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  1. #21
    Forum Member THEFIRENUT's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by malana1 View Post
    Their old, just wait awhile and they will be gone soon.
    I don't care who you are.....that's just not right!!!!!
    Just someone trying to help! (And by the way....Thanks for YOUR help!)

    Aggressive does not have to equal stupid.

    ** "The comments made here are this person's views and possibly that of the organizations to which I am affiliated" **


  2. #22
    Forum Member pkfd7505's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nine3Probie View Post
    PK, I don't think the problem is the blocking of the emergency vehicles. From the way I read it, it's the safety factor of "civilians" walking through the parking lot while the firefighters are pulling in for a call.

    I'm sure the chief has tried to tell them that it's not just the one group...that the entire building is now off limits to all civilian functions due to safety concerns.

    Good point, but it would depend on the building setup, at our house 1, if you block the parking lot, you somewhat impede our access to the fire apparatus. Bones has a good point too, if they can't safely navigate a parking lot in their POV, do they really need to be driving fire trucks? As others have mentioned, this is a good chance for awesome PR. Instead of saying no, they could make it a FD/Community joint function. They could have some of the Fire Fighters show up for the event, and help coordinate parking and boundries, not to mention help the folks move some of the heavier items. Then when vote times comes, you got an ace in the hole.


    Quote Originally Posted by Nine3Probie View Post
    The only other option...as I see it...is to make the department a career department. Then you won't have the vollies pulling into the parking lot, blue lights flashing, and running over grandma!
    OH NO YOU DIDN'T!! That right there is what we like to call baiting.

    PKFPD
    IACOJ and proud of it


    Don't argue with an idiot; people watching may not be able to tell the difference.

  3. #23
    MembersZone Subscriber LVFD301's Avatar
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    There are so many good points here, and a lot of .. well... points.

    Something to remember, is the wide variety of departments across
    the country. Our department is the center of our community, and we
    adapt to pretty much any requests to use our facilities. A busy
    urban department will probably not be able to adapt as easily, and will usually have other options in the community for people to use.

    I welcome people who want to use our buildings - I want to show off my equipment and facilities. I want people to see we are a progressive forward thinking department, that is out there trying to do everything they can for the community. That is the only way we are going to continue to garner support in the community.

    I also have to agree with the thought that the driving issue is pretty lame - and if your drivers are that bad its time for remedial training.

    So many of these responses are aimed at saying no... Perhaps we should be looking at these questions with the intent to say YES?

    And Senior Citizens.... You have to be nice to them for a variety of reasons, including the fact they have lots of money, and you too will someday be one!

  4. #24
    Early Adopter cozmosis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BHFF22 View Post
    The current Chief raised some safety concerns he has regarding them walking threw the parking lot while members are responding to emergencies.
    Are you really so busy -- run volume wise -- that emergency vehicle traffic is a safety risk? If you're out the door six or seven time during the day (when they're having their sale), I might buy that argument... But if you're talking about anything less, then you need to find a better excuse to boot the seniors out.

  5. #25
    Forum Member st42stephenAFT's Avatar
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    Quote:
    Originally Posted by BHFF22
    The current Chief raised some safety concerns he has regarding them walking threw the parking lot while members are responding to emergencies.
    Are you really so busy -- run volume wise -- that emergency vehicle traffic is a safety risk? If you're out the door six or seven time during the day (when they're having their sale), I might buy that argument... But if you're talking about anything less, then you need to find a better excuse to boot the seniors out.
    And if you guys are that busy, why not assign a duty crew to be at the station during those times? That way, no one's driving in and hurting any of the seniors. Plus, you'll have a crew out the door a minute after dispatch. Just a thought.

  6. #26
    Forum Member pkfd7505's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LVFD301 View Post
    I want to show off my equipment
    Ummm... can't you get arrested for that?

    PKFPD
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    Don't argue with an idiot; people watching may not be able to tell the difference.

