1. #1
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    Exclamation New Call Volume Breakdown in 2007

    This is going to probably jack with a lot of people with the changes and some first-responders not even tracking the BLS/ALS breakdown. But I just got off the phone with Program Support and the way to report that is by type of call.

    So EMS BLS Response/ALS Response counts are by the type of PATIENT/DISPATCH, not the EMS Cert of your organization. An FD running First Response with all EMT-Bs goes to a cardiac call, so that is a 1 in the ALS Response category.

    Also they want the total acreage of vegetation fires for each of the last 3 years, same as the Call Volumes for the last 3 years, which are different categories from before.

    Good luck, and fire away.

    - Brian
    Brian P. Vickers
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    Also the EMS Scheduled transport category is for tranports from home to Dr, hospital to hospital. Basically non-911 transports.

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    This is going to back up the Grant guru's. They had their multiple grants ready to go and now this pops up. Maybe they knew about it.

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    Brian, so an ALS type call is counted as an ALS run regardless of level of service and whether or not a medic was even onboard (example pt. refused ALS)? I'm not sure I understand the motive for the EMS statistics if I'm asking for turnout gear. Oh well, guess I've got some run reviews to do.

    Another question, what is the true definition of extrication for accidents? Some persons have different ideas. Using tools (spreader, cutters, windshield, etc) to remove a pt? Or could it be simply the process of removing a pt. (backboard) that is unable to exit the vehicle under their own volition?

    Chad
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    Correct on the ALS run, most people that run 1st response don't break that down. National averages should be used in that case. Last time I checked it was 1/3rd of all EMS runs were ALS? Anyone have different?

    Extrication for accident would be hand tools or HRTs. Backboarding and removing is wreck w/o extrication.

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    Thank god for a good working relationship with the private service. All our medicals are logged as medicals, no differentiation between BLS or ALS. It probably would have taken years to get 3 years worth of info broken down into BLS & ALS.

    Contacted the Ops Officer, had the info faxed with in the hour.

    The info shows about a 60% ALS vs. 40% BLS.

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    Quote Originally Posted by WJVaughn View Post
    This is going to back up the Grant guru's. They had their multiple grants ready to go and now this pops up. Maybe they knew about it.
    Oh if I could have been so lucky. Rewrites evreywhere.
    Kurt Bradley
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    I didn't know about it either (obviously, would have shared it long ago), but only hits me on the submission side for the most part. Narratives were already addressing the specific numbers related to the request so I had some of these numbers down already. Just need the rest for punching in, which is only about 1/3 of the total. Only doing the ones with little or no computer access.

    Definitely seeing that no one that's a 1st responder ever thought to classify those runs. Lucky for some they only roll on ALS calls so makes that line item easier. Ah well, they gotta give us something to keep us on our toes.

    Plus think of it this way, less work we have to do next year because there's not much more info they can get out of us so we can collect all of this together in January and be ready.

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    I fall into the lucky on the catagory of medical runs, we are only dispatched on runs that would be considered ALS. But the dang extrication thing is gonna drive me crazy or heavy drinking (Not till sunday, I'm on for 48 hours). But that will give me time to get started.

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    Finally done with reviewing, researching, revamping and entering 3 years of incidents. Now I know why there was a delay in getting the application out, it took time for them to figure out how to torture everyone.

    What's next break down the medical calls into catergories such as hang nails, athletes foot, stubbed toe etc.

    Maybe it's time to get a cold one.....that's right I still have 12 hours to go in my shift before hitting the sauce.

    Well on the bright side we got to use the new brush truck for a small brush fire (2'X5') instead of it collecting dust like it has for about 7 months.

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    Ok so tallying the run numbers has left me with a question. We are a fire department with a BLS ambulance that covers most of another fire district. That other fire district is in our primary EMS response area. Considering the fact that motor vehicle accidents with and without extrication are their own categories, should I also tally the MVA's our ambulance is first due on in the other fire district? Or should those just be tallied as EMS runs? I need input here.

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    Everything but the EMS runs are just your own district since the ambulance goes elsewhere. What they're looking at with the extra breakdowns is need for extrication tools and other specifics. So the wrecks in your district get itemized, the wrecks in their district with your ambulance are EMS either BLS or ALS responses.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BC79er View Post
    Everything but the EMS runs are just your own district since the ambulance goes elsewhere. What they're looking at with the extra breakdowns is need for extrication tools and other specifics. So the wrecks in your district get itemized, the wrecks in their district with your ambulance are EMS either BLS or ALS responses.
    Thanks Brian

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    You're kidding me right? They want a break down of ALS vs. BLS?? Even if we're asking for a vehicle or turn outs???? That's ridiculous. We're a first responder non-transport service for crying out loud. How do they expect us to make that determination? I mean I could go back and look at calls I've been on and make a determination but how could I be expected to go back and look at a report that was written by a first responder who only averages 5 calls per year. And I understand that the national average may be 1/3 of all calls being ALS, but that just seems a bit much as far as a requirement to expect non-transport agencies and even BLS transport agencies to make a determination as to something that is beyond their scope of training.

    OH well...what are you going to do right??? Guess just venting.....

