1. #1
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    Default Why are we still killing people

    sorry i have to write this but i fell that this is gettting out of hand already this month we have over 10 people killed in the new jersey and new york area, due to overloaded extension cords or faulty wiring and now just reading this another fire in mass killed two stundents in off campus housing cause they were using a grill on a wood deck. can some call NFRIS and ask them can we put stupity in the cause column. Christ this is getting out of hand, y are we still killing people in fires in this day and age. Oh yeah dont fiorget russia only something like over 40 poeple killed in a nursing home fire due to supposed fire code violations. what more to say other than we still havent killed the right peple to make this land a fire safe place to life, i am just glad i live in new jersey which has some harse but stern fire codes. thank go for the garden state.

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    The primary reason we are still killing the number of folks in fires is because firesafety is not an important part of our nation's culture, and it's not treated as important in the fire service. Even though we as a nation spend more per capita on fire supression than any other nation in the world, and still rank 13th in fire deaths per capita,we only spend an average of 1% on fire prevention, as compared to 10-15% in Europe and 20% in Japan. Public Education is seen as a dead end career path in this counrty and a place to hide those who "couldn't cut it" in the field or those ready for retirement, as compared to the rest of the world where some of the department's brightest stars want to work in prevention. I have seen departments cut thier one public educator to get one additional field position, which is short-sighted and a disaster for the community.

    The population doesn't care about firesafety because we as a service hasn't given them the impression it's important. Back in the 70's, people didn't care about childseats, but law enforcement, through education and enforcement has convinced us that they are, and the culture has changed. It's the same with bike helmets. It's the same with seatbelts. The fact is none of those things were considered important, but through very aggressive education, and enforcement programs, we were able to change the "culture" in this country and now the culture is "use them".

    We can do the same with firesafety, but it will take committment and money from the fire service. We need to expand public education staffing. We need to allocate a lot more money for staffing, programs, media and resources. We need to hire educators trained to educate, not recycle dead-end firefighters through those jobs. We need to get the best minds in the department into public education and make it a career path people want to be in. We need to educate those who are in pub ed on how to educate. We need to buy TV spots when those who we want to reach are watching and not let the TV stations throw them on at 3AM. We need to develop and implement comprehensive long-term programs utilizing a variety of delivery methods for the fire safety problems we face.

    That is how we will change things.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LaFireEducator View Post
    The primary reason we are still killing the number of folks in fires is because firesafety is not an important part of our nation's culture, and it's not treated as important in the fire service. Even though we as a nation spend more per capita on fire supression than any other nation in the world, and still rank 13th in fire deaths per capita,we only spend an average of 1% on fire prevention, as compared to 10-15% in Europe and 20% in Japan. Public Education is seen as a dead end career path in this counrty and a place to hide those who "couldn't cut it" in the field or those ready for retirement, as compared to the rest of the world where some of the department's brightest stars want to work in prevention. I have seen departments cut thier one public educator to get one additional field position, which is short-sighted and a disaster for the community.

    The population doesn't care about firesafety because we as a service hasn't given them the impression it's important. Back in the 70's, people didn't care about childseats, but law enforcement, through education and enforcement has convinced us that they are, and the culture has changed. It's the same with bike helmets. It's the same with seatbelts. The fact is none of those things were considered important, but through very aggressive education, and enforcement programs, we were able to change the "culture" in this country and now the culture is "use them".

    We can do the same with firesafety, but it will take committment and money from the fire service. We need to expand public education staffing. We need to allocate a lot more money for staffing, programs, media and resources. We need to hire educators trained to educate, not recycle dead-end firefighters through those jobs. We need to get the best minds in the department into public education and make it a career path people want to be in. We need to educate those who are in pub ed on how to educate. We need to buy TV spots when those who we want to reach are watching and not let the TV stations throw them on at 3AM. We need to develop and implement comprehensive long-term programs utilizing a variety of delivery methods for the fire safety problems we face.

    That is how we will change things.
    It's always interesting to see the differences between countries in their approach to fire suppression, fire prevention and staffing.

    Japan is a special case, given the historical terror of fire in an incredibly densely populated country with traditional building construction involving largely wood and paper (which itself springs from a fear of earthquakes.

    I do think it is not quite right to imply that Japan prioritizes prevention over supression, however. Japan has about half the population of the US, but nearly as many career firefighters and MORE volunteers. They invest incredible resources in fire protection overall.

    The two largest fire departments in France (Paris and Marseilles) are staffed with military enlistees on a five-year hitch. Needless to say, their pay rate would be scorned by most career firefighters here.

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    y are we still killing people in fires
    "It won't happen to me".
    "This thread is being closed as it is off-topic and not related to the fire industry." - Isn't that what the Off Duty forum was for?

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    Quote Originally Posted by patearley View Post
    Christ this is getting out of hand, y are we still killing people in fires in this day and age.
    We are not killing them, people are killing themselves by refusing to believe that it will happen to them and by making ****-poor decisions.

    Quote Originally Posted by patearley View Post
    Oh yeah dont fiorget russia only something like over 40 poeple killed in a nursing home fire due to supposed fire code violations.
    IT'S RUSSIA!!! Russia is at best at the top tier of third world countries. Most russians (not all) have a poor education and little if no government oversight. That's not even comparing apples to oranges that's apples to rocks.

    Quote Originally Posted by LaFireEducator View Post
    Back in the 70's, people didn't care about childseats, but law enforcement, through education and enforcement has convinced us that they are, and the culture has changed. It's the same with bike helmets. It's the same with seatbelts. The fact is none of those things were considered important, but through very aggressive education, and enforcement programs, we were able to change the "culture" in this country and now the culture is "use them".
    Granted that the majority of people have adopted this safety culture, guess who hasn't? The same people or same type of people are the same one's dying in fires, dying in car wrecks from not wearing their seatbelts, letting their kids ride in cars with no car seats or seatbelts, and still busting their heads open because they don't want to wear helmets. Some people you just can't reach.

  6. #6
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    There are very few temporary cures for stupid, many are permanent. Lafireeducator, you continue to harp on public ed, but with the continued acceptance that immigrants don't need a working knowledge of English, what is the cure? Bankrupt cities and/or departments by having all the information translated and provided in every different language?
    I do think it is not quite right to imply that Japan prioritizes prevention over supression, however. Japan has about half the population of the US, but nearly as many career firefighters and MORE volunteers. They invest incredible resources in fire protection overall.
    That may be true, but Japan and many other countries are less tolerant of those that don't want to assimilate.
    My posts reflect my views and opinions, not the organization I work for or my IAFF local. Some of which they may not agree. I.A.C.O.J. member
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    I get so sick of seeing this. It's a lack of common sense, not a lack of fire education. We know what causes fires. We know putting stuff near heaters is stupid. I didn't have firefighters show up to my house to tell me not to do all the stupid crap people do every day in their homes.

    Common sense.

  8. #8
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    At what point do you go, hey maybe this is bad?
    My posts reflect my views and opinions, not the organization I work for or my IAFF local. Some of which they may not agree. I.A.C.O.J. member
    "I ask, Sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people. To disarm the people is the best and most effectual way to enslave them."
    George Mason
    Co-author of the Second Amendment
    during Virginia's Convention to Ratify the Constitution, 1788
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