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    Default Messed With the Wrong Marine - Part I

    What kills me is that family of these two guys think the guy should have just sat there and obliged their criminal action. Unfreakingbelievable!


    http://www.sun-sentinel.com/news/loc...home-headlines


    Subway customer lauded as hero for gunning down robbers in Plantation

    By Akilah Johnson, Andrew Tran and Juan C. Ortega
    South Florida Sun-Sentinel
    Posted June 29 2007


    Some are calling a former U.S. Marine a hero for shooting two men killing one during the botched robbery of a sandwich shop in Plantation. But the men's friends and family want to know how he could gun them down and not be charged.

    John Lovell had just finished dinner at about 11: 15 p.m. Wednesday when, Plantation police say, two men armed with guns rushed inside a Subway shop and demanded cash. After robbing the store, the men turned to Lovell. They wanted his money, police said.


    But like his attackers, Lovell was armed.

    The retired military man opened fire, shooting dead Donicio Arrindell, 22, of North Lauderdale, and critically injuring Fredrick Gadson, 21, of Fort Lauderdale.

    Lovell, 71, of Plantation, has a valid concealed weapons permit and is not expected to be charged in the shooting, said police spokesman Detective Robert Rettig. Gadson, however, faces multiple felony charges that could include murder, he said. Under Florida law, anyone who commits a felony such as armed robbery resulting in a death can be held accountable for the capital offense.

    "He feared for his life," Rettig said of Lovell. "And if he's in fear for his life, then he has a right to defend himself, even if it means severe bodily injury or death."

    Florida law gives people the right of "self-defense without the duty to retreat." That means individuals can use deadly force virtually anywhere to prevent death or serious injury.

    Lovell could not be reached for comment despite calls and visits to his home.

    His attorney, Wesley White, of Yulee, near Jacksonville, said he has known Lovell for 19 years and described him as a "quiet Clint Eastwood-type you don't want to mess with." He is a former Marine who was a member of the helicopter detail that transported Presidents Kennedy and Johnson, White said.

    Lovell, a retired Pan-Am and Delta Airline pilot, has held a concealed weapons permit since September 1990. Three months earlier, Plantation police had arrested him for having a loaded .9 mm and three extra clips behind the driver's seat of a Corvette without proper permits for the gun. The Broward State's Attorney's Office declined to file charges in that case.

    According to a police statement, :Arrindell ordered Lovell to hand over his wallet. He intentionally dropped it on the floor and refused to pick it up, saying he was afraid. That's when Arrindell ordered him into the women's restroom.

    "The victim believed he would be executed and when he noticed [Arrindell] distracted ... reached behind his back, removed his loaded .45 caliber handgun from his holster and fired seven rounds," the statement said.

    Arrindell was struck twice once in the head and once in the stomach and collapsed. Officers found him face down, wearing sunglasses and a bandanna, with a gun near his left hand. Gadson was hit in the chest and ran from the store. Police dogs found him in the hedges of a nearby office building and bank.

    Both men were taken to Broward General Medical Center, where Arrindell died and Gadson was in critical condition Thursday.

    Sebastian Shakespeare, 23, of Lauderhill, was going to buy a sandwich at the Subway at 1949 N. Pine Island Road when he saw Lovell, gun in hand, standing over Arrindell. A former employee, Shakespeare worked the night shift and often worried about getting robbed.

    He said Lovell did a good deed. "A civilian was a hero."

    Lovell's neighbor agreed.

    "If I was in the same situation ... I hope I could've done the same thing," said Bryan Sklar, 45.

    But Gadson's grandmother, Rosa Jones, said: "He ain't no hero. He is a murderer and God will serve justice."

    She and her husband, Ivory Jones, pastor of a Fort Lauderdale church, sat on their front porch in Fort Lauderdale on Thursday wondering how a man could shoot two people and not go to jail.

    They said their grandson sometimes hung with the wrong crowd but never got into legal trouble. According to the Florida Department of Law Enforcement, he has no arrest record. They said Gadson, who never finished high school, got tired of low-wage jobs and was pursuing his GED.

    Arrindell, friends said, found himself in a similar situation: no high school diploma and working odd jobs. So he went back to school. He was a man with past troubles, including a 2004 arrest for carrying a concealed weapon, but he was improving his life, they said. He recently bought a car and had a girlfriend.

