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Thread: Barry Bonds

  1. #21
    Forum Member Raughammer1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frmboybuck View Post
    I didnt say he never has....What im saying he is innocent till proven guilty. Supposedly Conseco has some dirt on A-rod in his next book.....Maybe he will be the next victim of the juice. Ill say it again, Bonds isnt stupid or he would have been caught by now and his career would have ended long ago.
    And yet A-rod is kicking butt in hitting homeruns... even in the "new non steroid" era.

    Go figure...

    Conseco is and was a blow hard. Just a has-been trying to get some of the lime-light his betters are still soaking up.


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    Quote Originally Posted by GeorgeWendtCFI View Post
    Look what happened to Sosa. He stopped (obvious body mass loss and strength loss) and was not even close to being the player he was. Do I honestly think Bonds is still using steroids. Let's see. How can I put this?

    YES!
    I couldn't agree more. Looking at Barry's career stats, it's convenient that his homerun tallies are dropping dramatically since congress and MLB got on the steroid scandal was made public.

    I also agree with Rum, if they let this record stand they need to let Pete in the HOF!

  3. #23
    Forum Member DaSharkie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raughammer1 View Post
    Gross exaggeration.
    If you say so. Research it. It may not be half - I am sure an illustrious and great person such as yourself does not use common phrases in normal conversation. I should strive such a magnificent person as you.

    Quote Originally Posted by Raughammer1 View Post
    Theoretical hypothetical suppositionÖ. Projecting your inadequacies on others? They are doing something you canít do, so they must be cheating? Weak man...
    I have no inadequacies. I deal with myself as I am. I do not wish to be a professional, overpaid crybaby athlete. Things are done all the time in high school college, and professional athletics. You adapt to everything that is thrown in your way. One need only look back through history to see people whose medals were stripped after testing positive.

    Quote Originally Posted by Raughammer1 View Post
    Even more horse do-hockey! LOL, 2002 I weighed 174 pounds, in 2005 I weighed in a 222 pounds and benched 365 for 8 reps and could bench 425 twice. Steroids? LOL, no, though other pencil neck wannabes would like to believe that. Simply because someone else did it, and they cant do it, the other guy must be "cheating". I figured out nutrition, I figured out how to work out for mass and what and how much to eat for mass, I figured out how much rest and recuperation I needed and I responded very well to the work out plan I was following. Yea... this was when I was 37 up to 39 years old.
    Your accusatory statements are just all wet as well as being all wrong.
    Stick to fighting fires because you know next to nothing about modern day nutrition and physiology.
    The vast majority of people out there are no capable of doing this. You have no freaking idea what I do for a living and how much I know about physiology. You can adapt your body to anything, but like I said in my original post - most people are not going to be able to do this.

    Alas, you are a holier than thou and such a magnificent human specimen. I should bow down, kiss your arse, and strive to be as great and wonderful as you in every way.

    Quote Originally Posted by Raughammer1 View Post
    Well you should be talking about supplements, vitamins and weight training; the right mix can really help your body to respond. Before 2005 pro hormones like andro and nor-19 were legal over the counter supplements available at GNC and yes, I used them. (Though the eating and rest were more important than all of the supplements combined). Yes the body can "only get so big" in normal circumstances, but "how big" is different for everyone. Your hypothetical statements ring hollow, empty and just wrong to someone who has been there done that. Basically your denying his accomplishments with your opinions based upon limited information and limited experiences is just worthless ponderings by someone who does not have a clue of what he is talking about.
    I am not denying his accomplishments. I am questioning them. I do not watch professional sports in any manner. I do not envy these opverpaid athletes.

    And you are so amazingly quick to belittle me for what reason? What in the hell did I do to you to deserve your pathetically immature namecalling and suppositions about me? Because I called into question someone's ability to do these things without illegal assistance?

    Quote Originally Posted by Raughammer1 View Post
    So says you... someone who does not know a dang thing about the mans personal motivations or how his body responds to: modern day nutrition, a professional trainer and nutritionist, to modern day methods of body building strength training. You, someone on the outside looking in, speaks of someone you really know almost nothing about. You base your perceptions on shallow judgmental calls built upon ignorance and ignorant opinion.
    Weak...man, weak.
    Uh huh. Again, you insult me and belittle me while offering absolutely no evidence to counter what I said. And you call me weak.

