1. #1
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    Default Add this Scenario to the University Of Extrication

    http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=c4f_1178929426

    Yikes! I just wish they had the chase footage showing how it ended up stuck like that.

    Interesting one to stabilize I might add as well...

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    I'm curious as to how that guy managed to do that as well.

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    Talking Holy Sh$t

    I can here it now.

    PD - Dispatch we need fire and ems, oh yea you mite want to get a crane in route also. Don't ask it would take to long to explain I'll shoot you some pic's.

    FD frist due - Comand to all units, make sure one of you has a camera, they arent going to belive this at the station.

    Comand to dispatch Get the Chief in route he needs to see this for him self.

    K Dugas
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    Quote Originally Posted by feedtheflame View Post
    http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=c4f_1178929426

    Yikes! I just wish they had the chase footage showing how it ended up stuck like that.

    Interesting one to stabilize I might add as well...
    I like vehicles as a last resource for a stabilization anchor but this engineer has got it together, the first thing I saw was he has all four outriggers extended.
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    Quote Originally Posted by LeeJunkins View Post
    I like vehicles as a last resource for a stabilization anchor but this engineer has got it together, the first thing I saw was he has all four outriggers extended.
    When I first watched this I hadn't even noticed the line he had from the truck to the undercarriage of the SUV until the chopper made its first 360 around the scene. All I could see were the lines from the tools on the ground, my concern diminished, slightly, upon seeing it though.

    The more I think about it, I probably would've enjoyed watching them get the thing back out of there again too. As the tow truck driver responding to that scene I probably would've told the guys on the rig to just put a hydraulic ram between the SUV and the narrowest part of that gap and pushed it until it fell through. "I'll go pick that up below"
    Last edited by feedtheflame; 05-12-2007 at 06:54 PM.

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    That would be one way to do
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    Thumbs up Ok...............

    Bring in a Large Crane nomally used for Tractor Trailers. Hook up chains to the SUV and the Crane Boom. Lift enough to tension the chains. Second Crane rigs and pulls the SUV sideways toward the wider opening, with the first Crane rotating the Boom to follow and keep the SUV in the same Vertical position. When the SUV is in a wider area, lift it up and out. Set it on the road to finish the Extrication.


    Lee, any thoughts??...........
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    Quote Originally Posted by hwoods View Post
    Bring in a Large Crane nomally used for Tractor Trailers. Hook up chains to the SUV and the Crane Boom. Lift enough to tension the chains. Second Crane rigs and pulls the SUV sideways toward the wider opening, with the first Crane rotating the Boom to follow and keep the SUV in the same Vertical position. When the SUV is in a wider area, lift it up and out. Set it on the road to finish the Extrication.
    That is exactly what I would do as well. Although we don't have any bridges like that around here. If someone went off the one large bridge in our district, it would be about 200ft to the rocks and river below... At which point a rapid extrication would no longer be necessary.
    Even the burger-flippers at McDonald's probably have some McWackers.

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    Quote Originally Posted by hwoods View Post
    Bring in a Large Crane nomally used for Tractor Trailers. Hook up chains to the SUV and the Crane Boom. Lift enough to tension the chains. Second Crane rigs and pulls the SUV sideways toward the wider opening, with the first Crane rotating the Boom to follow and keep the SUV in the same Vertical position. When the SUV is in a wider area, lift it up and out. Set it on the road to finish the Extrication.


    Lee, any thoughts??...........
    I thing you handled that quite well !! BUT, his way was more fun

    Part of what we are doing with the Extrication Fest is trying to train FFs and Towing personnel to work together. Today's rotator wreckers are some of the best rescue tools you can have on a scene.
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    With the new rotators you would not even need two, hook up to the SUV, rotate to the left and boom in a tiny bet as you rotate and lift it out, rotate 90degrees and set it down in the road.
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    Lightbulb Well..........

    Quote Originally Posted by LeeJunkins View Post
    With the new rotators you would not even need two, hook up to the SUV, rotate to the left and boom in a tiny bet as you rotate and lift it out, rotate 90degrees and set it down in the road.

    We've worked a coupla jobs with rotators, and they are very good to work with. My reasoning with using two cranes is that I wanted to avoid lifting the SUV as long as it's a "Wedge" between the two walls. The least stressful recovery procedure, as used by the Crane guys, is to use the first to hold the vertical lift in a stable position, and use the Second to pull the SUV Horizontally (Sideways) until it's loose. SAFETY POINT. Clear the area below the SUV!! In the video, as the chopper moves around, you can see units on the street below. Although you want scene security down there, everything and everybody MUST be free from exposure to falling Parts or Liquids.
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    Default Great Idea

    Lee Junkins,NMFIRE and Chief Woods, Great minds do think alike.

    I was actually being a bit sarcastic when I mentioned the crane in my previous post I honestly never even thought of the rotary heavy wrecker.