    Kathy East, 54, whose son went to school with Arrindell, said she took him in two years ago when he and his mother had a falling out.

    "I'm absolutely stunned," she said Thursday.

    Staff Researchers Barbara Hijek and William Lucey contributed to this report.
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    Quote Originally Posted by DaSharkie View Post
    What kills me is that family of these two guys think the guy should have just sat there and obliged their criminal action. Unfreakingbelievable!


    But Gadson's grandmother, Rosa Jones, said: "He ain't no hero. He is a murderer and God will serve justice."

    She and her husband, Ivory Jones, pastor of a Fort Lauderdale church, sat on their front porch in Fort Lauderdale on Thursday wondering how a man could shoot two people and not go to jail.

    They said their grandson sometimes hung with the wrong crowd but never got into legal trouble. According to the Florida Department of Law Enforcement, he has no arrest record. They said Gadson, who never finished high school, got tired of low-wage jobs and was pursuing his GED.

    Arrindell, friends said, found himself in a similar situation: no high school diploma and working odd jobs. So he went back to school. He was a man with past troubles, including a 2004 arrest for carrying a concealed weapon, but he was improving his life, they said. He recently bought a car and had a girlfriend.

    Kathy East, 54, whose son went to school with Arrindell, said she took him in two years ago when he and his mother had a falling out.

    "I'm absolutely stunned," she said Thursday.
    I'm absolutely stunned that these people don't think armed robbery is "getting in trouble" and "improving his life" includes committing armed robbery and that both alleged perps shouldn't be held accountable for their CRIMES!!
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    Mr. Lovell needs to return to the range and practice some more- one of the perps is still alive.

    WELL DONE MARINE!
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    Quote Originally Posted by FWDbuff View Post
    Mr. Lovell needs to return to the range and practice some more- one of the perps is still alive.
    LOL

    Now we get to pay for his incarceration.
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    Quote Originally Posted by FWDbuff View Post
    Mr. Lovell needs to return to the range and practice some more- one of the perps is still alive.
    Funny, that was my first thought as well...

    Chalk up another one in favor of the 2nd Amendment -- good for Mr. Lovell!
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    Good story Sharkie. I love it when the tables are turned on no good skells. Seems to me that these "choir boys" got tired of low wage jobs and decided to try and take the easy way to getting some money, by preying on innocent people. I'm sure this probably wasn't the first crime they committed, but it will certainly be the last for at least one of them, too bad not both.. Good job Marine!!

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    Jesus. I hate to say it, but what are we going to do when all these WW2 era old timers are gone? I just read the other article about the 72 year old man who beat the snot out of a guy less than half his age for trying to take something that didn't belong to him. That was kind of funny. The senior citizens are the last surving remnants of a time when it was socially acceptable to defend yourself. Those were the good old days.

    As for the family, you could expect them to be upset over the loss of their son, but they should have realized that they lost him a long time ago. I'm talking about bad parenting, that's what this is a result of. It is obvious that no one ever taught these young punks the difference between right and wrong.
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    I'm having flashbacks to an episode of JAG, where a former SEAL came home, had a kid, retired, and all of that. He and the kids mom had a falling out, he ended up on the street, and so on.

    Well, he watches over his son as he's growing up, and one day, his kid is in a store, when these two punks like this, come in, and pull guns to rob the place. Well, the ex-SEAL, does what he's trained to do. He comes in, takes em both out, and in the process kills them.

    He ends up on trial for murder, and the defense was quite simple. He was someone we as a society trained to defend us, in our times of need. We literally did put a gun in his hand, and say, when people in America are in danger, eliminate that threat. Same thing with this Marine. He was simply defending himself, and the rest of the American people in a manner of speaking. We trained him to do a job, he did it, and now some poeple aren't happy about it. Oh well, he wasn't shooting innocent kids, or innocent adults. He shot two people who had guns, and were robbing a subway. One of whom than forced him into a bathroom at gunpoint. I don't know about you, but to me, that says I'm about to be killed. I don't think I have problems with this being a justified shooting.

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    Wow,

    You got owned by a 71 year old ex-Marine, and you have the nerve to cry about it?