  7. #27
    MembersZone Subscriber LVFD301's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pkfd7505 View Post
    Ummm... can't you get arrested for that?
    Only if they complain...

  8. #28
    Forum Member DeputyChiefGonzo's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by pkfd7505
    Ummm... can't you get arrested for that?
    Originally Posted by LVFD301
    Only if they complain...
    Would your trial be in "small claims court"?
    ‎"The education of a firefighter and the continued education of a firefighter is what makes "real" firefighters. Continuous skill development is the core of progressive firefighting. We learn by doing and doing it again and again, both on the training ground and the fireground."
    Lt. Ray McCormack, FDNY

  9. #29
    MembersZone Subscriber mcaldwell's Avatar
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    Lots of good points mentioned, but I further stress the need for diplomacy.

    In many smaller communities, the Firehall may be the community hall, voting center, emergency operations center, among many other uses. If that has been the tradition, you may have to be tactful in your efforts to change things.

    I agree with the comments about not ****ing off the old folks. They have a lot of time on thier hands, and they can write letters and make phones calls till the cows come home. Plus, if they are active in the community most of them have experience with this, and possibly influential friends who want to keep them happy.

    Like any other problem, try to offer a solution instead of just saying no, and be prepared to defend your position with facts and honest concerns. It has to hold up to both public and political scrutiny.

    Maybe it's time for the community to buck up and build a dedicated community center for these things (or donate an old vacant building, as has been the norm out here). In order to make that happen, you first have to convince the politicians that it is a good use of public funds, and then you have to help them convince the public that they should pay for it.

    Good Luck.

    And beware the AARP!
    Never argue with an Idiot. They drag you down to their level, and then beat you with experience!

    IACOJ

  10. #30
    MembersZone Subscriber LVFD301's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainGonzo View Post
    Originally Posted by pkfd7505


    Originally Posted by LVFD301


    Would your trial be in "small claims court"?
    Oh come on now... Never look at the next urinal!

  11. #31
    MembersZone Subscriber mcaldwell's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LVFD301 View Post
    Oh come on now... Never look at the next urinal!
    LOOK at the next urinal???

    You shouldn't USE the next urinal. Man rules clearly state a one urinal buffer between strangers. If there are no others available without impedeing a man's "urinal space", come back later.
    Never argue with an Idiot. They drag you down to their level, and then beat you with experience!

    IACOJ

  12. #32
    MembersZone Subscriber LVFD301's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mcaldwell View Post
    LOOK at the next urinal???

    You shouldn't USE the next urinal. Man rules clearly state a one urinal buffer between strangers. If there are no others available without impedeing a man's "urinal space", come back later.
    This thread is really headed towards the crapper....

  13. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by mcaldwell View Post
    LOOK at the next urinal???

    You shouldn't USE the next urinal. Man rules clearly state a one urinal buffer between strangers. If there are no others available without impedeing a man's "urinal space", come back later.
    This is true...hmmm what about sporting events ? because no man wants to miss any action

  14. #34
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    To answer some of the questions posted, the town owns the building. And no we arenít reckless with our driving, our record for safety is impeccable and wed like to keep it that way, the problem for one is the poor design of the parking lot. The limited spaces are on the outside of the lot because the building has rear doors for the apparatus to pull into to eliminate backing in and at night the lighting is poor. We had an incident last year when another group was using the building and the lot was full of cars parked everywhere and when a mutual aid call came in there was no place for the responding members to park. The new policy was explained in detail and with plenty of notice to this group. In addition other organizations have offered use of there buildings for them and they flat out refuse to accept there offers.

  15. #35
    Hook & Can
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    Quote Originally Posted by BHFF22 View Post
    To answer some of the questions posted, the town owns the building....The new policy was explained in detail and with plenty of notice to this group. In addition other organizations have offered use of there buildings for them and they flat out refuse to accept there offers.
    The next step, IMO, is for the Chief to go to the town council, or mayor, or what-have-you and explain to him/them why he wants the policy change. Also letting them know that there are other sites available for the Seniors to use may help them realize that your chief may have a valid concern...then let those in charge decide what should happen.