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    Default Call Breakdown

    I haven't started to enter our information yet, so I haven't seen the application. My depertment does not have an ambulance service. We do do highway rescue and are routinely dispatched to various automobile accidents with and without injuries. We are only dispatched to medical calls #1 for AED calls and #2 for ambulance assists which are usually for lifting or other difficult patient extrication from the home. We do not currently run a first response unit except for the AED's with the ambulance service eventually comming to do the patient care and transport. Will we have to break these calls down if we are not asking for anything medical/ambulance or rescue related?
    BB

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    Yep. In your #1 that's ALS response, #2 BLS response. They want it by the nature of the call, not your level of certification. Not seeing how that's going to be any kind of accurate gauge since I see those numbers getting pencil whipped worse than my last golf scorecard...Nanananananananaaaa Noonan!

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    Not the time to debate it, but....

    In order to be usable, data should be accurate, not "pencil whipped".
    We keep good records, but did not differentiate between some of the areas requested.
    Somebody knew long before 29-March that further detail would be requested.
    Actually, it was likely known long before 5-March.
    Earlier communication would result in more accurate data, not guesswork over 3 years.

    Wouldn't it have been helpful to know in advance that the call data would be a little different this year? Would there have been anything wrong with posting an article on the AFG page defining call volume and other demographic data that was changing?

    While it may be necessary to keep some elements of the program under wraps until the app opens, changes in other areas of the application could be disclosed in advance to allow for better preparation and result in clearer information back to the system--which is the whole point. Isn't it???

    All right, i'm going to have my oatmeal now.

    earl

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    Guys,

    For the departments that do first responder without tranport, contact the service that does. They should be able to give you the data between ALS vs. BLS.

    We don't transport, it would have taken months to go through the reports to make that determination. The Ops Officer for the ambulance service had the info (faxed) with in an hour of contacting him.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Greenacres2 View Post
    Not the time to debate it, but....

    In order to be usable, data should be accurate, not "pencil whipped".
    We keep good records, but did not differentiate between some of the areas requested.
    Somebody knew long before 29-March that further detail would be requested.
    Actually, it was likely known long before 5-March.
    Earlier communication would result in more accurate data, not guesswork over 3 years.

    Wouldn't it have been helpful to know in advance that the call data would be a little different this year? Would there have been anything wrong with posting an article on the AFG page defining call volume and other demographic data that was changing?

    While it may be necessary to keep some elements of the program under wraps until the app opens, changes in other areas of the application could be disclosed in advance to allow for better preparation and result in clearer information back to the system--which is the whole point. Isn't it???

    All right, i'm going to have my oatmeal now.

    earl
    Oh how true, how true especially in light of the fact that the program opening was delayed for so long. I am sorry for being a bellyacher here but, you cannot tell me a vaild reason why the PG was likewise delayed. We knew about the changes in the vehicle applications, yet neither the workshop powerpoint, nor the presenters from FPS (from what I have seen in here) ,ever mentioned these changes to repotrtng requirments. This was a significant point and we should have been told about it.

    They need a big dose of their own medicine in being transparent and forthcoming and clear in their communication of these things. All this cloak and dagger stuff is fine forhte CIA, FBI and the NSA but, I fail to see the advantage or reasoning behind thrusting unannounced changes down these department's throats at the last minute.

    Although they continually stress proper preparedness, which is part and parcel of the reason for the DHS in the first place, they shoot themselves in the foot every time and then wonder why departments don;t file applciations or even bother trying in the first place.

    Do unto others, as you would have them do unto you DHS.


    OK, yes I know, Kurt has dove off head first into the land of "ranting and raving" but, its over now. 34 days and counting. I think I can , I think I can, I think I can. Honey where is my Starbucks?
    Kurt Bradley
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    Unlike Kurt/Brian, I have only two apps' to prepare and the narratives for both are done so I can limit my caffeine intake. I fail to see the reasoning for a breakdown of ALs/BLS or acreage of wildland burned if what you are asking for has nothing to do with providing ems or brush fires.

    If a dept is asking for a defibrillator or wildland equipment, then that would be pertinent to that portion of the application. In my neck of the woods, 85-90% of ems is dispatched as ALS so doing an estimate is not a big deal and few brush/grass fires cover more than 5 acres.

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    The reasoning is sound for them asking; they want to determine the "actual risk" and get a better idea of the "total potential exposure" that you have. This is not in and of itself related to your particular application but, it gives them a better, bigger picture of your area etc. for future use as well.
    Kurt Bradley
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    Don't get me wrong folks, I'm not advocating just making things up, but instead of just reporting all 1st responder stuff as BLS or ALS is you run both, take what data you do know and estimate what you don't based on that. I know some ambulance services (mine included) that up until recent without a ton of time from someone sitting there and hand calculating stuff we didn't know patient type either. Since electronic reporting we can pull that, but if you don't run transport in your department there is going to be a lot of trees killed printing reports of call dates/times and trying to compare what you ran on and what you didn't.

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    Cool

    Quick question....When listing total acres burned for wildland fires, do we include the acreage in our MA calls also?

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    No just 1st due.

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    Here is my question: We do not have an ambulance, or transport patients. If we had 50 vehicle accidents, do we have to note how the patient was transported..rom the vehicle accident..even if it was by a separate service?
    Thanks for your help.

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