    Quote Originally Posted by Raughammer1 View Post
    At least the blind squirrel got something right in all this rambling, he (you) admitted you judge even when you suspect, like in the Barry bonds case. He is innocent until proven guilty. The record is his and no amount of pontificating by an internet blow hard can take that away from him.
    As I said, more personal insults. To what do I deserve this honor?

    Innocent until proven guilty only matters in a court of law. A cliche? Yes. However it is true.

    Quote Originally Posted by Raughammer1 View Post
    LOL, "if" being the key word, you are jumping the gun and pronouncing guilt with no hard evidence other than circumstantial and hypothetical. Just a lot of he said-she said.
    Weak....
    Circumstantial evidence is all that is needed in a court of law. Again, we are not in a court of law.

    I suppose such a magnificent, self loving specimen such as yourself has never prejudged anyone without knowing each and every detail that there is to know.

    Oh to be perfect like you.

    Quote Originally Posted by Raughammer1 View Post
    Yea...yea you are. You are when you judge with out having facts to back you up. Yea, you are when you make erroneous statements about things like strength training and body building that you obviously know next to nothing about.
    I know more than you think. Alas, you have already judged me because you have closed your mind to any differing opinion than yours.

    But you know everything, or at least a self avowed expert and I should just bow down to you because you can lift 400 pounds. Yipty freaking do.
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  4. #24
    Forum Member Raughammer1's Avatar
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    Smile what a hoot!

    Quote Originally Posted by DaSharkie View Post
    If you say so. Research it. It may not be half - I am sure an illustrious and great person such as yourself does not use common phrases in normal conversation. I should strive such a magnificent person as you.
    Dude, youíre the one who said "half"...and thatís wrong. Just like your assertion that no one can put on 50 pounds of muscle with out: ďassistanceĒ.
    You were in error...

    I have no inadequacies. I deal with myself as I am. I do not wish to be a professional, overpaid crybaby athlete.
    LOL, you cant do what they can do, much less than what Barry Bonds has done, so you label them "over paid cry babies". F-U-N-N-Y


    Things are done all the time in high school college, and professional athletics. You adapt to everything that is thrown in your way. One need only look back through history to see people whose medals were stripped after testing positive.
    ďThingsĒ? WhatÖĒthingsĒ?

    Hey, once again youíre the one who used the descriptor: "half". Just because SOME are busted, you paint them as "half" or that it happens "all the time".
    An underachiever baggin' on an over achiever: Sorry man, but thatís the way it comes across.


    The vast majority of people out there are no capable of doing this.
    So says YOU. That YOU have not done it, you try and bolster your claims that NONE (i.e: damned near impossible) can do it by now diminishing it to "the vast majority of people".
    Ok man, what ever you say. (wink-wink)


    You have no freaking idea what I do for a living and how much I know about physiology.
    I know that you have made wildly erroneous claims on physiology and body building and strength training that are grossly mistaken. THAT I do know...
    I know from your posts on here you are not a professional athlete, heck to hear you say it they are all over-paid crybabies. (roll eyes)


    You can adapt your body to anything,
    Oh "I" can but Barry, a multi-millionaire who has the services of professionals cannot? Your logic escapes me...


    but like I said in my original post - most people are not going to be able to do this.
    I guess "most" includes world class superior athletes who have the best of what the worlds of nutrition and advice/training available to them at their disposal. "I" can do it, but "they" canít...LOL, sorry, but man, that just does not compute.

    Alas, you are a holier than thou and such a magnificent human specimen. I should bow down, kiss your arse, and strive to be as great and wonderful as you in every way.
    I would not go so far as to recommend that, i WOULD recommend you not to make wildly wrong claims about things you obviously know Jack-squat about.
    But I guess that would have about the same chance of happening as the bending down and kissing plan you proposed.
    But, hey, I like your thinking! A mans gotta have goals and what not. :-)

    I am not denying his accomplishments.
    Ok man, your denying his accomplishments as being "valid". Does that suit your semantics better?

    I am questioning them. I do not watch professional sports in any manner.
    Yet you feel adequate to be judge, jury and executioner in demeaning Mr. Bonds accomplishments as nothing more than cheating.
    Ok... what ever you say amigo.