    I feel for the fellow that got shot and his buddy that was killed. I don't know thier story, but no matter the "reason" for the offence, you raise a weapon against someone in the course of a criminal act, you deserve whatever comes to you.

    Good Job Marine!
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    Good shootin' Marine. God Bless Ya!

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    The dark humour army side of me kicked in when I read "seven shots", "once in the head and once in the stomach", and "hit in the chest". That accounts for three.... Back to the range for additional practice passed through my mind too.... but I dont think I'd say that out loud without first meeting the man!

    I still dont support the call for carrying of concealed weapons, but this time it worked out.
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    OUT F**KING STANDING MARINE!!!

    God bless you. We need more like you. You defended yourself and all others that were in that store that day.

    And he doesn't need to go to the range, (he's a damn marine) he did that on purpose. Wanted to play with him a little and practice his tracking skills.

    I am all for concealed weapon permits. All it does is arm the good guys and the ones who can handle it. The bad guys already carry them and don't care if they can handle it or if they have a permit. Bet the bad guy would think twice about attacking someone if they knew they were armed.

    Hell, that's the only reason the USSR never invaded the US. They knew that at a moments notice we could load up a 78 Caddy Eldorado with 15 snuff chewing rednecks with guns blazing!!
    Last edited by Dickey; 07-03-2007 at 07:50 PM.
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    Rosa Jones is an idiot.

    Thank God for the United States Marine Corps.

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    Live by the gun. Die by the gun.

    Won't be loosing any sleep over this, and nor will I expect Mr Lovell.
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    Had a situation in the city near me just a week or so ago.

    Cops go to serve a search warrant on a suspected drug house. As cops are on the porch, other officers are at windows. Porch cops holler out that they are the police, have a warrant, demand entry, etc. One of the window cops sees a guy look through the window, moving towards the door with his trigger finger on his handgun. Window cop has a split second decision, and rightly decides to open fire.

    Upshot of the whole deal: Cops find guns, drugs, money, and associated bad stuff. Dead guy's gun safety was off, he was ready to play.

    Family of dead guy has filed suit with the PD, whining about wrongful death, a promising, misunderstood young man and all of that crap.

    Yeah, it is possible the dead guy might have thought other druggies had come to rob him and were faking being cops, but let's be honest: You are in a drug house. You are surrounded with drugs, guns, money, you associate with known criminals and those who knowingly engage in criminal behavior. At any time you can choose of your own free will to get up and leave the house and go somewhere safe. You choose, instead, to stay, and carry a loaded weapon ready to fire. You clearly are expecting something to happen. So why the f would anyone surprised when it does? You played, you lost.

    Boo f'n hoo.

    By the way, excellent job, Marine!
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    Quote Originally Posted by ElectricHoser View Post
    Had a situation in the city near me just a week or so ago.

    Cops go to serve a search warrant on a suspected drug house. As cops are on the porch, other officers are at windows. Porch cops holler out that they are the police, have a warrant, demand entry, etc. One of the window cops sees a guy look through the window, moving towards the door with his trigger finger on his handgun. Window cop has a split second decision, and rightly decides to open fire.

    Upshot of the whole deal: Cops find guns, drugs, money, and associated bad stuff. Dead guy's gun safety was off, he was ready to play.

    Family of dead guy has filed suit with the PD, whining about wrongful death, a promising, misunderstood young man and all of that crap.

    Yeah, it is possible the dead guy might have thought other druggies had come to rob him and were faking being cops, but let's be honest: You are in a drug house. You are surrounded with drugs, guns, money, you associate with known criminals and those who knowingly engage in criminal behavior. At any time you can choose of your own free will to get up and leave the house and go somewhere safe. You choose, instead, to stay, and carry a loaded weapon ready to fire. You clearly are expecting something to happen. So why the f would anyone surprised when it does? You played, you lost.

    Boo f'n hoo.

    By the way, excellent job, Marine!

    Yeah, it's crazy - all the restrictions the boys in blue have placed on them. I mean, aside from the fact L.E. doesn't pay (escpecially not in my area), cops also still have a lot of stressful decisions to make, many are split-second. Maybe that officer who shot through the window started to doubt himself after the lawsuit was brought forth. What's worse, he will probably not make a decision like that in the future, and the guy coming to the door may be the one to shoot first through the windows at the cops outside.

