockey is the great sport it is because of the skilled players and not the goons. If rules result in more room for guys with talent to do their thing, then I'm all for it.

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    Forum Member ndvfdff33's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GeorgeWendtCFI View Post
    The stands are usually full at a professional wrestling match, too. The International Fighting League is a popular TV show down here. I fail to see how the people who like to go watch low grade hockey filled with fighting relates to violence in the NHL.

    Secondly, if you go back a few posts, someone from up there was talking about what a jerk Bettman was. Now, he condones fighting (because he is desperate for a US TV deal) and all of a sudden he's a hero. Makes sense to me.

    Well it must not be that low grade of hockey if they play games on TSN. Because we all know TSN plays s**tty sports leagues on their network. These people who go to these games are the same ones you would find at the Montreal Canadiens games or any other hockey as well. Watch any of those videos, a lot of them are NHL scraps. People are cheering and loving the scraps that are shown there. So they must not be true hockey fans if they're at an NHL game and cheering like that for a fight eh George?

    For example

    http://www.gongshowhockey.com/main.p...le=play&id=244

    Or the monsters:

    http://www.gongshowhockey.com/main.p...le=play&id=231

    Yep that proves it right there that hockey fans hate fighting.

    Fans love it,teammates love it.Thats how fighting should be. Big George sayin "you wanna do it" and then wishin em good luck. And instagtor increased??? It's already twelve minutes automatic for instigator plus your five minute fighting major and any misconducts you get. I don't think 3 more minutes is going too do anything too that.

    I don't even see how you could begin compare hockey too the NBA. NBA is full of a bunch of limp wristed pansies who drop like their shot in the head when someone gives em a little slap. No way you can compare two, not even similar sports too one another. It's like comparing rugby too golf.

    Gary Bettman is a arrogant weasel in my mind but he is ultimately in charge of this and quite frankly if thats his view on this topic than I don't see fighting leaving any time soon.

    And just for the record there is penaltys for Attempting too injure.You get an automatic 5 minute major for attempt too injure. Or better yet ever hear of Match Penalties or Gross Misconducts. Matchs penalties automatically come with suspensions.
    Last edited by ndvfdff33; 03-30-2007 at 01:19 PM.
    If someone with multiple personalities threatens to kill himself, is it considered a hostage situation?

    Ryan

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    Just because the Toronto Sports Network airs these games doesn't give them any credibility. In fact for most of Canada, TSN has a negative conotation. Although I think there is a place for enforcers in hockey, I disagree with promoting fighting as a selling point for the NHL.

    I also think there is a distinct difference between the enforcer and the goon. Enforcers are there to protect the skilled players, goons are there to take the skilled players off their game. Conn Smythe I believe coined the phrase "If you can't lick 'em in the alley, you can't lick 'em on the ice", this plays well in the Center of the Universe(Toronto) but the rest of the hockey world may not buy into it.

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    Forum Member Bones42's Avatar
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    Fans love it
    Love what? The fighting or the hockey?
    "This thread is being closed as it is off-topic and not related to the fire industry." - Isn't that what the Off Duty forum was for?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bones42 View Post
    Love what? The fighting or the hockey?
    Both fighting and hockey.
    Last edited by ndvfdff33; 03-30-2007 at 08:09 PM.
    If someone with multiple personalities threatens to kill himself, is it considered a hostage situation?

    Ryan

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