    I do not envy these opverpaid athletes.
    Suuuure you donít. Alas, over here your words and rants suggest differently.... Hey, Iím just sayin' :-)


    And you are so amazingly quick to belittle me for what reason?
    Perhaps it was your complete ignorance in making the accusations you made earlier, or perhaps it was from your exaggerated claims of fully ďhalfĒ of a sports participants are cheaters, or was it from your judging the man (BB) for accomplishing what no one else has ever done and not providing any reason I should take your words seriously, perhaps it was just your arrogant attitude, *shrug* I donít know...I figured if the man was not here to defend himself, I would do the honors.
    I felt you were out of bounds in your words and assertions and hey.. its a free country...what comes around goes around.

    What in the hell did I do to you to deserve your pathetically immature namecalling and suppositions about me?
    Awww, now that your words are called into question, your inflammatory remarks about a man not here to defend himself are challenged you are going to get all mad? Dude, man up, dont cry, it's going to be all right. You'll see...tomorrow will be a brand new day. Wipe those tears and take some deep breaths. It'll all be ok...
    Because I called into question someone's ability to do these things without illegal assistance?
    Because tacitly you called the man a cheater, said it was "damned near impossible" to muscle up like he has..so yea, I suppose thatís why I challenged your diatribe on Barry Bonds.
    Uh huh. Again, you insult me and belittle me while offering absolutely no evidence to counter what I said. And you call me weak.
    LOL, um, I offered my own physiological changes that are on par with what you said was "darned near impossible". Hey youíre the one tearing down someone and getting all hurt that a fella on the internet checked you, and thatís, well: weak.
    Innocent until proven guilty only matters in a court of law. A cliche? Yes. However it is true.
    Sorry, but to many of us it is a maxim many Americans hold dear...whether in a court of law or in the court of public opinion.

    Circumstantial evidence is all that is needed in a court of law. Again, we are not in a court of law.
    Oh yea.. thatís right we ARE in your "court of public opinion " the same court that said "Paris should go free", "OJ was innocent" and "Clinton did not have sex with that woman". (sorry man but this is some funny stuff watching you get all worked up over someone challenging your pontifications)
    I suppose such a magnificent, self loving specimen such as yourself has never prejudged anyone without knowing each and every detail that there is to know.
    I suppose I have not on such a public stage such as your self...
    Oh to be perfect like you.
    LOL, like I said: "a man should have goals". ;-)

    I know more than you think. Alas, you have already judged me because you have closed your mind to any differing opinion than yours.
    Fella, I have only judged you on your words and your mistaken assertions. You put it out there; donít be surprised when folks call you on it.
    But you know everything, or at least a self avowed expert and I should just bow down to you because you can lift 400 pounds. Yipty freaking do.
    What a hoot! Dude, donít bow, just stop making inflammatory comments about folks when you donít have all the facts. People will call you on it when you do....
    But still, thatís no reason to cry about it. 
    Last edited by Raughammer1; 08-12-2007 at 09:00 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Frmboybuck View Post
    I didnt say he never has....What im saying he is innocent till proven guilty. Supposedly Conseco has some dirt on A-rod in his next book.....Maybe he will be the next victim of the juice. Ill say it again, Bonds isnt stupid or he would have been caught by now and his career would have ended long ago.
    There is an enormous difference between being an unindicted co=conspirator and some nut job like Conseco "having dirt" on you. Conseco surfaces every time he is broke. He is mentally unstable and is about as unreliable as they come.

    I'll say it again. It is my opinon that Bonds is juicing today. Right this very minute.

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    Look at physiques in the Olympic games Mark McGuire and the HR champ Mark McGuire. Look at rookie Jason Giambi and today's Jason Giambi. Tell me they were not on something.

    Another thing. Look at A-Rd. A-Rod has the same physique today that he did when he hit his first HR. Not all HR hitters are juicing.

  7. #27
    Forum Member DaSharkie's Avatar
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    Didn't cry, don't care about sports. You are jaded and blinded by your own greatness.

    I don't care if I get called on what I say. If I am wrong I am worng. Life goes on.

    And the reason I call professional athletes crybabies is because many cry when they called on whining that 8 million a year is not enough, they go on strike because they aren't paid enough, or whatever reason.


    You will think what you think, I will think what I think. We will see what happens.

    But again, I am just weak to you since I can't lift 400 pounds. One's ego does not have to weigh that much.
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  8. #28
    Forum Member DaSharkie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GeorgeWendtCFI View Post
    Look at physiques in the Olympic games Mark McGuire and the HR champ Mark McGuire. Look at rookie Jason Giambi and today's Jason Giambi. Tell me they were not on something.