    Sometimes it seems like a civilian can get away with doing the right thing easier than an officer of the law.
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    Quote Originally Posted by johnny46 View Post
    Rosa Jones is an idiot.
    That's as ********* a remark as I've ever seen here or anywhere else.

    The woman lost her grandson. Her remarks may be unrealistic but it wouldn't be the first time a grandmother had too rosy an image of her grandson. Your grandmother probably thinks you're incapable of doing any wrong either.

    Lighten up.
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    That's as ********* a remark as I've ever seen here or anywhere else.
    I disagree, it's her comments and the media continuing to print this drivel that continue the myth that these criminals are somehow victims. Just maybe if grandma would have raised her kids right, then they raised their kids right, this crap wouldn't happen. You hang out with the wrong crowd, bad things happen. God did dish out justice, right through a Marine.
    Until society can place blame where it belongs, solely on the shoulders of the criminal, this crap will continue to happen.
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    Got to give props to the state of Florida for having the "self defense without the duty to retreat". At least one Bush did something right. Thankfully Ohio has within the last couple of years started to allow conceal carry. But we are a retreat state, which could just get yourself farther into trouble. Three hits out of seven shot to me seems about right. Look at how many time we see or hear of police shootouts where for more than 7 shots are fired to only have one or two hits. Would anybody want to take bets on how many times granndma or the parents have bailed their angel out of trouble before this happened. If they did it done him alot of good.
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    I'd bet the guy will have to defend himself against a wrongful death suit in civil court. It wouldn't be the first time a criminal's family has sued. Even if there may be zero chance of winning, he'll have to pay for an attorney to represent him.

    At least he's alive to be sued.
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    Unfortunately Steamer you probably correct.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steamer View Post
    At least he's alive to be sued.
    It's a cleche, but it is true:

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    I'm sick and tired of people complaining when others do their damn job. Was it not too long ago that a black city council member stated that cops should shoot people in the leg or arm, not to kill while they themselves are being shot at to kill.

    I'm sorry. The lady is probably upset because her baby was killed. But, realize that the "baby" was a man and he was robbing somebody. Welcome to real life.... people die because of that.

    A lady is suing one of the local fire departments because during the recent flooding, they werent able to rescue her baby. They tried but werent able to and she is claiming that they did not do all that they could. So, because her baby was stupid enough to be out driving in flood water, the local FD is getting a lawsuit.

    And now, that poor marine will probably be taken to court for defending himself. Such a sad sad world

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    Default another day in paradise

    Just another regular day in South Florida. I worked and lived in Plantation for several years. Lovely place to live if you have to live in Broward County. Not to many places are as safe and beautiful....if that tells ya anything about Fort Lauderale. Thank God I don't live in South Florida anymore.

    Thank you for being there Marine. Thank you for being brave and standing up to those out of control youth. You done good.

    (he doesn't need to be told that though, he knows it in his soul : )

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    My grandmother would have been the second in line(after Pops,my Grandfather)to whip my axe if I'd pulled anything like this.My parents would have come after that.
    Granted Moms and Grandmothers will think of their children and Grands as perfect angels but if your son/grandson/daughter or what ever relation they are is always coming and going at odd hours,has money coming out of every pocket but doesn't talk about what they do to earn it or show a check stub,wouldn't that be a tip that something wasn't exactly right?
    My mother was robbed the other day,the people that did it ran up $1500 in charges on tvs before Mom got her credit card shut off.If they're caught,I am sure their lawyer will wail about how impoverished they've been in life and that we shouldn't jail them for stealing.
    That's BS.My Mom grew up during the Depression when they weren't always sure if there was going to be food on the table every day.They had to work to eat. Her brother and sisters didn't turn to stealing to buy luxuries like TVs and claimed it was because life dealt them a bad hand that they did it.
    If I get held accountable for my actions,why shouldn't everyone else?

    Quote Originally Posted by DeputyMarshal View Post
    That's as ********* a remark as I've ever seen here or anywhere else.

    The woman lost her grandson. Her remarks may be unrealistic but it wouldn't be the first time a grandmother had too rosy an image of her grandson. Your grandmother probably thinks you're incapable of doing any wrong either.

    Lighten up.

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