    That was brilliant idea we have them in our area also but most of the time we over think the situation and do not request it apron arrival.

    The only thing I would worry about would be how to stabilize the suv when it is lowered to the roadway not to compromise the victim.

    Help me out a bit would you lower the suv to the roadway nose first. Stop when the nose hits the roadway to keep the patient in the relative same position. Or would you try to lower it on "all 4's" and proceeded with a conventional extrication?

    K Dugas
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    Ok, I see now our differences, I would do as they did in the video I do not like to move the vehicle with the victim in it. They had plenty of access to the vic, I am very much for moving the metal and not the vic, so I was looking at moving the SUV after the vic was out.


    In the video, as the chopper moves around, you can see units on the street below. Although you want scene security down there, everything and everybody MUST be free from exposure to falling Parts or Liquids.

    I noticed that too, I wouldn't want a rig that close either.
    Last edited by LeeJunkins; 05-13-2007 at 08:31 PM.
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    Default Ok

    I still would like to have the heavy wreaker to suport the suv while having my FF working on the SUV

    K Dugas
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    Quote Originally Posted by kldugas412 View Post
    I still would like to have the heavy wreaker to suport the suv while having my FF working on the SUV
    That would be great, the only problem, is that most dept. do not have that quick of access to one, it would be a long wait before the extrication could start for most.
    The way they stabilized it in the video was good,
    I would have liked to have seen a second anchor to cover any chain failure.

    What I was most impressed with, is with all of those guys there, I never seen them gang up around the SUV, everyone stayed back and gave the rescuers room to work.
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    Rotater/crane my a**. Just the street(downstream) side of the rear axle/wheels are two attachment points.ONE one ton tow truck with a hydraulic boom,ten minutes,DONE! This job isn't even in my book of extraordinary,just mildly interesting.In the time it took to set the outriggers on a crane or rotater you could have this vehicle extracted and on the asphalt.T.C.

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    That is a mid sized SUV with a pretty good subframe and unibody, but I too wonder if there is a realistic chance of "pinching" the pt's against the dash or roof when you try to lower the vehicle to the horizontal position.

    I think it really is the only way, as trying to work suspended while acheiving decent stabilization woud be a major PITA.

    But if this was a flimsier passenger car, or received more structural damage, would there be any other realistic option?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rescue101 View Post
    Rotater/crane my a**. Just the street(downstream) side of the rear axle/wheels are two attachment points.ONE one ton tow truck with a hydraulic boom,ten minutes,DONE! This job isn't even in my book of extraordinary,just mildly interesting.In the time it took to set the outriggers on a crane or rotater you could have this vehicle extracted and on the asphalt.T.C.
    Smartallic wrecker drivers, "Oh I mean vehicle recovery engineers"
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    Call a Metz. It would be another advertising picture.
    "This thread is being closed as it is off-topic and not related to the fire industry." - Isn't that what the Off Duty forum was for?

  20. #20
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    Talking Yeah, Me Too.................

    Quote Originally Posted by LeeJunkins View Post
    Smartallic wrecker drivers, "Oh I mean vehicle recovery engineers"

    Yup! Great minds are thinking alike. We agree here........
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    Lightbulb Ok............

    Quote Originally Posted by Rescue101 View Post
    Rotater/crane my a**. Just the street(downstream) side of the rear axle/wheels are two attachment points.ONE one ton tow truck with a hydraulic boom,ten minutes,DONE! This job isn't even in my book of extraordinary,just mildly interesting.In the time it took to set the outriggers on a crane or rotater you could have this vehicle extracted and on the asphalt.T.C.

    OK, I see what you mean...... BTW, we bought a couple of "Chain Kits" which have those weird ends that fit holes in the frame or unibody. So Far, so good......
    Never use Force! Get a Bigger Hammer.
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    Harve,the only sticky point here is if the Suv went in vertically or slid in sideways.If it went sideways,you'd have to slide it a little to the wide side of the gap to release the pressure.Calcs work like this:Suv at 3500-4000#.ANY hyd tow truck will start at 16,000# retracted and around 4000 extended,larger ones even more,verticle lift 13' or greater.If you hook to the attachment points I mentioned earlier you can maintain a verticle lift with the patients still in the car.As long as the lift stays verticle,you won't cause any crush that isn't already there.I realize some States won't let you move a vehicle with a patient in it.With a good operator this is very smooth,effective and safe.Chain the bottom(in this case frt/lower to the wheelift,advance over the retainer and then unchain and slowly lower as the tow truck slowly advances.Then extricate as normal. We CAN do this here, other jurisdictions may vary.I had to unwrap one from a tree last week to facilitate an extrication.This was done with two medics in the vehicle.No loss of care continuity.This wreck did result in the loss of our patient due to tramatic injury a day later but use of the tow truck saved probably 20 minutes of time in extricating. T.C.

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