    Another thing. Look at A-Rd. A-Rod has the same physique today that he did when he hit his first HR. Not all HR hitters are juicing.
    No George. Everyone of these 40 and near-40 year olds have done it naturally. Just ask our all knowing co-poster.
    "Too many people spend money they haven't earned, to buy things they don't want, to impress people they don't like." Will Rogers

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    "As Americans we must always remember that we all have a common enemy, an enemy that is dangerous, powerful and relentless. I refer, of course, to the federal government." - Dave Barry

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  9. #29
    Disillusioned Subscriber Steamer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DeSharkie
    You think Bonds or any athlete that has bulked up over 50 pounds of muscle while in their late 20s - 40s and has not had assistance you are nuts. It is damned near physiologically impossible to do.
    When Shark made the above comment, you responded wilth:
    Quote Originally Posted by Raughammer1
    Even more horse do-hockey! LOL, 2002 I weighed 174 pounds, in 2005 I weighed in a 222 pounds and benched 365 for 8 reps and could bench 425 twice. Steroids? LOL, no, though other pencil neck wannabes would like to believe that. Simply because someone else did it, and they cant do it, the other guy must be "cheating".
    Then you went on to say:
    Quote Originally Posted by Raughammer1
    Well you should be talking about supplements, vitamins and weight training; the right mix can really help your body to respond. Before 2005 pro hormones like andro and nor-19 were legal over the counter supplements available at GNC and yes, I used them.
    Considering that prohormones like Andro were made a controlled substance along with anabolic steroids under the Anabolic Steroid Control Act of 2004, aren't they in fact "assistance" as referenced by Sharkie? Not to mention that they ultimately result in increased testosterone levels, as is the goal of anabolic steroids. Seems pretty clear that they are "assistance". In light of the fact they are now illegal and their posession is a Federal crime, coupled with their sale being banned by the FDA due to health hazards very similar to steroids, I don't see much validity to the claim that they are simply "supplements". Along that line, it seems your claim of bulking unassisted seems at best to be disingenuous, and your experience as an exemplar to Bonds' "unassisted" bulking wholly irrelevant.

    I'd say Shark's observation was pretty much spot on.

  10. #30
    Forum Member Raughammer1's Avatar
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    Default wow...

    Quote Originally Posted by DaSharkie View Post
    Didn't cry, don't care about sports. You are jaded and blinded by your own greatness.

    But again, I am just weak to you since I can't lift 400 pounds. One's ego does not have to weigh that much.
    Oh man, this is rich.

    Fella, its ok, man, i am sorry, i did not mean to upset you so. I honestly had no idea you were that fragile.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DaSharkie View Post
    No George. Everyone of these 40 and near-40 year olds have done it naturally. Just ask our all knowing co-poster.
    LOL, man talk about hitting a nerve! Whooo hooo!

    Fella YOUR the one using the absolutes like "all" and "everyone" and "happens all the time" and "HALF of all bikers".
    Ahh thats ok you can project on me your failings. Hey, if it makes you feel better, you go right on ahead and fire away.

    Man, talk about fragile.

  12. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steamer View Post
    Considering that prohormones like Andro were made a controlled substance along with anabolic steroids under the Anabolic Steroid Control Act of 2004, aren't they in fact "assistance" as referenced by Sharkie?
    heck i have no idea, i asked that same question pretty much, i never got an answer from ol sharkie. My response would have been they were 100% legal when Macguire and i both were using them. They were over the counter supplements sold at every GNC in America.

    Hey man, if you want to consider that "cheating" with ol Shark dance, you are more than welcome to it.


    Not to mention that they ultimately result in increased testosterone levels, as is the goal of anabolic steroids.
    Ultimately they sure do, just not in any where near the level of steroids or do they follow the same ways of getting there. Pro-hormones had to be changed by the body to raise testosterone levels, steroids just go right at it.
    It is similar to comparing fire crackers to TNT. Sure both do the same thing: Explode. But one is FAR more destructive than the other.

    Seems pretty clear that they are "assistance".
    LOL, heck, so is a spotter.
    (dang it... time to go home... see you guys tommorrow!)
    Keep the grins on... lol, ...later guys.

  13. #33
    Forum Member MemphisE34a's Avatar
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    Who really cares either way??

