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  1. #1
    Forum Member bjlffire's Avatar
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    Default EMS & auto accident call types

    We run medical 1st respones.
    We have never broken down our calls by BLS/ALS.

    Do we need to? Or should we list eveything as BLS?


    I know we cannot double dip calls, but an Auto accident with extrication
    usually has injuries.
    Do the extrication calls count higher than injury only calls?

    Thanks


  2. #2
    FH Mag/.com Contributor
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    Default

    You're reporting what the call ended up being, so even though there were patients at the wreck, if you cut them out it's a wreck with extrication, if not, w/o extrication. Doesn't get double counted as an EMS run. What they're trying to piece together is gauge need for certain projects, reading on how many times you've needed jaws if you're asking for your first set or replacement. Same as the vegetation acreage showing who has wildland fires and who has leaf piles.

  3. #3
    Forum Member islandfire03's Avatar
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    Are you only running as MFR? Do you operate a transport ambulance? Are you licensed to provide BLS only or ALS also?

    If you are running as first responders only then you are strictly BLS .
    If you are a transporting service licensed above BLS [ ILS/ALS] then you will need to sort through your pt. care reports for the last three years and sort by category .
    My impression is that an auto accident crash with extrication counts as one call for fire and any pt's treated would count as individual call counts depending on how they were treated and transported, BLS/ALS.

    An example of this would be fire & rescue are dispatched for two car crash with PI. we roll an engine , heavy rescue and ambulance response to the scene. on arrival find two cars with one occupant each and both are injured . #1 has minor injuries other driver needs to be extricated because of damage to vehicle with intrusion in drivers compt. #2 complaining of neck /back pain with deficits. Both are transported by ambulance.
    Score card is 1 fire response for safety engine and heavy rescue for extrication. Score card #2 for pt#1 BLS . score PT.#2 for extrication & ALS. Add mutual aid transport received for second ambulance if like us you only have one.
    This is how it would be entered on NFIRS Report.

    I think the reason for tracking extrications vs. plain cars crashed is just statistical # gathering to see if there is a need for more extrication equipment to be supplied to the streets.
    Last edited by islandfire03; 04-10-2007 at 11:43 PM. Reason: spelling

  4. #4
    Forum Member bjlffire's Avatar
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    Default

    Ok, I get the auto calls.

    We are only 1st responder, we have run cpr and aed calls. Dont these count as als?

  5. #5
    Forum Member islandfire03's Avatar
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    CPR & AED are a first responder skill level , So BLS . By first responder I 'm guessing you don't run a transporting ambulance so the skill level and license level of your personnel would determine BLS or ALS.

  6. #6
    FH Mag/.com Contributor
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    Negative. It is call type not responder skill level. CPR and AED are Basic skills but ALS patients so they are ALS calls.

    That's why I called the Program Office and posted that explanation in another thread.

  7. #7
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    Default Where?

    Hi Brian,

    First of all -- thank you for always being there for us!!!!!

    Now, can you tell me where the other thread might be? I would like to see what you wrote about that. Do we really have to go back three years and do the breakdowns? Also, the fire calls -- do we really have to go back and recategorize them to the new categories? We run about 1000 calls per year and our computer program doesn't categorize like the app asks for. It will take me days to redo that. same with our 1600 EMS runs a year. Some are ALS and some aren't.

  8. #8
    FH Mag/.com Contributor
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    I think I titled it Call Breakdown Clarification. I started it on Opening Day when I found the changes and called the Program Office to find out what they really wanted in each category.

    Yes on 3 years, and yes on their breakdowns. And yes on a lot of digging. No reporting program I know of can run queries in that format so everyone is off and hunting.

    You weren't expecting it to make sense or be easy were you?

  9. #9
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    For the departments that do 1st responder medicals and do not transport. The best way to obtain the BLS/ALS breakdown is to contact your agency that does the transport and ask for their breakdown.

    We run as baisc EMT's with no transport. Even thouigh the AFG is looking for the type based on the response ex. cardiac, what our dispatchers write in the compalint and what the transporting agency ultimately does is two different things.

    The easiest way for me was to contact the Ops Officer and he provided the breakdown (all 3 years) in about an hour.

  10. #10
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    Default Oh, No .......

    ...... I in no way expected ease or understanding. To be honest, I laughed that nervous kind of laugh when I read the guidance. Actually, I didn't expect to be involved in this at all this year. I should have known they'd change their minds.

    If you don't mind me asking you another question ... we were awarded all new SCBAs and RIT packs this past grant year. Now they want to apply for a PortaCount system that tests full and half face respirators AND N-95s (good for our EMS personnel I would think), plus the corresponding laptop, printer and accessories.

    In your honest, professional opinion -- is this something you think would be feasible or do you think they would say we should have applied in last year's application? Our firefighters are currently fit tested when they have their routine firefighter physicals, which the frequency of them depends on their age. So, many of our members are only fit tested every three years while any over the age of 40 are every year.

    Our ambulance personnel (who run over 1000 calls a year) have never been N-95 fit tested.

    What do you think .........?

    Thanks for the input. I am very interested in what your take on this project is.

    Kelly

  11. #11
    FH Mag/.com Contributor
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    It is a health and safety issue so it is a valid thing to do. If you have the respirators and other stuff now then it might beg to wonder how this is being handled now since if you're using any breathing apparatus it should be fit tested every year on the users. Normally that's done as part of the SCBA, but it's been done as standalones before. And awarded. Like any project more denials than awards but these things happen. If it's a need, and more importantly the greatest need of the department right now then paint the picture and have at it. Anything can be funded, anything can be denied.

  12. #12
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    Default Thanks

    Like anyone else, I think my project should be the first one awarded. To us it is important, to others maybe not so much.

    We run 1000 fire-related calls a year and, like I said, 1600 ambulance calls a year. We have made health and safety a major priority in recent years --targeting a different thing each year -- to ensure safety of the fire and EMS personnel. Turn-outs one year, SCBA, we pay for every fire and EMS personnels complete physical when they are due (based on age).

    One of the reasons we didn't apply for the unit when we applied for the SCBAs is beacuse we truly were uneducated on the standard and the testing process itself. The facility that does the testing now alluded to the fact that it would be a huge risk for us to try to do it ourselves and that the people who were going to do it would have to go through a certification class. We've since found out that this is not entirely accurate.

    When we took delivery of our SCBAs we talked to the person who fit tested everyone and he told us that it would be to our benefit to be doing this ourselves now. It would allow for better recordkeeping, not allow for the human error or faking factor (I know people fake their way through the test the way our facility is doing it now -- I used to administer the smoke irritant tests), would allow us to share the unit with surrounding departments (the county owns one unit and everyone tries to share it -- does not work very well doing it that way) and allows us to test each mask itself at the same time in case there is a problem with the mask.

    Am I on the right track?

    Thanks again for the input -- I won't blah blah blah your ear off anymore now .....

    Kelly

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