    Unfortunately for you guys, the Chief does have a "boss," and may not be able to act as the final authority on the matter...especially considering the "political clout" that a seniors group could have.

    One question...on the days that they hold their annual garage sale, why couldn't the apparatus be backed in to the station, and use the area at the rear of the station for firefighter parking? It is only an annual event, for what...a weekend? Would it be that much of an inconvenience/logisitcal nightmare? Ok...so it was more than 1 question.

    Whatever happens, I wish you guys the best with the sticky situation. Sounds like you're in for a bit of a battle if they've refused other locations that were offered.

  16. #36
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    when we discussed this issue it wasnt just the seniors that we wanted to stop using the building it was all the groups. We felt if we allow 1 group to use the building then the other groups will complain that we are being unfair.

  17. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by BHFF22 View Post
    when we discussed this issue it wasnt just the seniors that we wanted to stop using the building it was all the groups. We felt if we allow 1 group to use the building then the other groups will complain that we are being unfair.
    Good point. I had forgotten you had said the other group understood and agreed in your original post.

    Forget what I said about the backing in, etc.

    Still, it seems the Chief is going to have to make a case to the "owners" of the building to make anything happen...maybe the seniors will have to make a case to them as well, with each side presenting their arguments. I think the Chief will have the stronger position, especially with other options available.

  18. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrParasite View Post
    Am I the only one that has a problem with this? whether the town owns the building or the corporation, it's still a firehouse.

    if I'm not mistaken, the City on New York owns all the FDNY firehouses. Does that mean I can hold a bake sale there next week?

    For all you guys who are in 100% paid firehouses, since the buildings are owned by the cities, I am going to have a group meeting there. after all, they are public buildings, and I can use them as I like, right?

    from a PR side, yes, you can be nice and help them find a new place. But you are under no legal obligation to do so. However, you can suggest they meet at the police station, municipal building, or library, as they are as equally public buildings as your fire station, and they have as much equal right do do what they want there as they do as your fire house
    I agree with you. It's a firehouse, not a community center. It's purpose and set up is for emergency responses, not community events. If a department wants to allow their building to be used for community events, then more power to them, that's their choice.

    Originally quoted by BHFF22:

    In addition we would lose the use of our day room for 2 days.
    If your department, or any department is going to use their house for a community event, the living quarters of the house should be off limits. I personally don't like strangers roaming through my firehouse. We've had things stollen by our visitors. This is one reason why I don't like community events at the firehouse. You leave on a fire call with a house full of civilians, who's watching your stuff?

  19. #39
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    Default Surrender the Firehouse

    Quote Originally Posted by BHFF22 View Post
    Looking for some feedback about a problem we are currently facing. The senior citizens in my community have used the firehouse for the past several years to hold there annual garage sale. The current Chief raised some safety concerns he has regarding them walking threw the parking lot while members are responding to emergencies. It was discussed at the meeting and the membership voted to end all public use of the building.The other group that used the firehouse graciously accepted the decision and made other arrangements. But it seems the seniors feel itís a public building and for them to use when they like. Our call volume has doubled in the past 2 years and the safety concerns are legitimate because our parking lot can barely accommodate us. In addition we would lose the use of our day room for 2 days. Any experiences or suggestions will be helpful
    Annual garage sale. As in once per year. Donít walk away from this fight, RUN! Firehouses were once the center of community life. Nothing strikes fear in politicians more than seeing the front row of the town meeting filled with blue haired ladies. Your FD does not want to p-off these folks. They are organized, networked & have lots of time on there hands. Donít try to confuse this argument with facts, you will lose. Change the name of your place to Fort Surrender for one day

  20. #40
    Forum Member Bones42's Avatar
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    the town owns the building.
    Then fortunately/unfortunately, the town gets to decide how it's building is used and by whom.
    "This thread is being closed as it is off-topic and not related to the fire industry." - Isn't that what the Off Duty forum was for?

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