    I don't dislike Barry Bonds because he has or has not ever used steroids. I dislike him because he comes off like an arrogant F'ing ***** who does not care about his fellow players, the fans, or even the game. He seems to care only about Barry; he shouldn't be surprised that he is the only one that does.
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    Quote Originally Posted by MemphisE34a View Post
    Who really cares either way??

    I don't dislike Barry Bonds because he has or has not ever used steroids. I dislike him because he comes off like an arrogant F'ing ***** who does not care about his fellow players, the fans, or even the game. He seems to care only about Barry; he shouldn't be surprised that he is the only one that does.
    You're intitled to your opinion Robert. I, growing up in NorCal have attended quite a few Giants games and I can say this about Barry Bonds. He is a baseball player in the truest sense of the word. He does not "sell" his name to video games or those jayhawking pro-autograph dealers who try to make a fast buck off his name. He does not want fame, the record is for him personally and for the loyal Giants fans who attend the games. I have seen him on more than one occaision give one of his personal bats to a child in the stands. He has given countless baseballs to kids in the stands all with the promise that they will never sell the ball. He will invite kids out to watch batting practice then give them pointers off to the side. Barry bonds loves baseball and he is no sellout. He cares for the team. Hell he was willing to take a paycut if necessary just so the team could aquire A-Rod if it went that far. I'm probably not making a dent with you or anyone else who is a Bonds hater, but the press is only going to let you see what they want you to see.
    IAFF

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    Quote Originally Posted by Raughammer1 View Post
    Oh man, this is rich.

    Fella, its ok, man, i am sorry, i did not mean to upset you so. I honestly had no idea you were that fragile.
    Not fragile. Couldn't care less what people think of me. Life is too short.

    Like I said, you are wonderful enough to have never used common phrasing and comments in your massive linguistic library.

    We should all want to be as magnificent as you.
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    Quote Originally Posted by snowball View Post
    You're intitled to your opinion Robert. I, growing up in NorCal have attended quite a few Giants games and I can say this about Barry Bonds. He is a baseball player in the truest sense of the word. He does not "sell" his name to video games or those jayhawking pro-autograph dealers who try to make a fast buck off his name. He does not want fame, the record is for him personally and for the loyal Giants fans who attend the games. I have seen him on more than one occaision give one of his personal bats to a child in the stands. He has given countless baseballs to kids in the stands all with the promise that they will never sell the ball. He will invite kids out to watch batting practice then give them pointers off to the side. Barry bonds loves baseball and he is no sellout. He cares for the team. Hell he was willing to take a paycut if necessary just so the team could aquire A-Rod if it went that far. I'm probably not making a dent with you or anyone else who is a Bonds hater, but the press is only going to let you see what they want you to see.
    That is an excellent commentary "snowball" on Barry Bonds, thanks for sharing your different perspective on the man.

    Though I doubt your words will change many opinions, I enjoyed reading them none the less.

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    Quote Originally Posted by snowball View Post
    You're intitled to your opinion Robert. I, growing up in NorCal have attended quite a few Giants games and I can say this about Barry Bonds. He is a baseball player in the truest sense of the word. He does not "sell" his name to video games or those jayhawking pro-autograph dealers who try to make a fast buck off his name. He does not want fame, the record is for him personally and for the loyal Giants fans who attend the games. I have seen him on more than one occaision give one of his personal bats to a child in the stands. He has given countless baseballs to kids in the stands all with the promise that they will never sell the ball. He will invite kids out to watch batting practice then give them pointers off to the side. Barry bonds loves baseball and he is no sellout. He cares for the team. Hell he was willing to take a paycut if necessary just so the team could aquire A-Rod if it went that far. I'm probably not making a dent with you or anyone else who is a Bonds hater, but the press is only going to let you see what they want you to see.

    I do not hate Barry Bonds. But I believe there is ample information to suggest that he cheated. IMO, he does not deserve the record because it was not attained honestly.

    He may be everything you say. But he cheated.

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    It's a number in a book, what does it really have to do with anything important in life?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bones42 View Post
    It's a number in a book, what does it really have to do with anything important in life?
    It doesn't. But too many people's lives revolve around sports and "professional" athletes.
    "Too many people spend money they haven't earned, to buy things they don't want, to impress people they don't like." Will Rogers

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    "No man's life, liberty, or property are safe while the legislature is in session." - New York Judge Gideon Tucker

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